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I have an '05 tundra with the 4.7 engine. Replaced the

I have an '05 tundra...
I have an '05 tundra with the 4.7 engine. Replaced the timing belt, idlers, tensioner, water pump, thermostat. All back together, put in about a 1.5 gal antifreeze. Started right up. It ran at high idle for a minute or two then dropped to normal idle. It sounded great, very quiet compared to before changing out the belt. I was topping up the radiator while it was running. It ran at normal idle for a few more minutes then quit. Like someone had turned the key off. Will not restart. The starter does not run. Just a faint click when I turn the key. Every thing else works fine. Battery is good.
It will restart fine after an hour or so. I suspect a cooling problem. Have purged the system of air and have removed the thermostat to get more flow going. Still turns off at water temp of 117deg F. I thinking a sensor may be at fault. Did I not hook up all of them? Did I damage one? What would cause this situation.
JA: How many miles are on the timing belt? Have you ever had to change it before?
Customer: Not since I bought it at 66k. It now has 140k. The belt and water pump I took out were not factory so they had been replaced before.
JA: Are you fixing your Tundra yourself? What have you tried so far?
Customer: Yes, I have been trying to purge "burp" the coolant system. I assume the computer is shutting the engine down for some reason. It's like someone just turned the key off.
JA: Anything else you want the mechanic to know before I connect you?
Customer: That's the whole story.
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Answered in 49 minutes by:
11/2/2017
Ted Ritter
Ted Ritter, Toyota Master Tech
Category: Toyota
Satisfied Customers: 4,490
Experience: Toyota Master Tech, ASE Certified
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T​hanks for posting, after it does start back up does the check engine light stay on? Do you have a diagnostic code reader?

Are there any diagnostic codes?

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
No check engine light. No codes. I have a reader. water temp is around 115F when it quits
Customer reply replied 1 month ago
The truck has always run great. This problem must be related to the belt/water pump replacement. It still runs fine, just not for long.
Customer reply replied 1 month ago
I did pressure wash the engine and compartment just before I started the work.

T​hanks for the reply, it must be either losing ignition (spark at the plugs) or possibly the computer is shutting the injectors off but with no codes present it's hard to determine, can you check to see if it's losing spark right after this happens? Check injector pulse voltage at one of the injectors? Re check all ground connections that may have been removed, make sure the wire from the crank position sensor did not get pinched where it comers up through the opening at the front of the engine, I've seen this happen quite a few times.

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Will check as recommended. But, when it stops running it will NOT crank again, starter does not run, until some time has passed. When it does crank the engine always starts right up.

Ok, I think I misunderstood, I thought the engine was cranking but not firing up. Is there any clicking type of noise when it won't start? What I'm wondering about is why it stops running which seems to have nothing to do with the starter circuit.

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
When it won't crank, when I turn the key to the ON position I hear a click, relay possibly. Turning the key to start I hear nothing. Crank position sensor may be pinched. I cannot be certain yet. May have to remove the AC compressor.

I​f you have an ohm meter check the resistance of the crank sensor at the connector higher up, measuring across there should be about 400 ohms or so then check each terminal to ground there should be no continuity to ground.

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Hmmm, where is the "connector higher up" I cannot find it.
Customer reply replied 1 month ago
would a crank sensor fault cause these symptoms and would it cause a fault code?

Yes it will cause a fault code or at least it should, let me just review this for a minute:

when the engine is cold it starts up and runs until it just warms up (around 115 dwgrees) then it shuts off and the engine will not turn over (crank) until it's cooled off again, do I have that correct?

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Is there any kind of an aftermarket alarm installed?

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Not to my knowledge. What would that be?

Just asking if there is anything non factory installed. I'm going to have to opt out because I have never come across aproblem like this please be patient another expert may have some idea.

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
OK, thanks
Customer reply replied 1 month ago
BTY, the code reader reports "4 not ready". My reader does not tell me what they are.
Toyota Service
Toyota Service, Toyota Expert
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Experience: 30+ Yrs of auto experience, Award Winning Svc. Manager; Just Answer Customer's Choice Award Winner
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Hello. Different expert here. Do you still need assistance on this request? Perhaps I can assist.

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Oh yes, do you have the history?

Yes. I have read my your input here with my colleague. I suspect a starter issue; a coolant issue would not cause this. Here is what I recommend: Duplicate the no-start condition. When the starter does not spin the engine over, keep trying to start the engine rapidly by turning the key to start, off, and back to start 30-40 times. If the engine starts to spin over, the contacts inside the starter solenoid are worn out.

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Start not stat. Sorry for the typo

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
I'll try that but the bigger problem is why it stops in the first place. Any ideas there?

On this engine, the starter is located under the intake manifold. Heat soak from the engine, coupled with worn starter contacts will cause this issue; we have observed this many times in the shop. Removing the starter is a very large job, as the intake needs to come off to get to the starter.

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
OK, but why does the engine stop after running only a few minutes. As soon as it warms up a little it just shuts off. No stutter, shudder, nothing. Like the key was turned off. That is the primary issue. Not the restarting.

With that being said, I suspect a ground issue. Assuming you do not have any crank position codes or cam position codes, a loss of the main ground to either the engine of the computer will cause this. I would check the battery connections, the battery negative-to-frame connection, and the wire that is located on the back of the engine form the engine room wire harness. If that wire is loose, corroded or otherwise compromised, the computer will not have a ground. Also, your alternator needs to be producing over 10.5 volts DC. The computer will shut down if the input voltage is less than 10.5 volts.

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
OK, I'll check those items in the morning. Will let you know what I find. Thanks

Ok. I will be back online tomorrow after 7 PM east coast time.

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Ok I checked the grounds and all is good. Could it be a relay disengaging? I checked the EFI relay and it was still engaged after the engine shut off. Any other relays I should check or is that idea a dead end?
Customer reply replied 1 month ago
This most recent run the temp got up to about 185 before it shut off.
Customer reply replied 1 month ago
I also blew out the relay/fuse boxes and all connectors I could take off with compressed air thinking the pressure wash I did before the work left water somewhere. Did not find any water in any of the connectors
Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Still not reporting any codes. No check engine light.

Look in the fuse panel for a relay labeled CO-R. Check this relay for operation

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
ok but I'm not finding this CO-R in the service manual to get the location. Is there another designation? Is it near the EFI relay?

It may be labeled "Circuit Opening"

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Got it, C/OPN

That relay is what powers the fuel pump. If it is faulty, the fuel pump will stop running.

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
C/OPN relay is still engaged when it shuts down. Anything else to check?
Customer reply replied 1 month ago
It will restart within a few minutes now.

There are no temperature related controls on this fuel injection system. A check engine light would come of if the engine is overheating, but nothing is present to shut the engine down regarding temperature (that would be disastrous if this was in place on a heavily traveled interstate highway)...With no codes, you do not have sensor issues. Also, with no codes, that means that the issue is either mechanical or electrical. The next step would be to test for power loss at the EFI relay when it occurs, and also check for ground loss at the EFI relay when it occurs. This is done with a 12 volt test light or DC voltmeter.

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Ok, I'll go over the grounds and the EFI relay again. BTY, what type of mechanical issue can you point to related to the timing belt waterpump replacement. The belt was aligned correctly, checked it multiple times. turned the crank two revolutions ect. It also runs and sounds fine but I have not driven it out of the garage yet. thanks

As long as it starts and runs ok, the timing should be OK. If there were issues with the cam and crank position sensors, you would have a code.

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Ok, I checked the grounds in the engine compartment that I could find. Front Left Fender Apron, Front Left Side of Cylinder Head, these are in the list of ground points for the Double Cab in the "2005-2006 Tundra FSM" (Electrical section p537). Those listed that I did not find are Rear Bank of Left Cylinder Head, Left side of Cylinder Block, Radiator Side Support RH. I did find a braided ground strap from the rear of the right cylinder head to the firewall passenger side.
The EFI relay is still engaged after the engine stops. I checked for voltage at the EFI No2 fuse. It never lost voltage.
I have a Scan Guage connected that reports various sensor values. When the truck in the mood to start I can turn the key on and start to see values. When the engine quits, values are no longer reported. Would that indicate that the ECU has lost power? Where else can I check?

That sounds to me like the ECU is losing either power or a ground.

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Yeah, that's what I thought. Any input on how to chase that down. What about starting at the ECU? How many B+ 12v inputs are there? More than one? If so which one is most likely to shut down the ecu.

Since the relays are still active I still suspect a ground fault.

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Looking for the ground connections it appears that the main ground for the engine ecu (marked EC) is under the rear of the intake manifold. Is that correct? If so how do you test/clean that connection?

Looks like the correct one.

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Using an inspection camera turns out that bolt has no wires connected on my tundra. Over the last few days I noticed that the run time was slowly increasing. Yesterday, it ran long enough that I thought it might have healed itself. I was driving out my road (1/4 mi) and it quit on a steep incline. Once I drifted back to level ground it started no problem. I searched one more time for a ground point and found it on the rear of the left head attached to a mounting bracket for the air tube. Since then it has not shut off again but I've only driven a couple miles. Hope to get more drive time in today. So far so good but not ready to call it fixed. Oh, another thing, I used get the secondary air codes every time I started it up when cold. That has not happened once since the pressure wash.
Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Those codes were 0418 AND 2445

You should have the secondary air pumps checked for proper operation

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
OK, I drove 20 some miles today and no issues. And, the secondary air codes returned. So, I guess whatever moisture was lingering under the intake manifold is now completely gone and I am calling it fixed. Thanks for your help.
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