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I have ML270 W163 engine cut out on motorway, got taken in…

Customer Question
Hi I have ML270...

Hi I have ML270 W163 engine cut out on motorway, got taken in on trailer. Unloading engine started and ran well. few days later same again but has not started since. Changed crank and cam sensors. high pressure pump.Injectors have fuel but are not operating. Fuse F24/8 is ok. Any thoughts? Peter

Mechanic's Assistant: Does the vehicle stall at low speeds? Does it sputter?

No Ran well if not a bit underpowered.

Mechanic's Assistant: What is the model/year of your Mercedes?

ML270 w163 2002

Mechanic's Assistant: Are you fixing your vehicle yourself? What have you tried so far?

Yes I have changed cam and crank sensors, high pressure pump.

Mechanic's Assistant: Anything else you want the mechanic to know before I connect you?

There is fuel to injectors but they are not spraying as ifthey are not getting pulse.

Submitted: 7 months ago.Category: Mercedes
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Answered in 8 hours by:
11/20/2017
Mercedes Mechanic: Lou P. master tech, Mercedes Technician replied 7 months ago
Lou P. master tech
Lou P. master tech, Mercedes Technician
Category: Mercedes
Satisfied Customers: 6,079
Experience: 20 years Master Certified excellent fix rate and have access to factory wiring, and instructions.
Verified

Hello, my name is***** and i will do my best to assist you.I am going over your story now and will reply back soon with some info,thanks!

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Mercedes Mechanic: Lou P. master tech, Mercedes Technician replied 7 months ago

Have you verified fuel pressure from the in tank fuel pump?

Lou

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Customer reply replied 7 months ago
Hi no bit appears to be ample fuel to common rail. Problem seems to electric associated.
Mercedes Mechanic: Lou P. master tech, Mercedes Technician replied 7 months ago
Ok i dont have access to wiring for this model i will have to opt out . Someone should be able to pick this up and help out. Lou
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Mercedes Mechanic: Matt, Engineer replied 7 months ago
Matt
Matt, Engineer
Category: Mercedes
Satisfied Customers: 23,298
Experience: Mechanical Engineer with 23 years experience in the auto industry, 8 yrs in formula 1 engine testing
Verified

Hello

another expert here

I'd say to do some basic tests 1st

1st check for spark by removing one of the spark plugs and plug it back into its lead and rest it on the metal of the engine ( DO NOT hold it on place by hand) then have your assistant turn the engine over whilst you watch the plug. It should give a fat blue spark at regular intervals.

If not then check that there's power to the coil pack (at the other end of the plug lead) using a meter. If there’s 12V at the pack but no spark then check the ECU power supply (fuse and relay) and also the connections to the crankshaft speed sensor.

If there is a spark and its still not starting then its likely that the ECU isn't opening the fuel injectors, if the injectors are working you can hear them click - its difficult to hear them with background noise so use a long screwdriver like a stethoscope, placing the handle end in your ear and the metal tip against the body of the injector whilst your assistant turns the engine over.

If you can't hear anything check the ECU power is present by measuring voltage at the fusebox and on its relay socket if OK then check the connections to the crank speed sensor and consider replacing this sensor if the wiring / connections look OK

If the car will start using a squirt of quick/ easi start into the intake then this confirms the problem is lack of fuel

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Customer reply replied 7 months ago
Hi ml 270. Is diesel!!
Mercedes Mechanic: Matt, Engineer replied 7 months ago

Sorry

didn't realise as it wasn't clear from the previous information, the advice for checking the ecu power and condition of the crank sensor still applies though

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Customer reply replied 7 months ago
I have changed the crank an cam shaft sensors and I have power to terminal 1 on bolck 1 of ECU. I notice the insulation on wire to no.1 injector is damaged and could have shorted, is there protection against this built in?.
Peter
Mercedes Mechanic: Matt, Engineer replied 7 months ago

hello Peter

if the injector wire is shorted out then the ECU may shut down - there is an overload voltage protection but its not very selective

I'd say to repair the wire insulation and reset the ECU (by disconnecting the battery for 10 mins) and see if this helps

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Mercedes Mechanic: Matt, Engineer replied 7 months ago

Hi
do you still need help?
Bear in mind that the site takes a deposit from you at the beginning and this is held by the site until you rate my answer at which point the cash is split between the site and the expert. I am only paid for my work on this question if you rate my answer, using the star system at the top of the screen. Please do not forget! If you're not pleased, also let me know because rating bad does not result in a refund, there are better options. Rating now will not close this post nor prevent further replies
Thanks Matt

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Customer reply replied 7 months ago
Hi Matt. I have tried disconnecting the battery a few time s it makes no difference. Any other thoughts??
Peter
Mercedes Mechanic: Matt, Engineer replied 7 months ago

Hello Peter

if its still not starting I'd say to check that the injectors are bing operated by the ECU, its hard to hear them ‘clicking’ with back ground noise so if you use a screwdriver like a stethoscope with one end placed against the body of the fuel injector while your assistant cranks the engine
The injectors should ‘click’ as they are cycled on and off

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Mercedes Mechanic: Matt, Engineer replied 7 months ago

Hi
do you still need help?
Bear in mind that the site takes a deposit from you at the beginning and this is held by the site until you rate my answer at which point the cash is split between the site and the expert. I am only paid for my work on this question if you rate my answer, using the star system at the top of the screen. Please do not forget! If you're not pleased, also let me know because rating bad does not result in a refund, there are better options. Rating now will not close this post nor prevent further replies
Thanks Matt

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Customer reply replied 7 months ago
Hi l have an lnjector out and fuel and lead connected, we fuel pressure but no injection takes place. On my first attempt it did spray but only once, this makes me think fuel pressure is OK. I had meter across connection but get no reading, I appreciate the pulse is quick but I would have expected some sort if response. I will take ecu to MB and get it tested.
Any other thoughts?.
Peter
Mercedes Mechanic: Matt, Engineer replied 7 months ago

Hello Peter

that sounds like a good idea

as you've already replaced the crank sensor and there's power to the ECU then there's not much else to test

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Mercedes Mechanic: Matt, Engineer replied 7 months ago

Hi
do you still need help?
Bear in mind that the site takes a deposit from you at the beginning and this is held by the site until you rate my answer at which point the cash is split between the site and the expert. I am only paid for my work on this question if you rate my answer, using the star system at the top of the screen. Please do not forget! If you're not pleased, also let me know because rating bad does not result in a refund, there are better options. Rating now will not close this post nor prevent further replies
Thanks Matt

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Customer reply replied 6 months ago
still no luck with problem, I cant see you have given any clues to the problem. I don`t want to upset your rating figures but I don`t feel I have had value for money.
Peter
Mercedes Mechanic: Matt, Engineer replied 6 months ago

Hello Peter in that case I'll opt out and open this up to others

good luck and happy new year

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Customer reply replied 6 months ago
Thanks and happy new year to you.
Mercedes Mechanic: sprinkles08, ASE Certified Technician replied 6 months ago
sprinkles08
sprinkles08, ASE Certified Technician
Category: Mercedes
Satisfied Customers: 24,063
Experience: ASE Master and Advanced level certified. Factory trained with 17 years dealership experience
Verified

Hello and welcome to JustAnswer! I apologize for the extended wait time you experienced, I've only just come online now and would like to assist you with your question.

There are quite a few things that could be going on and it's going to require some testing to determine why the engine will not start. The problem may be internal in the engine, it could be electrical, or it could be fuel related.

A scan tool is going to be necessary to proceed with testing. Do you have one?

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Customer reply replied 6 months ago
I have done diagnostic, fault is no crankshaft reading. Sender is new..I am getting 2.4 volts from both feed wires, no earth. Suspect ACU?? Camshaft sensor reads good 12.6v and earth. Rail pressure 100 bars. Peter
Mercedes Mechanic: sprinkles08, ASE Certified Technician replied 6 months ago

What P code is setting?

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Mercedes Mechanic: sprinkles08, ASE Certified Technician replied 6 months ago

What P code is setting?

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Customer reply replied 5 months ago
P 1354-016 andP1354-002 the ECU has been tested and no fault found, the wires to 1 and 2 injectors could have shorted?. is there a reset or how does ECU cope with this?, if I take out an injector and connect upside down there is no injection happening when engine turns.
I do not have diagnostic kit, I have bring someone in.
Peter
Mercedes Mechanic: sprinkles08, ASE Certified Technician replied 5 months ago

Do you have an actual scan tool to monitor data?

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Customer reply replied 5 months ago
No I don't have scan kit. I can get someone to come if we have cause. Peter
Mercedes Mechanic: sprinkles08, ASE Certified Technician replied 5 months ago
A scan tool will be necessary to determine if you're missing cam signal, crank signal, or if the signals are out of sync.
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Customer reply replied 5 months ago
As I have said diagnostic show s no crank sensor signal,and rev counter reads this, if sensor is disconnected rev counter does not pick up. sensor is new.
Mercedes Mechanic: sprinkles08, ASE Certified Technician replied 5 months ago

If crank signal isn't present and you have a new factory sensor then there is a wiring issue between the sensor and ECM.

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Customer reply replied 5 months ago
Hi I getting 2,3v to each terminal on sensor connector, I have checked on running ml and it is the same.
Customer reply replied 5 months ago
We are getting nowhere with this problem. The crank shaft sensor must be working for rev counter to register engine turning.
Mercedes Mechanic: sprinkles08, ASE Certified Technician replied 5 months ago

If the tach moves then you do have crank sensor signal, contrary to the information you have supplied.

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Customer reply replied 5 months ago
That is what I am saying.The problem seems to be the injectors are not receiving a signal to inject, we have a 100bars common rail pressure, according to diagnostic test.As I have said ECU has been tested and no fault found. What other information does the ECU collect to allow engine start ?. The crankshaft sensor was replaced but not 100% sure it was MB. however it is reading crank movement.
Mercedes Mechanic: sprinkles08, ASE Certified Technician replied 5 months ago
You previously posted fault codes that were set because of a cam/crank sensor signal correlation issue. If crank signal is present then either you have a bad cam sensor or a timing issue.
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Customer reply replied 5 months ago
I have replaced camshaft sensor after replacing crank sensor. I presume you mean valve timing, I have checked and is spot on. Would you expect voltage reading at injector s on spinning engine? If so what voltage?
Mercedes Mechanic: sprinkles08, ASE Certified Technician replied 5 months ago
The injectors aren't going to turn on if the cam and crank signals aren't present and in sync.
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