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Dd15 Engine hard to start after 5 minutes shut down, cranks…

Customer Question
Good morning, Dd15 Engine hard to...
Good morning,
Dd15 Engine hard to start after 5 minutes shut down , cranks for over 7times before starts?!?
I bypass the big filter fuel water separater direct to the fuel housing.
Still same
Submitted: 1 month ago.Category: Medium and Heavy Trucks
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3/13/2018
Technician: roybelding, Shop Foreman Freightliner trucks replied 1 month ago
roybelding
roybelding, Shop Foreman Freightliner trucks
Category: Medium and Heavy Trucks
Satisfied Customers: 7,271
Experience: Shop Froeman for Freightliner Trucks
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hello, my name is ***** ***** I will be glad to assist you. please allow me a couple of minutes to gather some basic info.

Roy

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Technician: roybelding, Shop Foreman Freightliner trucks replied 1 month ago

is there any external leaks on the tubes, fuel rail or fuel pump??

Roy

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Technician: roybelding, Shop Foreman Freightliner trucks replied 1 month ago

do you still need any help???

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
No leak
Technician: roybelding, Shop Foreman Freightliner trucks replied 1 month ago

do you have a laptop with the DDDL program??

I would start with the FSIC test to see if the injectors are bleeding doen and loosing prime.

Roy

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
I have it, How to get there, please?
Technician: roybelding, Shop Foreman Freightliner trucks replied 1 month ago

It is on one of the drop down menus at the top.

You will need the block off caps to perform the test.

It is called FSIC routine

Roy

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Technician: roybelding, Shop Foreman Freightliner trucks replied 1 month ago

procedure

https://ddcsn-ddc.freightliner.com/cps/rde/xbcr/ddcsn/208-13.pdf

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Technician: roybelding, Shop Foreman Freightliner trucks replied 1 month ago

Please take a moment and rate my service 3 stars or better. that is the only way the site will pay me for my efforts.

Roy

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Technician: roybelding, Shop Foreman Freightliner trucks replied 1 month ago

do you have any other questions??

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Which caps would need to block off?
Technician: roybelding, Shop Foreman Freightliner trucks replied 1 month ago

you remove one line at a time and block off the fuel rail at that injector. the cpas go where the line came out of the fuel rail

you need 6 caps.

Roy

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Please can you send a picture
Technician: roybelding, Shop Foreman Freightliner trucks replied 1 month ago

look at the fuel rail. you would remve one of the P tubes from the fuel rail to the injector. then you need to cap off the line with the cap. then you start the motor and let the laptop run the test. then it will test the bleed down time. record the bleed down time

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Plug the head or the tube and what the plugs part #
Technician: roybelding, Shop Foreman Freightliner trucks replied 1 month ago

plug the fuel rail.

you need to call freightliner for the parts. I dont have part numbers/

Roy

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Technician: roybelding, Shop Foreman Freightliner trucks replied 1 month ago

1 goes to the injector, remove that, the other end has to come off as well. when you take off the part to the fuel rail, put the cap on there

Roy

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Technician: roybelding, Shop Foreman Freightliner trucks replied 1 month ago

any update

Please take a moment and rate my service 3 stars or better. that is the only way the site will pay me for my efforts.

Roy

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Dealer out of plugs
Technician: roybelding, Shop Foreman Freightliner trucks replied 1 month ago

did they check if any other dealer had them??

Roy

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
None
Technician: roybelding, Shop Foreman Freightliner trucks replied 1 month ago

you need these to do the test. can you see if any other shop will lend them to you.

Roy

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Technician: roybelding, Shop Foreman Freightliner trucks replied 1 month ago

Please take a moment and rate my service 3 stars or better. that is the only way the site will pay me for my efforts.

Roy

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Changed the fuel pump and still not running
Technician: roybelding, Shop Foreman Freightliner trucks replied 1 month ago

why??? you did not do the test yet

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
The customer checked by different Mechanic and said just change it and the fuel on the high pressure on the old one was not flowing when crank the engine
Customer reply replied 1 month ago
When changed the new pump do we need to use the fly wheel timing pin
Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Or just align the TI to the dot on the fuel pump
Technician: roybelding, Shop Foreman Freightliner trucks replied 1 month ago

thats ok, no need to time.

did you remove the hot pipe and check for fuel in the pipe?? the U pipe to the exhaust manifold in the rear of the motor??

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Any pics please
Customer reply replied 1 month ago
By the way do I need to calibrate the new one
Technician: roybelding, Shop Foreman Freightliner trucks replied 1 month ago

no

it is the pipe, passenger rear from the back of the exhaust manifold. It is shaped like a U. It has 2 clamps to remove

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Technician: roybelding, Shop Foreman Freightliner trucks replied 1 month ago

correct

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
No fuel
Technician: roybelding, Shop Foreman Freightliner trucks replied 1 month ago

ok Do you have the DDDL program for running the FSIC test yet?? the next step is this test. you need the caps as well.

Roy

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Caps back order
Technician: roybelding, Shop Foreman Freightliner trucks replied 1 month ago

you need to either borrow them from someone or send this one to a shop that can do the tests

Roy

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Computer showing fuel quantity control valve but we change it new came with new fuel pump
Technician: roybelding, Shop Foreman Freightliner trucks replied 1 month ago

code??? what code????

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Technician: roybelding, Shop Foreman Freightliner trucks replied 1 month ago

157

82.1  SPN 157/FMI 16 - EPA07 - EPA10 - GHG14

Fuel Rail Pressure Too Low

SPN 157/FMI 16

DescriptionFuel Rail Pressure Too Low

Monitored ParameterInjector Cylinder #1 Needle Control Valve

Typical Enabling ConditionsFuel Rail Pressure desired - Fuel Rail Pressure Actual > 200 bar

Monitor SequenceNone

Execution FrequencyContinuous When Enabling Conditions Met

Typical DurationEight Seconds

Dash LampsMIL, CEL

Engine ReactionDerate 25%

VerificationEngine Idle (One Minute)

The Motor Control Module (MCM) monitors the rail pressure and when rail pressure deviation is greater than 200 bar for eight seconds, the MCM sets the code. This fault can occur due to the conditions listed below:

  • External fuel leakage between the high pressure pump and fuel injectors
  • Pressure limiting valve leakage (internal)
  • Fuel filter integrity (loose caps, plugged filters)
  • Fuel supply issues (fuel level, fuel aeration, leaking fuel lines, fuel restrictions)
  • Intermittent loss of engine speed signal
  • High pressure pump internal failure
  • Fuel injector (amplifier or needle) leakage
  • Fuel Contamination
  • Rail pressure sensor
  • Motor Control Module (MCM)

Service Tools Used in the Procedure

Tool NumberDescription

J-48876Test Gauge, Primer Port, HDE

J-48704Caps, HP Fuel Rail, HDE

DiagnosticLink®

NOTE: It is important to obtain information from the customer on when the check engine lamp occurs and if there were any performance concerns or exhaust smoke.

Show/Hide Checkboxes

NOTE: On EPA10 engines with MCM software 7.6 and later, fuel tank level at the time the fault triggered can be viewed in extended data #5, “Enhanced Environmental data” Fuel Tank Level.

NOTE: Do not reset this counter unless the PLV is being replaced.

NOTE: Engines not equipped with a Low Pressure Pump Outlet (LPPO) sensor should utilize J-48706 Fuel Diagnostic Gauge Set to monitor LPPO.

  1. Did SPN 157/FMI 16 appear after the fuel system was repaired or fuel filter maintenance was performed?
    1. Yes; the code may be set due to air in the fuel system. Clear codes and road test to verify complaint. If code does not set, release the vehicle. If code sets, Go to step 2.
    2. No; Go to step 2.
  2. Turn the ignition ON (key ON, engine OFF).
  3. Check and record fuel level in all fuel tanks. Is fuel level blow ¼ tank (25%)?
    1. Yes; add fuel and road test vehicle. If code does not become active during road test, release the truck. If the code becomes active during the road test with over ¼ tank (or 25%) of fuel, Go to step 4.
    2. No; view fuel tank level in extended data (EPA10) or question the driver about the fuel level when the code was set. If the level was under ¼ tank (or 25%), fuel sloshing in the tank could be the cause of aerated fuel that could cause this code. If the fuel level was over ¼ tank (or 25%) when the code was set, Go to step 4.
  4. Check for fuel contamination, including Diesel Exhaust Fluid (DEF), water, gasoline, kerosene, coolant, etc. Is contamination found?
    1. Yes; refer to section "Contaminated Fluids."
    2. No;Go to step 5.
  5. Visually inspect for external fuel leaks on the engine and on the chassis.
    1. If a leak is found, repair leak. Refer to section "Verify Repairs" .
    2. If no leaks are found, Go to step 6.
  6. Using DiagnosticLink 8.x, check for multiple codes.
    1. If any of the additional fault codes are active, perform the associated diagnostics first:
      • SPN 94 / FMI 15 Fuel Filter plugged
      • SPN 94 / FMI 16 Fuel Filter plugged
      • SPN 97 / FMI 15 Water in the fuel
      • SPN 157 / FMI 1 Rail Pressure too High.
      • SPN 164 / FMI (All) Rail pressure sensor faults
      • SPN 174 / FMI 0 Fuel Temperature too High
      • SPN 679 / FMI 7 PLV stuck open
      • SPN 723 / FMI (all) Cam Sensor Codes
      • SPN 636 / FMI (all) crank sensor codes
      • SPN 1077 / FMI 5, 6 or 14
    2. If only SPN 1077/7, 157/16 or 1077/31 is present, Go to step 7.
  7. Using DiagnosticLink 8.x, check the value of Pressure Limiting Valve (PLV) openings. With key ON, engine OFF select the Actions tab in the top tool bar. Select Fuel System, then Pressure Limiting Valve (PLV) Change or view (E2P_RPG_CTR_PLV_OPEN) under “Extended Data Record Number 5th” list. View and record the PLV open counts. Is the counter greater than 50?
    1. Yes; replace the PLV. Refer to section "Removal of the Pressure Limiting Valve - Three-Filter System" . Verify repairs. Refer to section "Verify Repairs" .
    2. No;Go to step 8.
  8. Perform Automatic Fuel system integrity check (FSIC) routine using DiagnosticLink. With key ON, Engine OFF (KOEO) start the Automatic FSIC. The software/tool will ask to start the engine when required. Once the engine is running, the software will have the engine enter and exit several engine operating conditions. Follow the on-screen instructions and key ON and OFF as necessary. Go to step 9.
  9. Did the FSIC detect a leak?
    1. Yes; perform the High Pressure Fuel System - Leak Test.
      For three-filter fuel system, Refer to section "High Pressure Fuel System - Leak Test - Three-Filter Fuel System" .
    2. No; Go to step 10.
  10. Does it take longer than two minutes and 30 seconds for rail pressure to bleed down below 10 bar?
    1. Yes; perform the Idle Speed Balance Test to attempt to identify a faulty injector. Refer to section "Idle Speed Balance Test" .
    2. No; Go to step 11.
  11. Does Kw/Nw show/stay “ON / Enabled / True” while the engine is running during the Automatic FSIC routine?
    1. Yes; Go to step 12.
    2. No; refer to troubleshooting for SPN 723/FMI 10.
  12. At 600 rpm, is ASL003 Fuel Compensation Pressure within range per the fuel pressure chart? Refer to section "Normal Fuel System Pressures - Three-Filter Fuel System"
    1. Yes; Go to step 14.
    2. No; Go to step 13.
  13. Monitor AS124 LPPO sensor (if equipped) or use manual gauge J-48706. Is the pressure in range at 600 and 1800 rpm? Refer to section "Normal Fuel System Pressures - Three-Filter Fuel System"
    1. Yes; Go to step 14.
    2. No; repair cause of incorrect fuel pressure. Refer to section "Normal Fuel System Pressures - Three-Filter Fuel System" .
  14. Monitor AS124 LPPO (if equipped) and ASL003 Fuel Compensation Pressure at all engine speeds; are pressures stable with no oscillations?
    1. Yes; Go to step 15.
    2. No; pressures are unstable WITH oscillations of more than 1.5 psi at a steady rpm, Refer to section "Aerated Fuel Test - Three-Filter Fuel System" .
  15. Check the Idle Speed Balance (ISB) Values. Refer to section "Idle Speed Balance Test" . Are there any cylinders above 70% or below -70%?
    1. Yes; Follow repair procedures in “Idle Speed Balance (ISB) test” and verify repairs. Refer to section "Verify Repairs" .
    2. No; Go to step 16.
  16. Is ASL001 Rail Pressure erratic or does it have a saw tooth pattern?

    NOTE: See examples of erratic pressure showing (1) ASL001 Rail pressure and (2) AS098 Desired rail pressure.

    1. Yes; Go to step 17.
    2. No; Go to step 18.
  17. Perform the aerated fuel test. Refer to section "Aerated Fuel Test - Three-Filter Fuel System" . Was fuel aerated?
    1. Yes; repair cause of aerated fuel. Refer to section "Aerated Fuel Test - Three-Filter Fuel System" .
    2. No; replace the Quantity Control Valve. Refer to section "Removal of the Quantity Control Valve - Three-Filter System" .
  18. Perform Pressure Limiting valve flow test. Refer to section "Pressure Limiting Valve Flow Test - Three-Filter Fuel System" . Did the PLV flow test pass?
    1. Yes; Go to step 19.
    2. No; replace the PLV. Refer to section "Removal of the Pressure Limiting Valve - Three-Filter System" .
  19. Inspect the Low pressure fuel system for leaks. Refer to section "FIS Low Pressure Leak Test - Three-Filter Fuel System" . Are leaks present?

    NOTICE:

    Prime fuel system prior to going to next step. Refer to section "Priming the Fuel System - Three-Filter System" .
    1. Yes; repair as necessary. Refer to section "FIS Low Pressure Leak Test - Three-Filter Fuel System" .
    2. No; Go to step 20.
  20. Cap the rail at all six injector feed connections using J-48704 injector rail caps and crank the engine for 10 seconds. Does the ASL001 rail pressure reach AS098 desired rail pressure?
    1. Yes; Go to step 21.
    2. No; Replace high pressure pump. Refer to section "Removal of the High Pressure Fuel Pump - Three-Filter System" .
  21. With the injectors still capped after cranking engine for 10 seconds. Does the rail pressure bleed down under 100 bar in less than five minutes?
    1. Yes; replace the high pressure fuel pump.
    2. No; Go to step 22.
  22. Using DiagnosticLink 8.x, navigate to Service Routines and Fuel System Integrity Check test and select Manual FSIC. Test drive the truck to see if the code sets. Did the code become active?
    1. Yes; Go to step 23.
    2. No; replace fuel filters and release vehicle to customer.
  23. Remove the MCM 120-Pin connector. Inspect for damage including fuel, water corrosion or bent terminals. Is any damage found?
    1. Yes; repair as needed.
    2. No; Go to step 24.
  24. Install a test MCM using the extension harness and test drive the truck. Does the Code come active?
    1. Yes; Go to step 25.
    2. No; replace MCM and verify repair.
  25. Inspect chassis fuel system for restrictions or debris. Refer to OEM procedures. Is there a chassis fuel system issue?
    1. Yes; identify source of issue and repair as necessary.
    2. No; replace fuel filters and release to customer.
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Technician: roybelding, Shop Foreman Freightliner trucks replied 1 month ago

520 do this first, it may be a bad ecm

566.1 SPN 520250/FMI 4 - EPA10

Quantity Control Valve Low Side Driver Error

This condition can occur when:

  • MCM pin 2 circuit is shorted to power
  • Internal short of the quantity control valve

Show/Hide Checkboxes

  1. Disconnect the Quantity Control Valve (QCV) harness connector.
  2. Ensure the multi-meter or Digital Voltage Ohm Meter (DVOM) resistance is set to zero.
    1. If meter can auto–zero, perform this function before making a resistance measurement.
    2. If meter cannot auto–zero, note the resistance of the leads and subtract it from the measurement taken in step 3.
  3. Measure the resistance across pins 1 and 2 of the quantity control valve.
    1. If the resistance is less than 1.3 ohms, replace quantity control valve. Refer to section "Installation of the Quantity Control Valve - Three-Filter System" .
    2. If the resistance is between 1.3 ohms and 1.4 ohms, Go to step 4.
  4. Disconnect the 120-pin Motor Control Module (MCM) connector and check for corroded, bent or broken pins. Ensure both the MCM and harness connector pins are checked. Repair or replace if needed.
  5. Turn ignition ON (key ON, engine OFF).
  6. Measure the voltage at pin 2 of the quantity control valve harness connector.
    1. If the voltage is 0, replace the MCM. Refer to section "Installation of the Motor Control Module" .
    2. If the voltage is greater than 0, repair the short circuit between pin 2 of the quantity control valve harness connector and battery.
Ask Your Own Medium and Heavy Trucks Question
Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Changed the ecm, run the truck after hard time, then we noticed the fuel level started to get higher than before, diesel starts leaking from back of the sleeper, hard to open fuel tanks, level going to top in big clear filter
Technician: roybelding, Shop Foreman Freightliner trucks replied 1 month ago

that indicates a clogged fuel filter on the devco. change the fuel filter.

Roy

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Good morning, when install the fuel pump we put the TI mark straight with the Dot mark, but my mechanic did not DTC the Engine,
Technician: roybelding, Shop Foreman Freightliner trucks replied 1 month ago

fuel pump does not need to be timed

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Crank no start
Technician: roybelding, Shop Foreman Freightliner trucks replied 1 month ago

that mark is there so the flange will fit through the block. if it is not at that mark, the pump will not go through the opening without turning it

you said it was running????

Roy

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
After 12 hours of trying with starter fluid starts , the we gave a lot of pressure so we had to drain almost 80 gallons of fuel
Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Please let me know about the pic because my mechanic did not TDC
Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Not running
Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Crank no start , now
Technician: roybelding, Shop Foreman Freightliner trucks replied 1 month ago

I told you about the tdc 2 times. read my responses

did you prime the system with the esoc tool??

Roy

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Please I need a clear answer,
Customer reply replied 1 month ago
About tdc
Technician: roybelding, Shop Foreman Freightliner trucks replied 1 month ago

I did.

the mark is there only to align the pump to fit through the hole in the block due to the flange on the end of the pump. if you did not align it then the pump will not fit through until you turn the end of the pump so it will go through. a lot of guys take that flange off and do not re install when replacing to make it easy to install.

Roy

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
no need for TDC
Technician: roybelding, Shop Foreman Freightliner trucks replied 1 month ago

As I stated 3 times, that is correct

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Thanks we prime system nothing so far
Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Removed all filters same no start just cranking
Technician: roybelding, Shop Foreman Freightliner trucks replied 1 month ago

you need to do the FSIC test

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Fuel injector has ground no hot
Technician: roybelding, Shop Foreman Freightliner trucks replied 1 month ago

if it has a ground, it has power. that does not make sense. how are you checking it?

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Open ignitionand check all screws on top of Injuctor , all was ground
Technician: roybelding, Shop Foreman Freightliner trucks replied 1 month ago

last 6 of the vin??

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
BM7448
Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Still building pressure in the big filter
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It was starting fine parked took my 30 min break came back try to start it won't start… read more
cumminsdr
cumminsdr
Mechanic
High School or GED
1,225 satisfied customers
2005 kw 900 cat c15 engine. the brake lights are one with
2005 kw 900 cat c15 engine. the brake lights are one with engine off and not touching the pedal… read more
Jackie Dempsey
Jackie Dempsey
Heavy Line Technician
Automotive and Diesel Engines
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Peterbilt 379. I flopped my 05 Pete 379 with 63 flat top and
Peterbilt 379. I flopped my 05 Pete 379 with 63 flat top bunk and skidded down the highway on passenger side. They wrote it off, of coarse because it's age. I want to rebuilt it but have conflicting i… read more
Jeremy
Jeremy
Certified Truck/Bus Technician
Vocational, Technical or Trade School
2,019 satisfied customers
07 cat c7 with sound like it is skipping and is blowing
07 cat c7 with sound like it is skipping and is blowing smoke out exhaust ran computer on it and no code for injector turned each one off and no change. had a code for low fuel pressure has 65 psi and… read more
Cat Man
Cat Man
Cat Engine Expert
Vocational, Technical or Trade Scho
4,247 satisfied customers
I'm down here in Oz, where it is mid afternoon. 2011
Hi! I'm down here in Oz, where it is mid afternoon. 2011 Freightliner Argosy COE Detroit Series 60 ADR 80.02 14 litre, low mileage VIN 1FVJAWCK8BLAW2823 Fault is full time buzzer Previously intermitte… read more
Jeremy
Jeremy
Certified Truck/Bus Technician
Vocational, Technical or Trade School
2,019 satisfied customers
Is it possible to swap a lb7 with a lbz if so what all have
Second opinion] is it possible to swap a lb7 with a lbz if so what all have to be retro fitted or altered?… read more
Jeremy
Jeremy
Certified Truck/Bus Technician
Vocational, Technical or Trade School
2,019 satisfied customers
We have a fault issue with a Doppstadt DT72 which is very
We have a fault issue with a Doppstadt DT72 which is very similar to the Doppstadt DT52 machine . We cannot clear a fault code which we suspect is related to ADD Blue and the fault is derating the mac… read more
Jeremy
Jeremy
Certified Truck/Bus Technician
Vocational, Technical or Trade School
2,019 satisfied customers
I have the same problem had with the thermostat housing
I have the same problem Doug had with the thermostat housing having a tube that runs to the water pump. Where should the tube separate? At the housing or at the water pump? … read more
Wayne
Wayne
Journeyman
Vocational, Technical or Trade Scho
2,640 satisfied customers
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Disclaimer: Information in questions, answers, and other posts on this site ("Posts") comes from individual users, not JustAnswer; JustAnswer is not responsible for Posts. Posts are for general information, are not intended to substitute for informed professional advice (medical, legal, veterinary, financial, etc.), or to establish a professional-client relationship. The site and services are provided "as is" with no warranty or representations by JustAnswer regarding the qualifications of Experts. To see what credentials have been verified by a third-party service, please click on the "Verified" symbol in some Experts' profiles. JustAnswer is not intended or designed for EMERGENCY questions which should be directed immediately by telephone or in-person to qualified professionals.

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