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I have an 01 saturn sl2 auto dohc 1.9 after the car warms up

Customer Question
i get a skip at...
i have an 01 saturn sl2 auto dohc 1.9 after the car warms up i get a skip at 1800ish rpms and it wants to stall when you take off from a stop. the long term fuel trim is showing -8 to -20
JA: Has the vehicle turned into a gas hog? And how does it start -- same as usual?
Customer: it starts fine and runs great before it warms up, i get 22-25 miles to the gallon. the car is new to me but it sat for 3 years before i decided to get it running
JA: What is the model of your '01 Saturn?
Customer: sl2
JA: Are you fixing your vehicle yourself? What have you tried so far?
Customer: yeah, i had some other issues when i got the car so far i have done the vavle cover and gasket, there was a hole in the cover, replaced plugs, wires, coils, ignition control module, cleaned the throttle body, egr, battery, radiator, brakes lines, tires, front pads and rotors rear drums, wheel cylinders, air filter, fuel filter, vent valve
JA: Anything else you want the mechanic to know before I connect you?
Customer: i also replaced the ect, the temp seems to be running at 85-90 c, i intend to replace the thermostat this weekend
Submitted: 2 months ago.Category: Saturn
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Answered in 4 minutes by:
9/11/2017
Saturn Mechanic: Ronnie, ASE Certified Technician replied 2 months ago
Ronnie
Ronnie, ASE Certified Technician
Category: Saturn
Satisfied Customers: 36,320
Experience: 34 year as an ASE Tech
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Saturn Mechanic: Ronnie, ASE Certified Technician replied 2 months ago

Has the computer system been scanned to see if there are any fault codes setting?

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Customer reply replied 2 months ago
Nothing is pending after 4 or 5 drive cycles I get a 446 code for the vent control circuit. I don't have a smoke machine so I haven't been able to smoke it yet. I did replace the vent and purge valves and cleaned the filler neck surface where the cap sits
Saturn Mechanic: Ronnie, ASE Certified Technician replied 2 months ago

The code P0446 should not cause any running concerns. Have connected a fuel pressure gauge to the fuel system to monitor the fuel pressure when the problem is occurring?

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Customer reply replied 2 months ago
I haven't but I can try that the thing that gets me is that it doesn't start until the car hits at least 75c also the car is showing a rich condition from startup
Saturn Mechanic: Ronnie, ASE Certified Technician replied 2 months ago

Okay let start with checking the fuel pressure to be sure its not excessive and or low. You need to see 36 to 44 PSI .

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Customer reply replied 2 months ago
I'll hook up my fuel gauge for the trip home tonight
Saturn Mechanic: Ronnie, ASE Certified Technician replied 2 months ago

That would be a good idea, that way you can monitor it while the problem is occurring. Let me know the results and we can work from there.

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Customer reply replied 2 months ago
I hooked up my fuel pressure gauge on the way home. Koeo fuel pressure is 60. Koer it's 55. While driving and during hesitations the pressure stays constant at 55-57. I know you said 36-44 psi but alldata says 44 psi should be the minimum while driving also found many other references online to fuel pressure being normal around 55 for the 1.9 dohc. Also while I was checking my scanner out I found data pids for misfire data. The misfire history shows similar misfire numbers across all 4 cylinders and when the "skip" occurs there numbers in the current misfire pids go up to 1 or 2. Long term fuel trim is staying pretty steady around -7 to -9. Problem starts when the ect reaches 55-59 c and only seems to occur between 1500 and 2000 rpms.
Saturn Mechanic: Ronnie, ASE Certified Technician replied 2 months ago

Your fuel pressure is fine, when you have your scanner connected are you detecting any fault codes?

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Customer reply replied 2 months ago
Just the 446. Last week I ran it 200 miles without resetting the code to see if I could get another code but that was the only code that pended or set.
Saturn Mechanic: Ronnie, ASE Certified Technician replied 2 months ago

Its odd that there are no engine codes setting if its misfiring, have you watched the CKP signal to see if it gets erratic when the misfire starts?

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Customer reply replied 2 months ago
It only reported approximately 18 misfires per cylinder in a 20 min 7 mile trip. I don't have an oscilloscope to watch the crank pattern would a crank sensor only have issues when warmed up? The car runs rich all the time. the the long term fuel trim never goes positive.
Customer reply replied 2 months ago
When I first put the car on the road I was getting codes for misfires on all cylinders. After I replaced the plugs wires coils and icm that went away. The issue was that the icm was corroded
Saturn Mechanic: Ronnie, ASE Certified Technician replied 2 months ago

Its possible for it to fail when it warms up. It has to be something like that going on here, seem from your description to be electrical . Now it just a mater of trying to narrow it down. Did you check the connect at the ICM to make sure its not still corroded?

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Customer reply replied 2 months ago
Yeah it was the connection between the icm and the coils. I replaced both so those are good and I checked the pins for the plug into the icm. The crank sensor is only $20 for a Bwd at advance so I will pick one up today. If that's the issue I should see immediate results.
Saturn Mechanic: Ronnie, ASE Certified Technician replied 2 months ago

If in fact it is the issue then yes you should see results right away.

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