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surging problem (slipping converter clutch..quarts..converter swap…

Richard: Well, the saga continues....
Richard:

Well, the saga continues. One tranny shop put in the reman converter and that eliminated the surging problem (slipping converter clutch?). Tranny was topped off with 3.5 quarts of Mercon-LV after the converter swap and the thing started juttering in the 50-70mph range. Tranny shop went to Ford dealer to buy Mercon-SP and Ford dealer sold them Mercon-LV as a replacement for SP, stating they're no longer selling the SP (ran across someone on an RV site that ran into the same issue with their Ford dealer in terms of LV being recommended as a replacement for SP). So, thinking the jutter might have been related to the wrong fluid having been used (50:50 Mercon-LV mixed with LG6), I had a shop with a flush unit install a new pan, bolts, Mechatronic sealing sleeve and flush and fill with Mercon-SP, the fluid Ford/Lincoln uses in this same transmission on the Lincoln LS's. Had the shop give me the old pan and it was clean inside - no debris and very little if any shavings on the magnets. After flush and fill, following the warmup/fluid expansion procedure, the shop drove it in the 55-90mph range, and didn't observe any jutter with the full fresh fluid change. I picked it up and about 3 miles out at about 55 mph on an uphill climb or on level ground, it started juttering again. So, I guess the $64K-questions are: 1) does it make any sense to have Jag put the scan tool on it to evaluate if the Mechatronic lockup functions are operating properly; or 2) could there be something hay-wire with the reman converter; or 3) is there something else suspect with the transmission that might have been complicit in having taken out the original converter clutch? I had the TC installing shop check with the remanufacturer, and they claimed the converters are rebuilt to ZF factory specs with the same clutch materials ZF uses. Like to find the shortest path to success as this little problem is now into my wallet north of $1300 and no end in sight. I'm tempted to try and contact ZF to see if they can offer any insights. And it makes me suspicious if I'd spent the $2800 the Jag dealer wanted for a new converter if that would have actually fixed the problem? Any additional recommendations you may be able to offer would be appreciated. Thanks.
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Answered in 12 hours by:
10/15/2011
Jaguar Mechanic: Richard, Jaguar Technician replied 11 years ago
Richard
Richard, Jaguar Technician
Category: Jaguar
Satisfied Customers: 16,763
Experience: 12 years at a Ford/Lincoln Mercury and Jaguar dealer as technician and shop foreman.
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Hello and welcome back to justanswer.com

 

The shop may not like this answer but Mercon V or equivalent should not be used in this transmission. The shop is going to tell you that as long as the system has been flushed of all the old fluid Mercon fluid can be used without a problem. If you were to contact ZF they will tell you only the ZF fluid should be used which is a SHell based fluid. From Jag it is costly but you can also get it from BMW or VW for cheaper. I recommend having the transmission flushed out and the correct fluid used. If they claim the converter has been built to meet/exceed ZF standards then they should be using the ZF fluid.

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Customer reply replied 11 years ago
Hmmmm? I did quite a bit of research about ZF LG6 versus Mercon-SP and from what I can determine, they're near equivalents. Mercon-SP is a full synthetic Motorcraft/Ford fluid based on Mercon-V with an additive package produced by Shell in Houston versus the LG6 produced by Shell in Europe for ZF. Both have an additive package to improve temperature, shear and friction performance. I'm told the Mercon-SP is used in this same ZF6HP26 transmission that's installed in Lincoln LS's. I've also encountered other Jag and BMW owners using the Mercon-SP on the Jag/BMW forums, mixed with LG6 where they couldn't completely flush the converter during an oil change and don't see any problems reported. The tranny shop that did the TC swap suspects something going on with the Mechatronic valve body (solenoid valve leakage?) and thinks I should have Jag run a scan for proper converter lockup circuit operation. Other than the intermittent judder at 50-70mph, the transmission is no longer surging and it is shifting normally through all gears during normal or aggressive acceleration. It only exhibits the jutter issue on slow acceleration through, or steady cruising speed in, the 50-70mph range???????? Are you able to point me to any references where others might have used Mercon-SP and then reported problems???? I'll put this up on the Jag forum and see if I get any additional comments about using Mercon-SP. Thanks!
Jaguar Mechanic: Richard, Jaguar Technician replied 11 years ago

The ZF 6 speed units are similar but it is the mechatronic (TCM/valve body which are different. This is why the fluids are different. The surge issue is the converter so since the converter was replaced and now you have this other issue I do not think the TCM is the problem. It is either a problem with the converter or a fluid issue. These were both disturbed so one must be the cause. You are going to be stuck between a rock and a hard place. The dealer s going to tell you the reman converter and the wrong fluid is the problem and the trans shop is going to tell you it must be another mechanical failure or the TCM and "only Jag has the tool to diagnose this".

Richard
Richard, Jaguar Technician
Category: Jaguar
Satisfied Customers: 16,763
Experience: 12 years at a Ford/Lincoln Mercury and Jaguar dealer as technician and shop foreman.
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