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I replaced an old (2005) Dometic Quick cool #59516.531 with…

I replaced an old (2005)...
I replaced an old (2005) Dometic Quick cool #59516.531 with a new Brisk Air II top unit only #B59516.711C0 as the compressor finally died on the old unit. Installed the new unit as per manufacturers instructions. Let the system set for about 6 hours to insure that the oil etc was evenly distributed and then powered the unit up. System came up and was started giving me cold air after a couple of minutes, it was 100 deg. outside. After about 5 to 10 minutes the I noticed the air coming out of the ducts had heated back up. Went up top and pulled the cover with the unit still running. Compressor was not running and was very hot to the touch. I didn't shoot it with my digital thermo but I figured the thermal overload had shut it down. Shur all off at the stat and let the system sit for 12 hours. This was just to make sure the oil and liquids were fully distributed to prevent liquid lock. When I turned the system back on at the stat the unit did as previous, after 5 to 10 minutes the compressor heats up and shuts down. My years of experience with these Dometics has been they are pretty solid systems. Is there anything else, control Board compatability etc that wll create this aor do I just have a dead unit from the factory.
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10/14/2017
Randall
Randall, RVIA Certification
Category: RV
Satisfied Customers: 14,646
Experience: RVDA/RVIA Master Certified Technician with many years experience.
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Hi! My name is ***** ***** I can assist you with this. I may need some additional information from you first in order to give a complete answer.

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Do you have a small digital mulimeter so you can take a reading on the actual incoming AC voltage to the unit? I would want to know this. About $20 or so at most hardware stores and easy to use. I can direct you in some testing. All follow ups are included in our fee. It is busy this morning, so please be patient as we work on more than one questions at a time.

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Customer reply replied 10 months ago
OK
Customer reply replied 10 months ago
Checked it with my Fluke 87 already, 124.7vac incoming whether running or off.

T​hat is excellent and so chances are good that this has a bad compressor. Some additional testing is needed to determine that. Can you do that?

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Customer reply replied 10 months ago
sure. I have A/C and refrigeration experience but comercial and residential only.

So remove the cap on top of the compressor and disconnect the leads, keeping track of which is which. Take an ohms reading between each pair of terminals and write those down. The take an ohms reading between each terminal and a good ground on the case of the compressor. Scratch one in there if needed. Let me know what you find. I suspect that this is similar to what you have already done before.

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Customer reply replied 10 months ago
far just like trouble shooting a conventional unit. It'll be a few minutes before I'm back.

10-4. I need to take a short break myself........

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Customer reply replied 10 months ago
OK, back. I assume you are aquainted with these compressors so Terminals are labeled C, S, and R. measurements taken with Fluke 87V. All measure infinity to ground. S to R is 3.8 Ohms, S to C is 3.3 Ohms an C to R is 0.7 Ohms.

Not too bad. S to R is usually about the total of the other two. Next you would want to take an amp reading while it is running and see if it is constant or changes as it gets warmer. I would check the run capacitor as well. And is there any sign of heat up at the overload on top?

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Any oily residue anywhere like a sign of the refrigerant leaking?

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The good thing is that it is still under warranty. They have had a batch of bad units lately. Poor quality parts from China!

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Customer reply replied 10 months ago
No, as I said this is brand new top side only unit.

I am wondering if the start lead is not kicking out as it should once it comes up to pressure?

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Customer reply replied 10 months ago
Installed it yesterday morning. I was wondering that as well but not being familiar with the controls I don't know what in the control box and what is buried up there in the top side unit.

Some are on the top of the unit on the side and some are a separate control box mounted on the bottom side. Is this using a Single Zone or a Comfort Control II thermostat?

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Customer reply replied 10 months ago
Single zone but the stat is a Dometic that is capable of at least 2 zones. 5 button stat with digital display.
Customer reply replied 10 months ago
This is a 2006 unit purchased late 2005 new by us. Unit has prep for second unit including wiring etc. but we never needed so install it.

So you are still using an older 5 button Comfort Control thermostat? Did you order this unit with that board kit? If not, those parts are not compatible.

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Customer reply replied 10 months ago
No I did not. nobody indicated it was needed. Do you have a part # for it?

It would depend on the part number of the control board in this unit. Take a look and see. The board for the Single Zone and the Comfort Control II thermostats is different. And let me see if I can find the board you need for the older 5 button thermostat. Nobody is open today that I get my parts from and I am not at my shop.

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I don't see one listed online that I can find. I can get it for you first thing Monday morning.

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Customer reply replied 10 months ago
I am using the original control box from 2005 as well as stat and wiring. All I did was remove the old top side unit and install the new and plug in the six pin plug.

N​ot sure that will work. I may have to call Dometic Technical Monday morning and ask them.

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Customer reply replied 10 months ago
Can you please do that and let me know?

Sure.........I am in California so it will be Pacific time.

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G​et me the part number off the control box or board........

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Customer reply replied 10 months ago
Will do that today and send to you here.

10-4

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Got you photos. I will call them in the morning.

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Customer reply replied 10 months ago
Thanks. Allen.

You are most welcome!

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Customer reply replied 10 months ago
On the roof of the RV as you texted back. Amp readings are great. Voltage readings are great. When the compressor drops out it's not the thermal that's killing it. I can go in and do a reset on the stat and go back to cool. Fan starts and there's a delay then the compressor kicks in. All readings look good. Have been photoing with my phone. It's something down below this top side unit that is killing the compressor. Voltage in on blue lead to white goes to 0.0vac. Will send more data later. Thanks and Regards, Allen.

Thanks, Allen......

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Customer reply replied 10 months ago
Got some photos of amp readings into the compressor during it's normal operation cycle, before kicking out. Also a phot of the temp into the condenser and and the temp out of the condenser. All looks exactly like I would expect for the ambient temp outside and the elevated temp inside the RV due to the A/C being off.
Blue Lead - C.jpgBlue Le...jpgRed Lead - S.jpgRed Lea...jpgWhite Lead - R.jpgWhite L...jpgCond Temp In.jpgCond Te...jpgCond Temp Out.jpgCond Te...jpg
Customer reply replied 10 months ago
By the way, max temp measured at the discharge head of the compressor was 155 deg. F.

Good job, Allen! Thanks for the great photos. I will call them pretty soon and run this by them and report back.

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Customer reply replied 10 months ago
No rush. I was surprised you read this that early. I have niece lives between LA and San Diego so I know the time spread back here to Texas. Allen

Just got off the phone with Dometic. They say that those controls will work. He said to check for the voltage OUT of the compressor relay on the control board. If that drops out if can be the board or even the thermostat which would be showing that the setting had been satisfied. He also suggested running the thermostat is diagnostic mode. I will get that for you.

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See the attached link for that information. http://bryantrv.com/docs2/docs/ccc5.pdf

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Customer reply replied 10 months ago
OK, after your last response from Dometic I have done further testing. Thanks for the link to Bryant RV but I already knew about them from past RV appliance issues. To me it looks like the stat has lost it's little mind. Did the same stat reset and brought the system back up. Fan, delay, then compressor on. Waited for the compressor to check out, about 14 minutes this time, it does vary so the issue is not digital. After the compressor went off the fan keeps running. In fact it keeps running no matter where you set the stat, cranked it up as high as the stat would take the set point and the fan never stopped. Yes, the fan was in auto. That was checked as well by placing the system in fan mode and stepping from off to low etc and finally to auto. Also cranked the temp set point down after the compressor shut off as far as it would go and waited 20 minutes to make sure the short cycle timer was not keeping it off. Compressor never restarted until I did a reset on the stat. After all this my point is that I appreciate your patience and help in figuring out what is happening. I have decided to replace both the stat and the control kit as well, they are 12 years old after all. I will let you know which one it actually is causing the issue so you will know as well in the future. If you can give me correct part numbers for both components I will order them and after I figure it out I will let you know. I am going to go ahead and finish up with justanswer.com after you get me the part numbers so you can move on to bigger and better things. What I didn't tell you is I am also a retired Electrical Engineer with 40 years of applied experience working all over the world in the field. BTW, if there is ever a question you have my email is***@******.***.

So you were holding out on me??? LOL! No wonder you knew your way around this. If that control box is NLA you can upgrade to a newer digital control. Or you can have that thermostat rebuilt. Several options here. And thanks for that offer!

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Customer reply replied 10 months ago
No on the rebuild. I'll just put in the new stuff when I get the part numbers that are all going to work together. I like to fix problems, not cut corners to see how long I can make it before I have to spend the money I should have spent to begin with. Allen.

Good plan........but, I always mention the options for people.

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Customer reply replied 10 months ago
Randall, Do you think you can get me the numbers on the new stuff? Allen

Yes. New style?

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Customer reply replied 10 months ago
As you said give me the options.

10-4

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It will be a few hours before I can get into the shop for this.

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Was there only one A/C or two? Or if only one, were you thinking of adding another? You can replace those parts you have now as both are still available. The control box is about $87 at the site I have attached. http://www.rvpartscountry.com/Dometic-Air-Conditioner-ELECTRONIC-KIT-CCC-3109226.005.html

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The new 5 button Comfort Control like yours is about $72 and see that link. https://www.makariosrv.com/dometic-comfort-control-center-white-3109228-001/

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Get back to me about the A/C questions and I can give you that option and part number.

Randall
Randall, RVIA Certification
Category: RV
Satisfied Customers: 14,646
Experience: RVDA/RVIA Master Certified Technician with many years experience.
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Customer reply replied 10 months ago
Single unit and I don't see that we would ever go to add the second even though the prep is there.

Then I would stay with those controls. No need to change out everything else.

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Customer reply replied 10 months ago
Also my understanding is that when I upgrade to the newer generation parts that I have to change both at once. I would never know which one actually the culprit. And I want to know! Be going back with new of what is there now and changing the stat first when the parts arrive. I'll try to let you know which it is. Thanks and Regards, Allen

You are correct. The newer style has to be both new parts.

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Customer reply replied 10 months ago
I'll let you know what I come up with. Both new parts are ordered already from the links you sent me. Allen.

10-4

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Customer reply replied 9 months ago
OK Randall. Finally got everything sorted, I told you I'd let you know what it ended up being. Here it is, short version, changed out the the stat and the unit worked properly for about 40 minutes and then same thing, fan to high no control with compressor shut down. It seems the chip on the PCB of the control box was heating up and locking up. Changed the control box and everything is ticking along as it should. If you see this one again I hope this helps you. Thanks for everything and Kind Regards, ***** ***** EEr.

​Thanks for letting me know, Allen..........that would do it for sure.

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