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2000 jeep grand cherokee Lmt 4.7l v-8 no start. cranks and

runs for a second but...
2000 jeep grand cherokee Lmt 4.7l v-8 no start. cranks and runs for a second but will not stay running. fuel pump is pumping gas to fuel rail but no pressure at shrader valve. cannot figure out how this can be happening
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Answered in 3 minutes by:
8/1/2017
kalamykid
kalamykid, Shop Owner/ Tech
Category: Jeep
Satisfied Customers: 4,560
Experience: I HAVE OWNED MY OWN SHOP FOR OVER THREE YEARS. I HAVE THE TOOLS AND SOFTWARE TO ANSWERE ALMOST ANY Q
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The fuel pump is a one piece set up, that has the fuel pressure regulator made into it. If any of the lines in the pump are cracked, the pressure will divert back into the fuel tank. If you have no pressure at the fuel rail, you will have to replace the fuel pump.

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Customer reply replied 3 months ago
I Have accessed the fuel pump and disconnected the fuel line and it is pumping gas. i have disconnected the fuel line from the fuel rail and it is getting fuel. How do I measure fuel pressure at the end of the fuel line. why does the gas being pumped to the rail not pressurize the fuel rail. I recently replaced all 8 single hole injectors with bosch 4 hole. there is no leaking around injectors.

If the pump has a leak in the system in the tank, the pump can push fuel through the lines, but once pressure starts to build, it will just dump the pressure back into the fuel tank. You have to remember that volume is not pressure.

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Prim example, take a straw and stick your finger over one end, then blow into the other. You create pressure in the straw. Now poke a hole in the straw and do it again, you still have the same amount of volume being pushed into the straw, but no pressure as it leaks out the hole.

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Customer reply replied 3 months ago
Before I pull out the fuel pump is there a way to measure pressure at the pump. Like hold my finger over the outlet to see if gas squirts under pressure?

The best thing to do would be to get a fuel pressure tester and connect it to the line going to the fuel rail. This way you can see how much pressure the fuel pump can create, with out a risk of fire or injury.

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Customer reply replied 3 months ago
I have already done that. Did you read my original info. There is no pressure at the shraeder valve yet fuel is flowing to the rail as I disconnected the fuel line from the rail and turned the key on and gas flowed in a jar.

Connect a fuel pressure tester to the line and see what the pressure is at the end of the hose. You asked me how best to test the for pressure. If you are not getting any pressure at the shrader valve, then you will not get any pressure anywhere along the line either. You will HAVE to replace the fuel pump to get the truck to start and run correctly.

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Customer reply replied 3 months ago
Ok I'll give it a try. Autozone has a loaner pressure gage kit. Any idea what the pressure reading should be?

It should be around 50 psi.

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Customer reply replied 3 months ago
Ok I'll let you know how I make out

Thank you.

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Customer reply replied 3 months ago
Fuel pump arrived late today. I plan to install tomorrow. I'll let you know if it solves my problem. Thanks

Thank you for the update.

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Customer reply replied 3 months ago
I have just finished installing a new fuel pump and there is no improvement. Car starts for about one second then dies. Then it cranks but does not start. Looks like I just wasted money on a new fuel pump plus the effort to install it. Any ideas what to try next short of having it towed for repair?

Did you check the fuel pressure at the fuel rail after replacing the pump?

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Customer reply replied 3 months ago
I'll have to get a gage but I'll bet there is still no pressure

Did you get just the pump or did you get the whole assembly?

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Customer reply replied 3 months ago
I got the complete unit. Looked just like the one I removed.

Where did you get the new pump from?

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Customer reply replied 3 months ago
eBay with a lifetime warranty for about $100
Customer reply replied 3 months ago
Went back to autozone to get the fuel pressure test kit. I connected to the Schroeder valve and it reads about 50psi and holds there but I still don't get a start. Just turns over and over. I replaced the fuel injectors with new 4 hole Bosch injectors can that be a problem. It ran after I changed them though.

lets do some testing and see if you have an injector pulse. Do you have a set of noid lights, digital volt meter and a test light to do the testing with?

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Customer reply replied 3 months ago
I have a digital volt meter. But you'll have to guide me through

Do you have a test light and a set of noid lights as well?

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Customer reply replied 3 months ago
No just the volt meter

We can work around the test light, but you will need a set of noid lights as the meter will not read fast enough to test for injector pulse. Have you taken the fuel pressure tester back yet? If not take it back and swap them for a set of noid lights please.

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Customer reply replied 3 months ago
I may be able to borrow what I need from autozone. Are we done with the pressure gage?

Yes you are done with the fuel pressure tester. We know that the fuel pump is working and building pressure now.

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Customer reply replied 3 months ago
Ok

Let me know when you have the noid lights and we can do the testing.

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Customer reply replied 3 months ago
Ok out with the family today

Have a good day.

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Customer reply replied 3 months ago
Ok I have the noir lights. What next?

Unplug an injector and install a noid light that will fit into the plug. Turn the engine over and see if the noid light will flash please.

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Customer reply replied 3 months ago
I checked 6 of 8 injector connectors and they all flash repeatedly. The other two were hard to get to without disconnecting the fuel rail.

Can you check and see if you have spark please. With the fuel pressure at the rail, and you have injector pulse, you have to be missing spark, or the timing is off.

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Customer reply replied 3 months ago
After the car sits for several hours and I try to start it, it will catch right away and run for about one second. I'll check for spark tomorrow. What is the best way? Can the crank or cam sensor be bad. I had a hard start problem about 6 months ago and the cam and crank sensors were replaced and it ran fine.

If it will start for a second or two, then you have to have spark during that time. The best way to check for spark is to use a spark tester, but you can unplug a spark plugs wire from a spark plugs and stick a screw driver into the boot and the hold the screw driver close to a metal surface and have some one turn the engine over for you and watch for spark to jump from the screw driver to the metal surface. You will want to do this when the engine will not start. You either are loosing spark, or the injectors are stopped up.

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Customer reply replied 3 months ago
My 2000 jeep Cherokee has coil over plugs which I just replaced 8 coils and plugs.
Customer reply replied 3 months ago
How do I test the injectors. They're brand new also.

Checking the injectors is kinda hard to do. You have to have a bracket to hold the injectors in the fuel rail so you can see the bottoms of the injectors to see if they are spraying fuel. To check for spark, pull a coil out and test it the same way you would if you have a plug wire, as long as the coil is plugged up, you can test for spark.

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Customer reply replied 3 months ago
I checked the front 4 plugs and they are getting spark

Then when the fuel pump went out, the pump must have sent debris up and into the injectors. I believe you may be able to correct this problem by pulling the injectors and cleaning them. This will be kinda hard to do as you will have to power the injectors with a 9 volt battery to hold them open so you can blow air backwards through the injectors.

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Customer reply replied 3 months ago
Ok I've seen this done on utube so I'll give it a try. How does the bad timing idea work. The timing chain is a difficult fix. How does it affect the no start condition. Would spraying starting fluid into the intake tell anything.

Do not use starting fluid. It is to volital and can damage the engine. You can use a good carb cleaner such as GUMOUT and see if it will stay running if you are spraying it into the intake. I do not think the timing is an issue as the truck will start and run.

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Customer reply replied 3 months ago
Disconnected neg battery cable and I took all 8 fuel injectors out and attached the 9v battery and blew compressed air though each one. All holes appeared clear. Replaced them and there is no change. Engine catches for a few seconds and then dies. Cranks but no start!

Will it start with carb cleaner?

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Customer reply replied 3 months ago
It seems to want to run with the carb cleaner. It spits and sputters. I'm about out of patience and it may be time to have it towed.

This makes no sense. If you have fuel pressure, injector pulse, and spark the engine should run. Did you do a compression test on this engine?

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Customer reply replied 3 months ago
No. How do I do that? I think I have spark and fuel but not at the right time. The spark must not be firing at the same time the fuel injects. What controls this sequence, the timing chain?
Customer reply replied 3 months ago
I know I have fuel pressure as one of the injectors was not seated properly and I can hear it sizzle.

You will need a compression tester. You should be able to get one from the parts store you have been getting your test tools from. To do a compression test, all you have to do is screw the tester into the spark plug holes and turn the engine over. Can you send me a pic of the spark plugs when you pull them out please? I would like to be able to see what the spark plug can tell me.

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Customer reply replied 3 months ago
Ok I'll pick up the compression gage. What am I looking for. Any thought on my timing questions

Let me know what the compression is for each cylinder, and I do mean for each one not an average, and I can tell you if you have a timing issue.

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Can I also get you to get a sample of the fuel for me? What I need you to do is disconnect the fuel line email at the rail, stick it into a container that is clear like a two litter bottle, and turn the engine over. I need to see what comes es out and how much please. If you can time how long you are turning the engine over to half fill the two litter bottle please so I can check the flow rate.

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Customer reply replied 3 months ago
Just finished the compression test. Cylinders 1-3-5-7 all read "0"
Cylinders 2-4-6-8 all read 120
This does not sound good. I put oil into cylinder 1 and it still read "0"

I hate to say it but I believe that you are a victim of the dreaded valve seat drop out. The valve seats are bad about falling out of the head and braking up and going all through the engine. You will need to remove the head and see what has really happened.

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The first thing you should do is pull both valve covers off so we can check the cap timing and see if it has jumped time. You may get lucky and the timing chain guide has broken and the timing has jumped.

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If you would pull the valve covers off and send me a pic of the two cam gears I can tell you what needs to be done next.

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Customer reply replied 3 months ago
Ok I'll work on that tomorrow. The last time I got this deep into a car was in 1967 on a 57 chevy belair convertible when I was 18. I'm 68 now and I'm having flash backs.

The you are in for a big surprise. The passenger valve cover is not to bad to get off, but the drivers side is. You will want to disconnect the fuel line at the fuel rail so you can get it out of the way, you will also need to unplug the injectors and remove the coils. This will give you the room you will need to get the drivers side valve cover off.

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Customer reply replied 3 months ago
Ok most of that is already done. I send pics when I have the covers off

Thank you.

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I hope it is just a timing issue.

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Customer reply replied 3 months ago
Yea, me too. I'm on a tight budget. I just spent a bundle on new muffler, tailpipe, coils, plugs, injectors, fuel filter, oil change, trans speed input/output sensors, new oil pan, cam and crankshaft sensors, syn oil filter change, new front boot/axle left and right. And new ball joints. I thought I could get a few mor miles out of this jeep as the body is in great shape and I carry a couple of kayaks on top.

She is a good looking Jeep.

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Customer reply replied 3 months ago
Thanks, ***** ***** Add a new fuel pump to the list.

If it has jumped time, then it will not be much to repair it, but if it is the valve seats, the engine will need to be replaced, repairing it will cost much more then a rebuilt engine.

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Customer reply replied 3 months ago
I've got the Driver's side cover off. Everything seems to look solid with no apparent damage. I did find some pieces of nylon tensioner bars which seems ominous. I'll work on the other side later today. I've attached some pics. Any thoughts?

That was what I was hopping to see. the timing chain guides have broken. You will have to pull the timing cover off so we can see how bad things are, but the good news is the timing has jumped an you may not have any damage to the pistons or valves. When you get the other side valve cover off, I need a pic of the cam gears looking straight back from the front so I can see as much of the front of the cam gears and the front of the head please.

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Customer reply replied 3 months ago
To get to the timing chain by removing the cover do you need to remove the grill and radiator?

You can just pull the radiator fan shroud and fan, but it will give you more room to work if you pull the radiator too. Pulling te grill; will not help you much at all and would not be needed.

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Customer reply replied 3 months ago
Still working on the passenger side cover. You said this one is easy but I'm having a hell of a time getting to the final 2 bolts in the back. I've rounded one so I need to go get a bolt extractor for a 10mm bolt.

When I have a bolt that rounds out, I use E sockets, "or inverted torques" and drive one on that will almost fit over the rounded bolt. I am sorry to hear that you are having a hard time with this side, If it where not for the rounded off bolt, it would have been the easier side.

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It is out of time for sure. But what is all over the passenger side cam gear?

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I hate to say it but the next step is to remove the timing cover.

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Customer reply replied 3 months ago
I scraped some of the stuff off and found another deposit on the tensioner bar that looked like metallic paint. It's fine metallic crud (i.e., attracted to a magnet). Must be from the metal to metal contact were the nylon guides broke off the tensioners. The nylon guides are in place on the tensioners that I can see on the timing gear so they must of come off the main timing chain.
OK, I will begin to take apart the front radiator etc. Any sage advice. I'm already worried I wont be able to reassemble what I have already disconnected.

Do not worry, I can guide you through putting it all back together. The balancer is going to be a pain, as you have to have a special puller to pull of a dodge balancer. You have to put a rod down into the crank bolt hole and use a three jaw puller to push against the rod to pull the balancer out. Once you get the timing cover off send me a pic so i can see every thing in the thing in the timing chain area. What I do not understand is if the passenger side is where the guides broke, why id the drivers side low on compression?

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Customer reply replied 3 months ago
I'll work on it over the next few days. I've been borrowing tools from my local AutoZone. They have a large selection of tools including pullers. When you say Dodge I assume you mean Chrysler/Jeep.

Yes.

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Customer reply replied 3 months ago
Thanks for hanging in there with me.

Not a problem. That is what I am here for.

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Customer reply replied 3 months ago
What special tools will I need to borrow from autozone to do the job?

Just the harmonic ballancer puller.

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Customer reply replied 3 months ago
Working diligently for the past 2 days. Got most everything out of the way. Having difficulty figuring out how to pull the last pulley at the bottom. Got a harmonic balancer from autozone but once I've removed the bolt there is nothing to screw down on to press the pulley off. Here are some picks. What is the secret?

You have the correct tool to do this job. Tack the long rod on the right of the case, and stick it into the bolt hole. Then with the three jaws in the center of the case start to screw the center bolt on the left top of the case into the center so it just starts to stick through the bottom of the puller hub. If you look at the ballancer itself it has three humps in the center, the legs of the three jaw puller have to lock in behind them, and the rod goes into the center of the center bolt. When you tighten the center bolt up it will tighten the jaws up against the ballancer bumps and push against the rod in the center of the crank pulling the ballancer off.

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that is the main timing chain that is bad. That would not cause the two cam timing chains to be off. If you look closely you will see the drivers side cam gears lower chain is cut very deep into the lower guide. You will need to replace the timing gear, guides and tentioners.

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Customer reply replied 3 months ago
All three chains and sprokets?. I see kits on line that have everything including new water pumps gaskets etc. Do I need new gaskets for the valve covers.

You need chains, guides, and tentioners, new gears and water pump would be nice, and yes I would replace the valve cover gaskets just to be on the safe side.

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So you need 3 chains, 4 guides, 3 tentioners, and the 4 gear set, timing cover gasket, and valve cover gaskets. If the water pump is old, and has not been replaced I would replace it as well. You will also need 2 gallons of G05 coolant. Do not put any other coolant in this system as it will cause the engine to over heat. Even the will mix with anything junk will cause it to over heat. You MUST use G05 coolant.

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And ofcourse you will need 7 quarts of oil and an oil filter.

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Customer reply replied 3 months ago
Prior to this problem I was dealing with a radiator leak. Antifreeze fluid leaked from the front when I stopped and parked. I added some Bart radiator leak sealer that didn't stop the problem. Now that I have access to the radiator IL do a pressure test to see if the radiator is ok. Does that Bart stuff gunk up the radiator?

Yes and the heater core as well.

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Customer reply replied 3 months ago
Any way to degunk it with a flush?

You can try to back flush it, it 90 % of the time it does no good, and the heater core will need to be replaced, if you loose heat.

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Customer reply replied 3 months ago
Today I'm going to begin removing the sprockets, gears and chains. Any special tips or tools needed. I ordered parts online so it will take a few days before they arrive.. I think I'll also replace the serpentine belt.

Can you send me an over all frontal view of the front of the engine so I have a wider view? This way I can see what you have to take off and what you do not.

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I need an over all view of the whole front of the engine not just the timing chain please.

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You should have removed the cam gear bolts before you pulled the chains. Do you have air tools, or an electric iumpact?

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Customer reply replied 3 months ago
I tried but it just turned with the chain in place. I have a compressor but no impact tools. I've seen how fast nuts come off with impact tools on utube videos. I can jam the teeth as I've ordered new gears etc. was the pic ok.

The pic was great. Sense you are going to replace the chains and gears, slip the center idler gear back into place with the two cam gear chains and slip the chains back over the cam gears. The use a pair of vise grips to pinch the chain tight just above the center idler gear to hold the chain tight. then you should be able to remove the cam bolt.

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Customer reply replied 3 months ago
Are you still confident that the compression lose is due to the timing. There was a lot of wear on the drivers side upper tensioner part of the holding pivot bolt was worn from chain abrasion.

yes I am sure the timing had jumped.

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Customer reply replied 3 months ago
Still waiting for parts to arrive. When setting the timing does the #1 piston need to be at the top of the stroke?

You have to line up the timing marks. I will post them for you so you know how to set them.

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Customer reply replied 3 months ago
Ok sounds good.

I have to go get some ink for my printer so I can post the timing marks for you. It will be later tonight before I can go into town to get it. I will post the diagrams for you as soon as I can.

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Customer reply replied 3 months ago
No big rush. The parts are scheduled for delivery Thursday

Thank you.

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Customer reply replied 2 months ago
Part for the timing kit arrived. I've been placing the nylon guides and tensionors in place. I want to make sure everything is perfect. I'll await your guidance

I just got my ink tonight. Will post the diagrams for you as soon as I get home. You want to put the guides and tentioners in last after the chains are in.

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Customer reply replied 2 months ago
Still trying to get the right (pass) camshaft sprocket off but no luck. The original left sprocket is sitting with the V8 mark at 12 o'clock but the right is not. If I rotate the right sprocket it "springs" into a detent position that is not with the V8 at 12.
Can I reuse the original sprockets. And how do I get the right sprocket lined up?
Also the crankshaft sprocket won't line up at 6 o'clock when the sprocket is on the spline. Can I rotate the crankshaft with a socket?

I am sorry I have not sent you the diagrams yet, the ink cartridge that I got last night is not any good. You will have to remove the gear off of the cam to get the chains on correctly. I use channel locks to hold the cam inplace to line up the marks to get the cam gear and chain back on. You have to set the lower chain in time first before you can put the cam chains on. The idler gear should be at 12 and the crank gear mark at 6. There should be a double black link that will line up with the 12 oclock mark on the idler gear, and a single black link that will line up with the 6 oclcock mark on the crank gear. Your kit may have the links in gold not black. Let me know when you have the main chain in time, and w can work on the cam gears and chains.

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To help you get the cam gear off that does not want to come off, take one of the old chains and loop it around the cam gear and take the rest of the chain and lay it along side the top side of the head, then down the side of the head and bolt the chain to the side of the block so it will hold the cam gear still so you can remove the bolt.

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Customer reply replied 2 months ago
I've been fooling around to see if I can get the chains lined and to see how everything fits together. I have the top cam sprockets set at V8 at 12 o'clock and the idler gear with the links in the windows. I don't have the crank at 6. How do I get the crank sprocket turned so the gear will line up at 6 o'clock. When I put the big bolt in and tighten it it goes in almost all the way and it feels like the treads are slipping. I've screwed it almost all the way in several times but I get scared that I will strip the treads
Customer reply replied 2 months ago
Another thing. When I was putting the chain over the left cam socket on of the rocker thinks fell out. Last back one on the left side.

I believe that you are correct. Did you get the main chain set correctly? Did you get the other cam gear off?

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Customer reply replied 2 months ago
Not yet I'm still working on it
Customer reply replied 2 months ago
I turned the crankshaft over to line up at 12 and 6. I'm trying to get the chains on.

Did you get the cam gear off?

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Where did the rocker come from?

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Customer reply replied 2 months ago
Drivers side back cylinder. It popped off when I was turning the left cam shaft through a few turns. Heard a clank and found it on the ground.

Did you turn the cam with the chain off?

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And your timing is off. Can you turn the crank backwards so the idler gear timing mark is at 12 please and send me another pic if the chains?

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Customer reply replied 2 months ago
I did turn the cam with the chain off but I put the rocker back in place. I moved the left sprocket one link and the gears are lining up better see photos attached

That looks much better. now do a compression test and see where your compression is.

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Customer reply replied 2 months ago
Should I torque the bolts down and release the tensioner pins. Also I have all the spark plugs and fuel injectors out. Do they need to be put back to check the compression?

Just snug everything down for now, and leave the injectors and plugs out. You will want to pull the fuel pump fuse and relay out as ill as the asd relay, that way fuel does not try to pump out all over the place.

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Do not pull the pins out just yet, let see what the compression test show first.

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Customer reply replied 2 months ago
I had to remove the battery and the tray to get at the bolts on the cover. So no power to anything. Do you want me to hand crank the engine with the compression connection in the plug hole.

I need you to reconnect the battery, so you can use the starter to turn it over, I also want you to make sure non of the rockers come off before you put the valve covers back on.

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Customer reply replied 2 months ago
I've disconnected all the sensors and drained oil no water etc. Is it ok to try to turn the engine over? What holds the rockers in place. The cam holds some but some seem loose.

You will need to add oil back into it, but you can leave everything off to do the compression test. And yes the cams hold the rockers in.

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Customer reply replied 2 months ago
Ok I'll give it a go tomorrow

Thank you.

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Customer reply replied 2 months ago
Still no compression on the drivers side

Did you check all of them on the driver side?

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Customer reply replied 2 months ago
I only checked the front 1,3,5 got depressed at that point and quit. The other side had 50 to 100 psi it ratchets up the longer I crank. I worry about cranking too much without oil getting to the engine

Did you not put oil back in it?

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Customer reply replied 2 months ago
Oil is in the oil pan but how does it get into the engine without the oil pump spinning. I brushed oil all over the chains, gears and rockers which did stay in place.

The pump turns off of the crank shaft, so as long as there is oil in the pan, the engine is getting oil.

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Can you turn the engine by hand and line up the timing marks on the crank and idler again and send me a pic of the timing chains so I can see if they are still in time? You do not have to line up the links on the chains, just bring the crank mark back to 6 and the idler mark back to 12.

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Can you send me a shot of the passenger side cam, as straight on as possible, it looks like it may be a tooth clockwise to far from the pic.

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They are all good. It was just the angle of the camera. Do you have an oil pressure gauge on the dash?

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When you where doing the compression test, did the oil pressure register on the gauge?

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Customer reply replied 2 months ago
I didn't notice as I was trying to watch the gauge for any signs of movement. This email tread is getting long. Would it make sense to switch to text msging

It is getting long. But there are only two options, and both will cost you a little bit more. You can open a new questions, or do the live phone call.

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Customer reply replied 2 months ago
Let's keep going until we figure out what is wrong. The cams look to bee in good shape and the oil and antifreeze don't show signs of mixing. The valves appear to be intact. I put a screwdriver in the spark plug hole and hand cranked and the #1 piston moves up and down. What are you thinking?

At this point I think you need to get an endo scope so we can see into the cylinders. Ebay has a good one that is wifi and will work with your smart phone or tablet.

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Customer reply replied 2 months ago
I can get a bore scope at my local auto zone but I'll have to get it tomorrow. What are we looking for?

That is alot of money to spend, the wifi endoscope will be around $20.00. But I would like to see down into the cylinders and be able to see the valves and the tops of the pistons.

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Customer reply replied 2 months ago
It a free loaner at auto zone. I've become a regular customer borrowing everything we've needed so far. My timing kit didn't come with a new gasket so I'm planing to use some grey gasket paste to seal up the timing cover when I put it back on. I'll use some red gasket around the water channels. I have a new water pump I plan to use but I decided not to install the new oil pump that came with the timing kit. Sound like a good plan?

NO. The timing cover gasket can not be reused. It will leak coolnt into the engine.

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Customer reply replied 2 months ago
Ok, I'll pick up a new gasket

Let me know when you have the scope and we will go over what to do next.

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Customer reply replied 2 months ago
Got the scope and the gasket. Looked in the spark plug holes and didn't see anything unusual. Piston #1 seemed a little more greasy than the others. Lenses only looks downward. It has a 90 degree mirror attachment but its to big to fit in the hole.

Did you rotate the lens so you could see the whole piston top? Are there any half moons on the top of the pistons?

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Customer reply replied 2 months ago
Didn't see any half moons. The scope has a button that seems to move the lens.

All that buttons does is change the camera view, it does not rotate the lens. You have to move the lens manually to see the entire piston.

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Customer reply replied 2 months ago
I forgot to mention that I tried checking the compression while watching the oil pressure gauge. It barely moved off "0". What does the oil pump do.
Customer reply replied 2 months ago
Still don't see anything that looks like a half moon or a dent from a valve. Rockers look good and all springs look good.
I'm getting about ready to try to put everything back together give it a try and if it won't start have it towed to the service station.
Customer reply replied 2 months ago
Ever do a leak down test. Just watched a utube video and I think I can hook up the compressor to the hose on the compression tester and give it a go. Wondering if I have to put the fuel injector and rail back to block off hole injector hole. I still can't understand hoe any compression can build up with the fuel injector out.
Customer reply replied 2 months ago
Just finished putting air into cylinder #1 spark plug hole. Could not build up any pressure as air was leaking out of other open spark and plug holes on that side. Plugged up the holes on that side with coils and injectors and air seemed to be coming out of #2 injector hole. Are all the holes connected? Don't understand what is happening.

You have to add air into the cylinder on a compression stroke. If the valves are open, air will leak past them so you have to make sure the valves are closed for that cylinder.

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Customer reply replied 2 months ago
Have you got any more ideas?

You still need to do the leak down test, but this time make isure you are on a compression stroke and the valves are closed, and see if you hear air coming past the valves.

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Customer reply replied 2 months ago
How do I know when the compression stroke is. I set it up with cylinder #1 in the top highest position. I used a screw driver and when I cranked the engine I stopped when the screwdriver topped out. Was that right?

You want the piston to be at the first part of the upward stroke on the compression stroke. If you have the hose screwed into the spark plug hole, place you finger over the end of the hose and when you first feel pressure coming out of the hose, that is the compression stroke and the valves are closed. You only want to apply about 30 psi of pressure so the piston is not pushed back down, opening the intake valve.

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Customer reply replied 2 months ago
Does the fuel injector hole need to be blocked up to prevent air from escaping?

No. The only way air will escape is if the valves are open, or the valves have a problem.

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I was just checking in on you to see how things are going.

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Customer reply replied 2 months ago
Well I had to take a few days off so I could go to the Cape for a few days. I decided to put everything back together to see if we made any progress. I just finished up putting it back together and it did start up but it is running very rough and won't idle. I can keep it running as long as I keep my foot on the gas. I'll pick up the compression testing equipment later to see if there is no compression on one side. Can I test compression with the car running?

Yes you can. You will want to unplug the injector for the cylinder that you are testing.

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Customer reply replied 2 months ago
Ok, I'll let you know the results. Any thought as to what is going on?

With the timing being off, the rings may have come unseated, and the engine just needs to be run a little so they can build back up.

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Customer reply replied 2 months ago
Just checked compression on cylinder #1 and there is no compression. I'll check others later and do the draw down test

Let me know what the compression is on the other cylinders.

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Customer reply replied 2 months ago
All the drivers side cylinders (1,3,5,7) are 0psi and the passenger side front 3 (2,4,6) are reading 150. 8 is hard to get to. We're right back to where we started after a lot of work.

I hate to say it but it sounds like the intake valve seats have fallen out of the head. The next step is to pull the head off.

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Customer reply replied 2 months ago
I put pressure in all of the bad cylinders on the drivers side and I could hear air escaping from the air intake when I pressurized each cylinder on all 4 cylinders. Are the intake seats something I can do myself.

Did you have all the injectors and spark plugs in the other cylinders? If the valve seats have come out, you will have to pull the head, and take it to a machine shop to have new seats installed, or replace the head.

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Customer reply replied 2 months ago
I had all of the plugs out except #8. All of the fuel injectors are in place. Was that correct. I looked closely at the springs and other things and they seemed to look good. To get to the seals I have to remove the head. What would the shop be doing?

Not the seals but the valve seats. Did you still have air coming out the other cylinders spark plug holes when you applied air in the a cylinder?

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Customer reply replied 2 months ago
I didn't notice any air from the spark holes. When you say "seat" are you talking were the metal valve fits against the metal tapered hole on the head. Or the replaceable valve seals that are under the springs?

The seat sits under the valve in the head.

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Customer reply replied 2 months ago
This will take a while. I'll report back on a few days.

Let me know if you have any questions. There are 4 10 mm bolts on the front of the head, two on the out side that you can see, and two just in front of the timing chain inside the head opening, then you will have 10 15 mm bolts that hold the head on to the block.

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Customer reply replied 2 months ago
Took the valve cover off the left side and found that one of the rockers had broken. It the one to the back of cylinder #5. It wasn't broken when I put the cover on and it's not the one that fell out when I was setting up the timing/cam. Does this change your thinking before I tackle head. Also can I remove the head without screwing up the timing. I'm thinking if I can keep some tension on the chain while I take the secondary sprocket off I can avoid taking the timing cover off. I just need to keep the chain in place on the lower sprocket.

I am sorry but you will have to pull the timing cover back off. The tensioner will spring out and make the chain to tight to put back together. You will have to pull the guides out as well before you pull the head off.

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Customer reply replied 2 months ago
Any thoughts on what caused the rocker arm to break?

Ya, the valve seat is holding the valve from letting it close all the way, and when the piston hit the valve the rocker broke.

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Customer reply replied 2 months ago
Working on taking the cylinder head off the driver side. Many of the rockers seem loose. I've looked at a couple of the Hydraulic lifters And they have no spring. I can't depress the point even with pliers. If these lifters are frozen from the metallic paint like deposit from the damaged timing retainers, can this cause the valves to stick open?

When the lifters loose there pre load, they can build up with to much pressure. This can only happen if the valves are not closing. Let me guess it is ever other valve that this is happening to? The intake valves correct?

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Customer reply replied 2 months ago
Not sure but I think it is the valve to the back of each cylinder. I've got the head unbolted and loose but I'm having a bitch of a time trying to get the manifold/exhaust pipe connection unbolted. Any tips?

Soak them down with pb blaster or wd40. The best way to get them off is to set a wrench on the top of the bolt above the manifold and wedge it so it will stay, and then use a socket and ratchet to break the nuts loose. Do not take the nuts off till you have all 4 of them broke loose.

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Customer reply replied 2 months ago
Finally got the head off. First thing I noticed was water in cylinder #8 and a small piece of metal in cylinder #3 along with a valve score mark on the top of the piston. Small score on other piston tops but not deep. Next was that all the large valves were slightly open and the seat is damaged on several see photos. I've located a rebuilt head for $250 plus shipping. Here are some pics.
IMG_0725.JPGIMG_0725.JPGIMG_0732.JPGIMG_0732.JPGIMG_0737.JPGIMG_0737.JPGIMG_0739.JPGIMG_0739.JPGIMG_0730.JPGIMG_0730.JPG

Can you send me a pic that shows the entire bottom of the head please? I need to see all the valves.

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Do you have a machine shop near you? All you really need are new intake valves. When the timing jumped, the pistons hit the valves and bent them. I believe that you can have this head repaired for around $150.00. And they may have a couple of used rockers as well.

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The coolant in the back cylinder is from the head gasket when you separated the head form the block.

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Customer reply replied 2 months ago
Can the machine shop repair the valve seats that seem to be torn out on several valves. Would a remanufactured head save me money in the long run. Are the pistons ok. The damage seems to be confined to the top.

I do not see any of the valve seats damaged. From what I can see the valves are just bent from hitting the the tops of the pistons. I believe that the pistons will be ok.

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You are correct. The seats will need to be replaced as well. The machine shop can do that as well for you.

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Customer reply replied 2 months ago
Sounds like it will add up to more than a rebuilt head with springs, valves. Etc

Call around and see what the machine shop will charge. You are better off having yours repaired. These heads are bad about dropping valve seats out, so if you have one that did not drop the seat out, you should keep it. Even if it costs you a little bit more, it will be worth it in the long run.

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Customer reply replied 2 months ago
Were you able to see the damaged seat on the photos?

Yes. That happened when the piston hit the valves due to the timing being off, and the valve hit the seat. The seats may not need to be replaced, it may just need new valves and a valve job to reshape the seats.

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Customer reply replied 2 months ago
Just got the 4 large valves out and they are all bent small valves look straight. Also the seats now that I have cleaned them look fine with no damage. I'm thinking 4 new valve and lap grind by hand an I should be good to go.

You can try to lap them, but they need to go to a machine shop so they can make sure the seats do not fall out, or are not egged shaped. Just to be on the safe side.

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Customer reply replied 2 months ago
Do I really need to use new bolts? Should any of the other components in the head be replaced?

Yes you should use new head bolts. You should also replace the valve guide seals. after you have the new valves in.

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Customer reply replied 2 months ago
Ok, will do. I stopped at a local shop and he wanted $380 do a valve job on both sides. He says that if the valves are bent on one side they're probably bent on the other side.

That is not true. the timing jumping is what bent the valves on the one head. The other head is just fine.

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The other head does not need to be reworked.

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Can you send me a pic of the tool please?

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The piece that broke was the crank case vent. That is a dealer item only part.

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I would also like to see the valve seats with the valves removed if you do not mind.

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First off you have the spring retainer top on upside down. Here is the spring compressor you have to use to put it back together. http://www.ebay.com/itm/8-UNIVERSAL-VALVE-SPRING-COMPRESSOR-TOOL-ENGINE-LIFT-VALVE-/192008779803?hash=item2cb49d781b:g:FYcAAOSw5IJWeaoY

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The first pic the seat looks good, but the second looks like it is not true. Can you send me a pic of it from a different angle, as well as the other two ?

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Customer reply replied 2 months ago
Here are pics of the four sets. I ground them with a suction cup on a drill. They all look nice and round to me. Ready to start putting it together.

Now you have to put the valves back in and measure the stem height to make sure the stems are not to long.

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You will need to install the springs and measure the spring height from the spring seat in the head, to the bottom of the spring retainers. The intake valves should be at 1.613 in. and the exhaust is 1.606 in.

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Customer reply replied 2 months ago
The heights look good. The valves were dimensionally exact to the ones I replaced so they should be ok. I have the head back on w/ new gasket and bolts snugged down. I also to the timing cover off which I probably didn't need to do because before starting I marked the position of the cam gear and links and I put nylon ties around the chain so it couldn't jump out of the sprockets. I've got it back together ant the left sprocket is at 12 and the lower sprocket is at 12 and 6 just like before. I haven't taken the pass valve cover off to check the gear but it should be at 12.
Drained oil that was full of water. Tomorrow I'll be torturing things down. Any tips. Got the keepers in by cutting a window out of a pvc pipe and compressed spring with a clamp. Worked great.

If the valves shut to hide from laughing the valves in when you put it all back together without measuring the valve stem height the valves can stay open. You must measure the valve stem height to ensure the valves will close completely. If you choose not to do this you may be wasting your time and money. And yes you had to remove the timing cover. You cannot get the guides out without taking the cover off.

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If the valves are to high by even .001 you have to file the tips of the valve tops so you get the correct valve lash.

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Customer reply replied 2 months ago
Head is torqued down but I'm confused with these poppet/lash pistons. Utube videos show that they have a little spring when they are good. As I mentioned earlier mine don't I can't compress them even with pliers. Took two apart thinking I would find a spring inside as per utube video but therer was none. Bought 2 new ones to replace the ones I took apart and they have a little springy give. Seems to me they hshould have some spring to keep the rockers from falling out. How should the old ones feel. I don't want to buy new ones if I don't have to. Also what was the antifreeze you recommended? Any brand?

You want to get Preston G05. As for the lifters, after warm the truck up, they should soften up.

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Customer reply replied 2 months ago
I'm getting ready to put everything back together. Is there any special lubricating needed on the cam and rockers and the better has been out of the car for a few weeks. Are there any special procedures for reconnecting the battery?

I would pour fresh oil all over the cams. As for reconnecting the battery, make sure you have your keys in your hands. Lock and unlock the drivers door to turn off the alarm. Unplug the crank sensor so you can turn the engine over to build up oil pressure before the engine can start. Make sure to have the battery connected to a battery charger as it will probably take a little bit of turning the engine over to get it to start.

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Customer reply replied 2 months ago
Today I started up the jeep and it started on the first try. Ran great and idled unlike before, took it for a test run and it ran great, only issue is the ABS light is on. Congratulations all around. Thanks for your guidance.

I am happy that you got it running. You are very welcome.

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