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Mitsubishi Lancer Ralliart: mr, i am having like small

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hi mr, i am having like...
hi mr,
i am having like small issues with the tranny it keeps like shaking the car when starts to run in the and when i step on the gas it does shift firm it does strange could it be the clutches? or change of oil?
Submitted: 2 years ago.Category: Mitsubishi
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Answered in 5 minutes by:
6/18/2015
Mitsubishi Mechanic: Doug, ASE Certified Technician replied 2 years ago
Doug
Doug, ASE Certified Technician
Category: Mitsubishi
Satisfied Customers: 8,624
Experience: Mitsubishi employed and Factory trained ASE certified technician
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Hi,

What exactly is occurring and when? For example the shaking, is it in every gear, only a certain gear, or only even/odd gears?
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Customer reply replied 2 years ago

moreless in every gear if im not mistaking but as the car shifts to a higher gear its gets less and less but it makes the rpm move because of that....i am not sure if im explaining it right but the it shakes for sure. i did not pay really close attention if it does it odd gears only or not.

Mitsubishi Mechanic: Doug, ASE Certified Technician replied 2 years ago
Thanks.

When the shaking is occurring, if you put it in to manual operation and press the gas down, does it worsen or improve?
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Customer reply replied 2 years ago

the shaking occures only in low rpm when i step on the gas it does not shake it kinds of slips or does not shift normal but it rpm stays low than goes up it does not engage or shift smoothly

Mitsubishi Mechanic: Doug, ASE Certified Technician replied 2 years ago
Hmm. I take it you are not seeing any warning lights, no Service Engine Soon light, and no message in the center display that says Transmission (or other) Service Required?

Do you think this behavior would record well to video, that I would be able to see/interpret what you are experiencing?
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Customer reply replied 2 years ago

i think so the service engine soon i never could remove it. its there fromt the beginning other warnning lights are the awc warning i can recor the rpm you can see what it does. give a couple of minutes

Mitsubishi Mechanic: Doug, ASE Certified Technician replied 2 years ago
No problem.
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Customer reply replied 2 years ago

could you give your email for me to send the videos? i forgot to tell you you also here the grinding of the tranny does that tell you something?

Mitsubishi Mechanic: Doug, ASE Certified Technician replied 2 years ago
It is easiest to upload to youtube then post a link here. If you email it, then it goes through a whole ordeal that can take hours to days before it finds its way to me. Youtube is more or less instant.

When does the grind occur, during (or within a second or two before or after) shifts?
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Customer reply replied 2 years ago

when i stop accelerating and its slowing down you here the grinding

Mitsubishi Mechanic: Doug, ASE Certified Technician replied 2 years ago
Well that is pretty unusual. The only thing that would do that in the transmission would be if one of the clutches was slipping.
You aren't experiencing any clutch slip under load though right?
Can you be certain the grind noise is coming from the transmission?
What is the current mileage on the vehicle?
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Customer reply replied 2 years ago

it looks like it slips but not always how does it does when its slipping maybe i can confirm to you in the case it is slipping.....here is the link i will upload two toher videos for you but this link you can see the rpm http://youtu.be/u3Nb788JmGc its only 4 secs but try looking at it. when it slips could you explain what it does? mileage 68600 but i placed a new second han tranny at about around 50000 miles

Customer reply replied 2 years ago

i think it does sometimes slips cause i feel at the rpm does it mean if have to chage oil ? or what? anothjer link https://youtu.be/DGO7t2U-ro8

Mitsubishi Mechanic: Doug, ASE Certified Technician replied 2 years ago
I can't see the first link as it is marked private, the second one I can though... and it definitely looks like you are slipping.

Before doing anything else I would be having the clutch packs removed and inspected. This will require removal of the transmission as they come out from the flywheel opening. This would require draining the fluid as well as these are wet clutches... new fluid is always recommended when draining of course.

I would suspect with the tach slipping up and down like that you are going to have some worn out clutch frictions in the clutch assembly. That would explain the abnormal behavior as well as the grinding noise sometimes (remember the transmission is engaging two gears at all times; if one clutch set it slipping you will get some grind noise periodically).

You could try changing the oil first... I have never seen that severe a condition be resolved with just oil though... and at ~$300 for new oil, that is a huge gamble considering it is all coming back out again if there is no improvement. Of course you could reuse it, but it is still a good bit of work with little chance of improvement.

Anything beyond those... unfortunately would lead in to transmission replacement again. Nothing else internal that can be replaced will cause grinding noise realistically; the only internal parts available are the mechatronic unit (like a valve body), and it would not cause behavior like this without setting Transmission Service Required messages.

The alternative would be to ship the transmission out to a specialist... Mitsubishi does not supply hardly any repair parts for these, primarily because Getrag doesn't supply them with the option; they don't want anyone inside their transmissions. There are independent shops that have developed their own service parts (Jacks Transmission for example) that can fully rework your unit should the worst happen... and usually for less than a used transmission that is bound to fail soon anyway.

Again I would be interested in checking out the clutches first though with that slip condition.
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Customer reply replied 2 years ago

the issue is that here on the island we dont have like specialist for the car if i got issue no one wants to dig in i think my best bet would be replacing the tranny for the 2nd time. this really disgusting! my hope was getting anything else done that could avoid me of that replacement!

Mitsubishi Mechanic: Doug, ASE Certified Technician replied 2 years ago
Yeah these are like time bombs nowadays unfortunately. What really can burn you that we are seeing a lot of lately are the shift fork magnets falling off. A ten cent part that renders the transmission borderline useless, and the only way to get new ones (forks or magnets) is a new transmission. Used (faulty) transmissions are becoming fork donors over that.

I If you are in a situation like that were you have limited access to anyone with hands-on for these, your best long term solution would be to pull the transmission and have it shipped out for full service and know you aren't going to have to go in there again. Jacks does full overhauls for about $2000, Shep is starting to do them as well though I don't know the extent/depth of their work/repair abilities.

While it may cost a bit to ship of course, if you are talking for example $3000 out of pocket to have a basically new unit and not have to worry about these issues again, AND not have to worry about having it recoded (since it will be your transmission and already coded correctly), it would be a worthwhile investment to me. Particularly when you consider a new factory clutch kit is nearly $2000 last time I checked. When you compare with even getting another used unit... which will likely be $3000+ (around here they are going for $3000-4500 for working units), plus shipping, plus getting it recoded to match your car etc... having the transmission sent out for repair makes more and more sense.
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Customer reply replied 2 years ago

i got one for for under 2000 dollars would it make sense buying it? i am planning to replace it and sell the car immediately. who can do the coding for me ? shoud it be shipped to the company to be coded or can they do it on the spot for me? or can i replace it without coding it?

Mitsubishi Mechanic: Doug, ASE Certified Technician replied 2 years ago
If the unit is good, that is a smoking deal for $2000. Broken units usually sell for $1500-2000.

The coding needs to be done on the car and requires a Mitsubishi MUT3 at minimum, at maximum it needs an actual dealer internet connection.
The difference is the coding on the old transmission and if it is readable. If there are faults in the computer inside the transmission, it won't allow you to download the configuration file to code the new (to you) transmission. If that happens, you have to have access to Mitsubishis internal corporate resources to get a configuration file for the car. You could possibly get someone to provide one to you if needed and you had someone that worked in the market your car originated in (if your car originated in the North America market, I could get a configuration file for you). You would still need a MUT3 to write the VIN and install the configuration coding, there is no way around that on a donor transmission.

This is the advantage to shipping your transmission out for repair, is that you would get your old transmission back that is already coded to your car so none of that would be necessary.

You could go without coding it if it is a used unit (since it already has coding), however you would have a VIN mismatch which would turn several warnings on, and if you had a Evo versus Ralliart unit your tire size calculation and shift modes would be incorrect, among other potential issues based on year etc. Basically.... you need to have it coded correctly.
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Customer reply replied 2 years ago
Could you send me the tool i need to buy to open up the tranny and the clutch or necessary parts for me to purchasr??
Mitsubishi Mechanic: Doug, ASE Certified Technician replied 2 years ago
Hi,

We do not do any sort of service like that, this is purely information based.
However you would not really need any special tools for opening the transmission or changing the clutch. The only thing specific would be if you were changing clutch frictions you would need a dial indicator (plunge depth) gauge... that is not a special tool or anything though, you can get one from just about any tool or auto store. Everything else is just basic sockets.
Parts would depend on the failure.... in general there are very few parts available for this transmission. You can get clutches of course and you can get the mechatronic assembly (valve body and tcm), there isn't a lot else available though.... and either of those cost more than a used transmission anyway.
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Customer reply replied 2 years ago
Hi there,So what would be your advice to me? Ship it out to the us and let them fix it or is there another cheaper way i can do it?I saw some overhaul kits on rockauto can i use those or its not compatible?
Mitsubishi Mechanic: Doug, ASE Certified Technician replied 2 years ago

Hi,

If you are going to keep the car.... ship it to Shep or another transmission shop in the US that does full overhauls on these. It will end up costing about as much as putting a good quality (low miles etc) used unit in and you know it is already coded etc that way anyone can put it in, and it will be built to last.

If you are going to just sell it once it is fixed, I would just get the absolute cheapest used on you can find with a guarantee on it so you know it isn't dead on arrival, throw it in and have it coded and move on.

I am not aware of any over haul kits available for these... in general the only things publicly available are the clutches (upwards of $2000) and the mechatronic ($2000). The rest of the transmission is more or less a manual, so even at that any over haul parts would be hubs/sleeves/synchros/etc.... expensive parts that are not likely failed anyway.

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Customer reply replied 2 years ago
Do you recommend me shipping it for a clutch upgarde at jacks for $499 and install it back will that be an option? Cause i want to get rid of the car
Mitsubishi Mechanic: Doug, ASE Certified Technician replied 2 years ago
That is certainly an option; considering we are still speculative on the clutches being the issue (it isn't much likely else, however there is still that possibility) I would say having them do a look over on it as well would be a good idea. If they will do frictions for that of course that is super cheap (compared to the service parts which are the whole basket etc for way more money); even with shipping you could be back in business for under $1000 potentially. Just a matter of verifying that is all it is.... once they pull the clutch baskets out they should know, however. They would be visibly worn typically.
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Customer reply replied 2 years ago
Hi doug,
I spoke to jacks transmission and they told me instead of shipping the whole transmission to take out the clutch basket and send it to them. Is that difficult? I am talking to my mechanic and he's asking me if there is something specific he has to take into account when opening up the tranny and if its different from regular tranny. Do you have instructions on that? Or could you briefly explain me about that?
Mitsubishi Mechanic: Doug, ASE Certified Technician replied 2 years ago
Hi,
That would definitely save a bundle if they are only needing/wanting that.
Too change the clutch basket you need to first drain the transmission and retain the fluid (there is no dipstick, so you have to measure it on removal for refilling).
The transmission can then be removed which of course you are familiar with. With the transmission removed you'll see a large seal covering the bellhousing opening. Three bolts and braces are there holding it in, once removed the large seal can be pryed out. At that point the clutch basket slides out just like in an automatic transmission.
When you reassemble you will want a new seal (Jack's can handle shipping that too I'm sure). The transmission has a black hex bolt plug on the top right near the shifter linkage and tcm connector area, use this bolt hole to refill the transmission with the removed fluid.
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