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Andy
Andy, Truck Diagnostic Technician
Category: Medium and Heavy Trucks
Satisfied Customers: 1615
Experience:  International trucks, International, Maxxforce and Cummins engines, diagnostic, electrical, Hvac and refrigeration repairs
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2006 international 7500 ht 570 no start issue. Please help

Customer Question

2006 international 7500 ht 570 no start issue. Please help
Submitted: 2 years ago.
Category: Medium and Heavy Trucks
Customer: replied 2 years ago.
Have codes 625 14p,2023 14p 613 14p
Already checked hp oil 800 at crank 1000 at run 5000 at max
Expert:  Andy replied 2 years ago.
That is a body controller code. Try this procedure.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/f526i7b69ifw887/How%20to%20check%20codes%20three%20digit.txt?dl=0
Customer: replied 2 years ago.
111 then 2 red flashes then 221,222,334,312,332,227,626,422,423,424,425,426,145.
Expert:  Andy replied 2 years ago.
Can you try cranking again to try and start but after trying do not shut key off . leave it in on position and try procedure for codes again as this time something will be active .
Customer: replied 2 years ago.
Nothing same thing.
Expert:  Andy replied 2 years ago.
Can you hear the injectors cycling at key on ? And do you see any smoke from the stack at all ?
Customer: replied 2 years ago.
Don't remember hearing them and no dmoke
Customer: replied 2 years ago.
Smoke
Expert:  Andy replied 2 years ago.
Can you check the fuses in the battery box please to make sure they are tight and secure in their inline fuse holders ? Those fuses on top of the batteries are for the ECM , IDM and transmission if this has automatic tranny . We also should check the connectors along that harness . This smaller harness at the batteries is what we call your ECM and IDM clean power feed .
Customer: replied 2 years ago.
I checked all of those this morning. I also unplugged the ECM and check into it he power and ground.
Customer: replied 2 years ago.
I also did resistance testing
Expert:  Andy replied 2 years ago.
Have you checked the elay in the power distribution box for corrosion or spread terminals from heat due to excesssive resistance ?
Customer: replied 2 years ago.
Ignition relay? Yes. Pulled relays under hood also
Customer: replied 2 years ago.
Did voltage drop across relays no dirty terminals or loose connections
Expert:  Andy replied 2 years ago.
Would you prefer that we use skype to continue this session ? It may be quicker than posting back and forth ! I work for an International dealer and can get you whatever info you may need to get you back on the road. You would need to accept the additional offer however for me to be able to give you my skype info in a private box down below !
Customer: replied 2 years ago.
I'm not with the truck now so it wouldn't make sense for me to do this now. To.orrow morning would work better
Customer: replied 2 years ago.
What's a good time for u?
Expert:  Andy replied 2 years ago.
Unfortunately , I work days at the garage ! I can however help you with the info tonight on skype if you wish ! Or we can continue on here. Just would be easier to explain on an audio skype session .
Customer: replied 2 years ago.
I think I need to pass at this time on that offer.
Expert:  Andy replied 2 years ago.
Ok that 's fine. So out of all the codes you had in memory , all were inactive which makes it difficult to diagnose . What we can do is I can send you a hard start /no start diagnostic sheet to follow for that engine model and try and follow it the best you can and it will lead you to the problem at which point , We can go further with this . I can then send you the proper troubleshooting according to what you find using that sheet ! Does that sound good ?
Expert:  Andy replied 2 years ago.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/n9g0n72dvobtm9t/2004%20466%20egr%20hard%20and%20performance%202004.pdf?dl=0
Here is the link to the hard start/no start and performance sheet for that engine . You only need to follow the first page . Let me know when you get stuck and I can help out until we figure it out .
Customer: replied 2 years ago.
Injectors are clicking
Expert:  Andy replied 2 years ago.
OK so if injectors are clicking, is it trying to fire ?
Customer: replied 2 years ago.
No. I disconnected the intake heater and gave it a small shot of starting fluid and it started momentarily.
Customer: replied 2 years ago.
Something I just thought of. When the truck came in I started with the fuel system. The primer was very hard to pump. I pulled the lines from the filter housing and there was alot of pressure in the line from the transfer pump to the filter housing. I'm not sure what the restriction was .I replaced the gaskets @ the fuel lines and have not had the issue since. The truck dies at at stop light. There were no previous complaints.
Customer: replied 2 years ago.
The filter was out at the Time and the bowl was less than half full. Thanks for your patience.
Expert:  Andy replied 2 years ago.
Have you replaced the fuel pressure regulator ?
Customer: replied 2 years ago.
No where is the regulator and what is the fuel pressure spec.? There seems to be good pressure at the test port.
Customer: replied 2 years ago.
On the low pressure side.
Customer: replied 2 years ago.
I pushed the shader valve I to see if there was any fuel in the rail. Statically and the fuel squirted out about 5 feet
Expert:  Andy replied 2 years ago.
The fuel pressure regulator is located inside the fuel filter housing ! If you pull the filter out , you will see an allen head bolt at the bottom next to the standpipe. This guy is what is supposed to maintain your fuel system at about 60 psi throughout all fuel demands assuming your fuel pump is not weak.
Customer: replied 2 years ago.
Ok so if the injectors are clicking, does that mean we should start if there is no fuel issue? And this regulator is after the primer pump? Correct.what do you believe the excessive back pressure between the filter housing and the transfer pp would be due to? Or should I forget about that?
Customer: replied 2 years ago.
Can a bad regulator be spotted by a visual inspection?
Expert:  Andy replied 2 years ago.
In most case no but it is an inexpensive part . I usually check fuel pressure at the schrader and if the filter and strainer underneath the filter were clean , but the fuel pressure is low , I start by replacing the pressure regulator to try and bring the pressure back up to near 60 psi while at idle . If pressure is still not getting to 60 at idle , the next step would be to replace the transfer pump mounted on the high pressure pump . It is more expensive to replace so you want to start with the regulator that is only 30 dollars or so to see if that cures the issue .
Customer: replied 2 years ago.
Ok 60 psi. Will it reach that while cranking?
Expert:  Andy replied 2 years ago.
No you need minimum 20 psi while cranking to start the engine .
Customer: replied 2 years ago.
Yea I deffinatley have that much. Any other sugestions?
Expert:  Andy replied 2 years ago.
Ok so recap ! The injectors are cycling , you have minimum 20 psi fuel pressure , What is your cranking rpm ? You need at least 130 RPM minimum to build enough compression to ignite the fuel in the cylinders . Please check RPM gauge while cranking to see that you have at least 130 RPM . Also EGR valve must be completely closed while trying to start or you will not get enough fresh air to ignite the mixture in the combustion chamber .
Customer: replied 2 years ago.
Ok egr is good info. No tach while cranking. If it was an rpm issue. Wouldn't the engine keep running when I sprayed it with starter fluid. Instead dying?
Expert:  Andy replied 2 years ago.
You do not see any cranking rpm ?
Customer: replied 2 years ago.
Correct... I didn't think it was an issue because I checked another truck and the rpm Guage didn't move until the truck started. Did I miss something important?
Customer: replied 2 years ago.
The guy who had it b4 me replaced both crank sensors and the cram sensor. Not to forget the high pressure oil sensor
Expert:  Andy replied 2 years ago.
You should be able to see cranking rpm . Needle barely moves but goes up almost 2 notches from the 0 . If you don't see any speed at all , you need to check with a scanner capable of live data and seee if you see any speed on there. If not , you will need to investigate why . Possible wiring to the crank sensor or cam sensor that is damaged. Tug test the wiring at those sensors to make sure wires are not broken right behind the connectors .
Customer: replied 2 years ago.
Are these analog sensors? Can I hook up an ossiliscope and crank engine. To check for the signal? Sine wave or digital sensors? I think there all two wire, so the must be magnetic pulse generating?
Customer: replied 2 years ago.
Can u send me a diagram as to which terminals in the ecu the cam and crank sensors input on?
Expert:  Andy replied 2 years ago.
Here is the info on them :
A magnetic pickup sensor generates an alternating frequency that indicates speed. Magnetic pickups have a two wire connection for signal and ground. This sensor has a permanent magnetic core surrounded by a wire coil. The signal frequency is generated by the rotation of gear teeth that disturb the magnetic field.
Crankshaft Position (CKP)
The CKP sensor provides the ECM with a signal that indicates crankshaft speed and position. As the crankshaft turns the CKP sensor detects a 60 tooth timing disk on the crankshaft. Teeth 59 and 60 are missing. By comparing the CKP signal with the CMP signal, the ECM calculates engine rpm and timing requirements. The CKP is installed in the top left side of the flywheel housing.
NOTE: This long CKP sensor, used with International® DT 466, DT 570, and HT 570 diesel engines, is the Camshaft Position (CMP) sensor used with other International® diesel engines.
Camshaft Position (CMP)
The CMP sensor provides the ECM with a signal that indicates camshaft position. As the cam rotates, the sensor identifies the position of the cam by locating a peg on the cam. The CMP is installed in the front cover, above and to the right of the water pump pulley.
NOTE: This short CMP sensor, used with International® DT 466, DT 570, and HT 570 diesel engines, is the Crankshaft Position (CKP) sensor used with other International® diesel engines.
Expert:  Andy replied 2 years ago.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/ur3qc1z1m7wj8zz/dt%20466%20with%20egr%20wiring%20diagram.pdf?dl=0
Here is the wiring diagram !
Customer: replied 2 years ago.
Awesome thx. Do you know if it's sine wave or square??? Probably square...
Customer: replied 2 years ago.
Never mind I just read the article. Thx
Customer: replied 2 years ago.
Ok same as a car on the sensors. Thx I'll up date u tomorrw
Customer: replied 2 years ago.
I've got two in the timing cover and one in the bell housing. Which is which? I know bell housing is crab the long one
Expert:  Andy replied 2 years ago.
The one in the bell housing is your crank sensor . The one in the front cover by the water pump is the cam sensor
Expert:  Andy replied 2 years ago.
Hi there ! Looking for an update on this!Do you still need help ? Let me know !
Happy to help further if needed !
Please do not forget to rate my service to you at the end of this session ! That is the only way that I am rewarded on here . Thank you
Expert:  Andy replied 2 years ago.
Hi there ! How are we doing on this ? Do you still need help ? Let me know ! I am available to go on Skype and we can have an audio chat about this and diagnose the issue that way if that helps! I have everything you need to solve this issue .
Please do not forget to RATE my service to you at the end of this session ! That is the only way that I am rewarded on here ! Thank you !

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