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Alicia_MSW, Psychotherapist
Category: Relationship
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Experience:  Specializing in relationship/family counseling
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Hey, I have a question on what i should do with this girl that

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Hey, I have a question on what i should do with this girl that i was dating up until last week tuesday March 27th. We went on some dates after meeting at a buck n doe for a mutual friend of ours and seemed to hit it off pretty good there. She asked for my pin for blackberry messenger so we could get in touch for a date. We set one up for the following weekend and I made it a surprise to her which she thought was a great idea. I took her bowling then dinner and a movie after. we never had a moment of silence and she was nothing like any of the girls that i've dated in the past, she was affectionate and communative. i've been on some bad first and second dates which were just a lot of awkward silence cause we had nothing really in common. We both said we had an awesome time and wanted a 2nd date for sure, she asked when and i said i'd see you tommorrow if you can. she thought that was great. she came over we went for a walk holding hands and just talked about everything and anything about eachother, getting to know one and other. We txt through the week once or twice and would say nice things about the other then set up the next weekends date, where i met her best friend and some others as well. We all had a blast and on the ride home she reached over and grabbed my hand the hole way home. i've never had a date initiate like that and i thought it was really sweet. When we got back she suggested we go to a hockey game in Detroit for the weekend and i was a little hesitant to say yes but since she suggested it i didn't want to make her feel bad about it so i said yes. Since Detroit is 3hrs away we decided to get a room for the night and come back Sunday. after I left from her dropping me off at my car she txt me right away telling me she had a great time tonight and couldn't wait for Detroit. We set up a dinner date through the week where i met her near her work. Had another amazing time chatting and laughing. She txt me again on the drive home to tell me she had another amazing time with me and that i was great. I told her she was fantastic and that she was more beautiful than the stars out that night. We talked the next couple days b4 we had to leave for detroit with flirting txts and other things. The day came and my buddies had mentioned to me they wanted to go camping with me during the summer and i should invite this girl. I said just wait a bit at the time and i'll ask her after a few more weeks cause i didn't want to scare her in going to fast. On our way down to Detroit we were talking and camping came up in the conversation and I thought "you know we are going to Detroit on her request and it is my turn to set up the next trip probably" so i said something about my buddies wanting to go camping down the road in june or july some time, maybe you can come if you want to. she said she loved camping and thought it would be ok. We had a blast in Detroit, shopping, restaurants and the game. We had sex that night and in the morning and were cuddleing after words and fell asleep in eachothers arms. When we got back from Detroit my mom was home (where i live) and i said well we shouldn't be rood and say hello. She came in and said she was nervous and i said don't worry about it, its just hello. Than my mother invited her to family easter and she said she would have to see what was up with her family easter. We went to the car and kissed goodbye, I sent her a txt later reminding her that i had a fantastic time and that she was an awesome person. 2 days later i sent her another txt asking her how her days were and see if we could set up a dinner date later in the week. she couldn't cause she was busy at work. I said that's cool, just makes the next time we hang out that much more special. Then It was Saturday and still nothing from her. I sent her a "Hey you :) how are you" txt and nothing. Sunday she got a hold of me and wasn't the same in the way she wrote her txts down since we met. I asked her if something was wrong? She said it was nothing i did wrong but she felt we were going to fast and freaked her out and made her realize she wasn't ready for this. The camping trip and my mom's invitation, she said, made her realize this was getting serious and it sent her for a loop. She also said that she should of never suggested detroit and that she felt terrible and was sorry, but the damage was done and not sure if she can date me. I said we should take a step back, explained my reason for asking about the camping trip, i'm not going to push but i can't just ignore the fact that i had the best time ever with you on all our date and (unless she lied and i'm a bad judge of facial expressions) I'm pretty sure you did to. She said she had an awsome time but wasn't ready for serious. I think she had feelings for me and got spooked cause she's been hurt b4, from what she's told me. My buddies think i should just show up with flowers and tell her i'm not going to hurt her. lets take it slow??
Hi, I'm Alicia. Thanks for asking your question - I'm happy to try to help.

Honestly, it sounds like the two of you had a very real connection - on many levels. And that can be scary to some people - especially if they are, as you mentioned, afraid of being hurt or have a history of being hurt in previous relationships. So it seems that that's what is going on here, and why she suddenly pulled back and said that she felt a bit freaked out. I don't think that means that your relationship with her is over - and I do think that if you give it some time and are patient, things can definitely work out. I think you hit the nail on the head when you said she got scared because she's been hurt in the past and doesn't want to get attached - but the only real way to handle a situation like this is to go slow. Rushing into things (as you've seen) can scare someone like this off - and you obviously don't want to lose her for good. So I would just suggest taking a few steps back, and just write her a letter, email or call and let her know that you really like her, but that you can understand that she wants to take things slow and doesn't want a serious relationship yet. Let her know that you are willing to give her space and that you can take it as slow as she likes, but that you would like to continue to see her. I think the key point to remember is to just be relaxed and casual about it and not try to put any pressure on her. She will open up to you in time, when she feels safe and secure with you. I think bringing her flowers could go either way, though. She might see it as a sign of you wanting to move things forward too quickly - or she might see it as a sign of you simply wanting to show that you care about her. I would listen to your gut on that one, but I would suggest that you follow her lead - don't just show up unannounced, for example. I would first have the conversation I mentioned earlier with her and see how she reacts before you do anything else. I think it will work out fine... Best of luck!
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Customer: replied 5 years ago.
I appreciate the advice and i want to give you more of the details since i ran out of room in my first question. I did tell her that i understood where she was coming from and that i honestly wanted to take things slow with her, cause it never works out rushing things. I then said is their a chance we could just talk and take things a step back? her reply was, I'm not sure I kinda feel like the damage is done. It sucks but its life. I feel super bad, I should of never suggested to going to detroit so soon. I then said I don't understand what damage but that i was not going to push anything on her, and just remind her that those were the best dates of my life too (she also said it a week ago that they were the best dates of her life). I also pointed out that we had great chemistry without trying and it just happened naturally for both of us. I also said that this would be super hard to just give up when i got along with you so well and we had so much fun together. So i said i'll just ask you on a date until you say yes. (not every second) She said the dates we had were awsome and yes it was natural, but i'll be honest, i don't like to make plans and u dropped a few summer plans that made me feel oh this is getting serious and i'm not ready for that. I explained my reasoning and told her i felt awkaward asking but felt the need to since i thought it was my turn and she made the hole detroit thing happen. then i asked her if she would like to go on a nice quiet date with me and we keep it casual. I told her she was really fun and i have a hunch that you think i'm fun too. she gave me a "lol" but said she is going to have to say no for now. I said that's cool and that patience is a virtue, also that i still think she is a beautiful person. she said thanks and i moved on to talking about her weekend and then we left it at that. So what can I do. she doesn't want to date me right now but do i txt her like you suggested b4? how long do i wait to talk to her? its been only 2 days now. Also when would it be ok to ask her to hang out again? Every bit of help is really appreciated. And i'll pay more when this is all done :)
Thanks for the additional information. I can see that you really care about her a lot. I don't think you did such a horrible thing by suggesting that you go to Detroit together - you said it with good intentions - because you wanted to spend more time with her and enjoyed her company. So don't beat yourself up over that - it's just that she probably took it as a sign that you're moving too fast. Now the problem is trying to give her space and have a little bit of distance between you (you know the phrase, distance makes the heart grow fonder?) to let her sort out for herself whether she wants to pursue the relationship with you. I know it's tempting, but the thing is, if you're always around (calling, texting, emailing, etc) then she doesn't have a chance to miss you, to realize what she likes about you and to decide whether she wants to be with you. I think she does like you, that much is obvious from everything that you've said. As hard as it is for you - because you don't want to lose her - I would really advise you to try to give her a bit of space (even if it's just for a few days or a week). You've already done everything that you can, and I think she's well aware that you really like her and have feelings for her. So at this point, as difficult as it can be to actually do this, I would say step back and let things simmer for a few more days. Women like to be pursued, that's true - but too much pursuit can be scary and can make her feel like she needs to back off even more, which you definitely don't want.
So, that being said, I would not call her or visit - not yet, anyway. I would write her an email or text and say that you're going to respect her need for space. You really like her but you can understand that things have moved too fast, and that you're going to take a step back. Let her know that you'd like to see her again but that you're not going to continue to pursue it, and that you'll contact her again sometime next week.

Then step back - do anything you can to distract yourself from it, so that you're not obsessing about it in your mind (because then you'll drive yourself crazy). See your friends, talk to someone else about your feelings, write it all down in a letter - do whatever you need during the week that you're not talking to her.
I know it sounds crazy, but the truth is, giving her space and not having any contact can actually work to your advantage. It gives her time to miss you, to think about all the good times you've had so far, and also helps her feel less pressured. If you're always in her face, then you might unintentionally push her away more - and I know that's not what you want :)
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Customer: replied 5 years ago.
Just a few more things, the trip was her idea, and would say thursday be an exceptable time to send her a txt saying what you said i should say? oh and also i've been pretty layed back through this, we only talked two times through the week through txt and hung out in the evening on the two saturdays prior to detroit. the last txt that she was still into me was last tuesday, then i contacted her sat at 3 pm or so, just to say hey then askedd how she was. she didn't get back to me until 2:30 sunday afternoon, and thats when she dropped the bomb on me. just mentioning this cause i wanted to show how much i wanted to give her space. is all your suggestions still the same too, in light of this new info?
Yep - I can see your confusion if the trip was her idea! Still, it seems that she's flip-flopping through a lot of different emotions, so it does also seem like she needs time for those emotions to settle down. I think the idea is to give her space, especially because she is taking her time to reply to your messages and so forth. I'm not quite sure why she's trying to play it so cool, but again, she might feel like if she replies right away, then she's giving you the idea that she wants to continue to be pursued (I hope you understand what I mean - it's not that she is playing games, necessarily, but she's trying to give you the hint that she needs space by not replying right away and so forth). I think Thursday (Friday would be even better) to send her the text. Give it some time to cool off, because you also don't want to come across like you're desperate (I'm not saying you are, but you don't want to get to that point, because that can be a real turn-off!) and just try to be cool. I think you've been doing a good job so far, from what you said, and I know how hard it is. But you've got the right idea - if she wants to play it cool, then she has to realize you're both going to play it cool, and it's not that she can be that way while you're still going to pursue her. So, while there's no guarantee that she's going to respond the way you want her to respond, it's still better to lay low for the time being. You could send her the text message at the end of the week, but then just back off even more and don't contact her any more, just to put the ball in her court, so to speak - that could be what she wants.
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Customer: replied 5 years ago.

Should I even go as far in my txt to say that I understand where you're coming from, you've been hurt b4 and you got scared of what was happening with us and you didn't want to get hurt again. Trust me I was scared a little too. I know trust is earned and I would like to earn that trust cause you can trust me not to hurt you cause i'm not like those who have. I'm just going to take it slow with you and take a step back and give you your space, not to say that i don't want to still see you but i'll leave that up to you when we can hang out again. Well something like that, or should i just go with, I understand where you're coming from and things went too fast, you don't want a serious relationship yet, and i'm just going to take it slow with you and step back to give you your space, not to say that i don't want to still see you but i'll leave that up to you when we can hang out again.


I do really like this girl and i've been out on some really shitty dates with others b4. I just don't want to screw this up with a bad txt either. The hole waiting and giving her space thing i can do. My words might come out wrong and give her the wrong idea.

Hi there,

Sorry for the delay. I think you could definitely say all of that. I think both versions sound great, because you're really explaining everything that you're feeling and also showing that you empathize with her and trying to understand how she is feeling. I would probably go with option two just because it's a bit more concise and less clunky. But it's good that you are following your gut, and I would not worry about it too much. If you over-analyze it, then it might come out sounding stunted or awkward - and right now - to me, at least, it doesn't sound like you're giving her the wrong idea, you're just being honest while also trying to honor her feelings... I don't think there's much more you can do than that :)
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Customer: replied 5 years ago.

Hey Alicia,


Just wanted to get some more advice about what I can be doing to help improve my chances on dating this woman i've been discussing with you. I haven't talked to her yet through txt or anything. I know you said Friday but i thought i would seem like i was trying to get involved with her weekend and that that would come off as desperate or needy. So i'm going to contact her in the next couple days and that will have been over a week now since our last conversation through txt. I talked to my friend who is a mutual friend of us both. She told me that "Heather" said I fell for her too fast and that that was an issue as well. I had similar thoughts towards her, that she was falling for me to fast. I want to know if there is anything i can do or say that can show that that wasn't the case and that i'm just as laid back as she is and willing to go as slow as she wants. She is a very outgoing person that is always on the go and spontanuous, just to give you an idea of her personality. She likes sports, music, really anything that has to do with a social outing. She likes to do athletic things but doesn't play any sports. I'm saying all this cause maybe it will help with your answer towards what I can do. I've kept her off my mind but not completly, cause well its hard since i really liked the connection we had going for us. What do you think I should do in light of this new info. I don't want to scare her further away but i don't want to just give up and move on. I like her and i've dated lots in the past and never shared a conection on so many levels as i did with her. It may seem through my words here that i was so in "love" with her, but i assure you that isn't the case. I know what i want and she displayed many personality qualities that i hold in high regard, and i lked that we could talk about anything and laugh and just generally have a blast together while also being able to have our own lives and have fun without eachother. So again, whats the best thing i can do or say to help increase my odds of seeing her again?

Hey there,

Sorry for the late reply. I am with clients for the next few hours but I want to give your question some thought and attention, so please be patient and I'll reply as soon as I can :)
Customer: replied 5 years ago.
Thank you Alicia, your help is really appreciated :)
Hi - I have an unexpected break so I can spend some time now on your question.

I do get the sense that it's not that she doesn't like you, but that it's that she was just scared off by some of the things that happened (even though they might not seem like such "big" things, to someone who's been hurt in the past, they can seem scary - especially if she's trying to protect herself right now - and she might be trying extra-hard to protect herself if she really likes you. In other words, if she didn't care, she wouldn't be trying to protect herself at all, if you know what I mean.)

That being said, I think the thing to do is to just be casual. I know you're spending a lot of time thinking about this and trying to figure out exactly what to do, (which is fine) but you don't want to give the "impression" that that's what you're doing. So in light of the information you just provided, I would suggest that you do wait a few more days (it's good that you held out a bit longer - but also waiting a few more days will make it seem that you're not "trying" to win her out of desperation or anything like that) and then why not invite her to do something fun - but with some other people (another couple or just some friends?). Having other people in the mix can make it seem less threatening and more casual, which is probably the way you want to head when you're just trying to start things off again. So I don't know what that would involve - going to see a game or doing something outdoorsy (going for a hike, something along those lines) and just mention it casually to her, that you were setting up something with a group of people and you wanted to see if she'd be interested in coming along, no strings attached. (Then you can take it slow from there, if you see that she's responsive to your invitation!) I think that might be the best way to go at this point. Let me know what you think.
Good luck :)
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Customer: replied 5 years ago.
Hi Alicia, thanks for the reply. I am questioning your advice about inviting her with a group of ppl, they'd be all my friends if I'm the one setting up the outing, we only share one friend in common, so wouldn't that seem more like I'm pressureing her or wanting to move things fast, especially since all my buddies are married or have a gf, wouldn't it seem like a couples thing and scare her more? That being said, I did txt her today and just gave her a casual hey, how is it going and asked her how her weekend was. She just said wicked and asked me about mine and I gave her all kinds of detail. Not step by step just night by night and I feel now that it might of came off as a sign of me trying to hard.. I did get her to send a few "lol" back m my which was what I was going for. I'm wondering now what should I do?v wait tell she Initiates contact with me or do I give it another week or two and txt her another casual "how's it going txt" , I feel that she is backing right off and the only way is to charm her and persue it but not too hard just as casual as possible and with contact every week or two. I don't think she'll contact first. What do u think? I just think I'd scare her more if I try to invite her out with a group, making it feel more like a couples thing.
You know what might be a good idea? I just read this extremely interesting and informative book called "For Men Only" (you can find it on Amazon), which explains (for men) the way women think and how come men often have difficulties understanding where they're coming from (and also in the "pursuit" or "courtship" phase). I thought of you because I thought you might get something out of it, in terms of all of the things we're been talking about. Just a thought...
Anyway, as far as inviting her with a group, that was also just a thought but I know it's usually a way for people (when they're dating) to feel less pressured because then it's not a "one-on-one" scenario. But I can understand what you're saying that you have only one friend in common. You could easily solve that by just saying you were trying to get a group of people together to go do something and ask her if she wants to come and has anyone she'd like to bring along. Again - just a thought :)
But I can see also that you're really scared of pushing her away. I can also understand why you gave her all kinds of detail about your weekend, because you were probably just dying to talk to her. But I'm not sure why you think she was put off by that? Do you think it's possible that she is just playing very hard to get? It's tough because she's now giving off signals that seem to read that she really wants her space - and I can't say for how long that will be necessary this time. I think you're doing a good job and taking it as slow as you possibly can, and you're right, she might not contact you first (much as I hate to say this) - but that could also be because she's picking up on the fact that you're really into her. I would say, (and remember, this isn't the gospel :)) that you try to stop overanalyzing things "too" much and a relax a bit. Your nerves might have gotten the best of you when you texted her about your weekend, and if you can somehow relax and bit maybe things wouldn't come out that way? Also, I think there's nothing wrong with keeping in touch with her (and inviting her out - but at some later point, perhaps not right now) and contacting her again in a few days (a week again?) and seeing if her response changes.
You said you have one mutual friend, and I remember a while ago that you said your friends were trying to get you to get over her. Does your mutual friend have any more insight as to how she's feeling?
Good luck and keep me posted :)
Customer: replied 5 years ago.
Hey, thanks for your thoughts and information. I will definatley take a gander at that book you recomended. Answering some of your questions, I thought she was put off by my long response because right after i sent it, her response was " sounds like a blast, anyways it's bed time for me". This was at 9:30pm and she does have to get up really early. I just feel i was reaching too much and it came off, like you said, I was dying to talk to her. As far as our mutual friend goes, she has been my friend since we were young and just with Heather for a few years now. She was really upset with Heather when I first told her the news and was going to uninvite her to her wedding. I told her not to do that since it really is Heather's own personal choice and should have no reflection towards your friendship with her. She was just mad cause she told me she was a great person and told Heather that I was a super nice guy and that she thought we would work out great together. Since then our mutual friend talked to Heather and Heather said I hope your not mad at me for what happened with Marc, and my friend said to Heather that its non of her business and that she is her own women and can do what she wants. My friend then perseeded to ask Heather what happened. Heather's response was " Men fall for me too fast". (which i really don't see where she picked that up from considering that she initiated half of the intimate contact and verbal/txting communication, also she invited me to go out with her and two friends, one being her best friend, which I thought was a big deal to meet her friends on the 2nd date. Just saying it seemed like she was moving things along, not me) My friend then said to Heather, "why wouldn't you just slow things down instead of ending it?" and Heather said i just wasn't feeling it for him anymore. (another thing i find peculiar since she said so many nice things to me and was txting me hugs and kisses and saying that I was too cute, a lot. This was all said again on the Tuesday after the weekend of the Detroit trip and then when i left it in her hands to contact me first through the rest of the week, she never did, so i txted her on sat and she got back to me sunday, (the first time she waited a long time to respond) letting me know she was scared about the hole thing. So 5 days after saying all kinds of nice things and acting into me, then going to not into me anymore just doesn't seem right, that's why i think she was scared of what she was feeling with me and didn't want to get involved in something serious and risk being hurt again. She also told me before this happened that she was having so much fun and that we had the best dates of her life and she dated some real jerks). So I don't know what to think really. Our friend tells me that she is emotionally screwed up cause of the two long term relationships she was in and that she was really hurt by them. Said that those guys treated her like shit and were losers that didn't like to do anything but sit around playing video games. I want to ask our friend to say something to Heather on my behalf but not like its from me and she said no prob but wasn't sure what to say. I told her i'd get back to her on that one but now i'm thinking that is wrong and an act of desperation. I know i've been over analyizing this too much, but its like I found the perfect person for me in every way and i can't have them and from what our friend has said (besides the emotionally damaged part) that she is perfect for me, cause of all our likes and dislikes, our humour, our outlook on life (we are both positive ppl) just seems like she is the one and like i've said, i've dated a lot and non have come even close to this one. I am going to wait a week to contact her again, but do you think i should wait longer? My plan is sometime in the next month, ask her on a day date to a jays game and leave the evening open for her to do what she wants. I really think the group thing would be too awkward for her and me. Do you have any further thoughts on what I should do? I'm going to definatly try and relax more and get her offf my mind more. I'm doing a lot of working out and trying to better my career with a career coach and chose some more schooling. All this is to just work on myself but to also help make me more desirable. Just a note, i was doing this before I met Heather too, well not the Career coach thing but i was looking into programs to study. You can be as straight forward and blunt with me as possible, it won't hurt my feelings :)
Okay - just one thing, but I do think you 'might' be over-reacting just a bit - no offense! When she said, in response to your text message "Sounds like a blast, I have to go to bed" - I'm not really seeing any hidden meaning there (meaning, it doesn't sound like something she said to blow you off) - what else could she have said? I'm not being harsh, but that might be one example of over-analyzing things - although I do get where you're coming from.
I think your idea about inviting her to the jays game is great. It's relaxed, no pressure - all around, a good plan (and I do understand about the group thing. That doesn't work for everyone or in every situation but I did want to throw it out there at you just to see what you thought.)
I'm sighing here as I am writing this because the situation is so hard to read now. The more information I get, the harder it is for me to really say how I see things - so I completely understand that it's 10 times worse for you :) Before I go on, I will say it's a very smart idea to start focusing on yourself more (with the career coach thing and so forth) because you're more desirable as a person if you have a lot of interests and "things" going on - and it's just all-around good for you as a person, too. So - good for you :)
Now - there is a part of me that feels like what you're saying is right, that she is acting this way because of those 'wonderful' past relationships. It may very well be that she is scared off because of all the nonsense she had to deal with in the past. It makes sense then, that she'd be doubly scared if she met someone who she really connects with - because that's much more of a threat - if you know what I mean. You then have the potential to hurt her way more than some other guy she doesn't care about much.
The other nagging thought in the back of my head (and I could be wrong) is that she is either playing hard to get because she senses that you like her so much, or, on the flipside, she really means what she is saying (that she wasn't feeling it for you anymore.) I hate to go there because I don't want to make you feel bad, but it is a point we have to consider.
That being said, it's really hard for me to say what you 'should' do because there's no right or wrong in this scenario because we can't read her mind and really know what she's feeling or thinking. I think your idea of the game is a good one, and I think waiting a bit longer is also good. I don't think you're coming off as desperate. But I am having a hard time with her response to Heather (the whole saying she's not feeling it for you. I don't totally buy that.)
If it were me, I would say that it's okay to stay in touch every few days (via email, text) - you know, treat her like you would treat a friend that you're just getting to know. And throw out the idea of the game at some point. But she's not sending any clear signals for you to stay away. So I would say, continue doing what you're doing - taking it slow and relaxed. Focusing on yourself, keeping yourself busy - and also not over-analyzing so much. But I think somehow shifting your thinking to seeing her as a potential friend (and acting accordingly) rather than seeing her as a potential mate (which is hard because you say you connect so well) is the thing to focus on now.
I hope that helps. Let me know what happens!
Customer: replied 5 years ago.
Just letting you know, I went and screwed it up with a stupid text. I was trying to be indirect about letting her know i understood how she felt and what went on with her emotionally. She then asked why am i thinking so much about this and i went and babbled on like a desperate fool. I said if she wants time and space then thats what i'd give her and went on to discuss what i felt went on, and was it so bad to start liking someone that i had been dating for a while and spending time with and getting along with. She told me she didn't want a relationship right now and i'm a good guy and there is a perfect girl out there for me but it isn't her. All because i went to far in a few texts and screwed it right up. I couldn't tell you why i went and did this but i knew i'd screw it up some how. I feel like a freaking idiot and i deffinatly see how i turned her right off. Its so stupid but i don't ever get like this with women and the one i really conected with i went and screwed it right up. This is a lost cause now isn't it?
Oh, don't be too hard on yourself. You're human, you know. You just got overwhelmed by your emotions. It happens to everyone! At the very least, maybe it was meant to happen to give you some clarity about things because now you can try to move forward. I know you might not want to - but whether its a lost cause or not - we can't predict the future or anyone else's feelings or how they might change - I think it's the best thing for you right now. Try and accept the situation for what it is. Maybe it's happened for a reason, and maybe you two just weren't meant to be together right now at this point in time, as sad as it is. I hope you can make some peace with things and move ahead with your never know what lies around the corner or how things will work out.
Good luck and let me know if you need any additional help. Best wishes.