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I installed a Observer tstas0201cw communicating Thermostat…

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I installed a Observer tstas0201cw...
I installed a Observer tstas0201cw communicating Thermostat for my Tempstar F9mac furnace. its running along with a 4 ton, non- communicating, RUUD A/C condenser.The wiring is pretty simple. There is a plug adapter for the Furnace control board with DX + and DX- connections and R and Comm. connections.I wired it accurately with green going to DX+ and Yellow to DX - The R and Comm wires are 24 volts and are accurately configured. As drawn in the Schematic.The Thermostat is not reading the furnace information. It searches and gives me a can not find equipment message.This is a proprietary Thermostat for ICP brand Equipment. This is a modulating furnace and to get the full value out of it it requires this Observer thermostat.I was hoping some one out there might understand this product and have a solution of the thermostat recognizing the Furnace.I can go into the demo mode and setup the functions but the Furnace will not fire up with out it being found by the Tstat.Thank you,Paul
Submitted: 3 months ago.Category: HVAC
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Customer reply replied 3 months ago
I guess there is no one who has any experience with this tstat
Customer reply replied 3 months ago
Seriously JustAWhat's the point of asking questions here?Anymore I get no response from anyone,Is it that this issue requires someone contact ICP and discuss the issue of why a Tstat 0201 will not find my service?Is that to much trouble to ask?I pay for this service on a monthly basis to have access to knowledge bases I can not access myself, Could be car electronics, could be a printer, could be a Dishwasher.If I can not resolve this issue I am retiring from this service. lately I get no help on here or bad help with techs interested in spending no time and getting to please pay me after one response.If you can't deliver on something as simple as contacting the ICP techs and getting a solution I can not access then JustA is useless.So now you have a disgruntled subscriber,Anyone care to deal with this or am I supposed to thing any of you give a Cr%p about providing useful information?Its been long enough, no reply.
Customer reply replied 3 months ago
Correction,NOT FIND MY EQUIPMENT
Answered in 13 hours by:
3/28/2018
HVAC Technician: Gina-Moderator, Moderator replied 3 months ago
Gina-Moderator
Gina-Moderator, Moderator
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Hello:
I'm Gina, the moderator for this category. I'm so sorry that an Expert has not connected with you yet. I wanted to reach out to see if you still needed assistance with your question? Please use the reply box below to let me know if you'd like to continue or cancel.
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Customer reply replied 3 months ago
WHAT DO YOU THINK GINA,MY EXPERIENCE WITH JUSTA HAS DETERIOTATED OVER TIME. I HAD A LONG LASTING RELATIONSHIP WITH ONE TECHNICIAN HERE WHO WAS GREAT FOR MANY YEARS, BUT THE OTHERS ARE ALL JUST COUNTING PENNIES AND NOT REALLY INTERESTED IN FINDING SOLUTIONS.like the car mechanic who recently replied to a question concerning an idle control valve issue I was dealing with. He sends me a internet post of setting up a valve that is not even for my car. Any further questions where sent back to that bad information. Just rate me was his idea of help. I had a car stereo install I did last year and got another real winner who wasted my time and never took the time to understand his err. He again sends me standard info off the internet I could easily look up myself.My last experience was a dishwasher problem. I was ignored for 10 days. I finally just did what I have done here, and I am serious about this, I'm going to cancel my subscription if there is no one who can help me resolve this issue. This is my last attempt and yes I am annoyed by the lack of interest shown. I put a post on a HVAC forum and have had reactions there, no solutions but interesting replies.I come here for information, not to serve techs who play games and want a fast buck.So you figure it out, if you can find a tech who is capable of calling ICP and getting tech support from them its all go. I can not call them because it is a anti consumer company. Had I known they behave like this I would never have bought an ICP product. Things go wrong, sending people to sellers for tech support is nuts. The sellers are interested in selling not backing up the product.So I come here looking for a tech with experience with ICP, they can contact ICP for answers. It could be I have a bad component, it could be I have an install issue that is simple, like a switch that needs to be flipped or some hidden issue that is over looked in the literature, it happens.I get no responses from a paid service that I rarely use at a cost of $360 a year.You are about to lose me,
HVAC Technician: Gina-Moderator, Moderator replied 3 months ago
Hello Paul:
First, I'm so sorry you're having a difficult time. I assure you I will do my best in trying to find an Expert that has experience with that particular thermostat. JustAnswer takes pride in doing their best to provide specific Experts for specific problems.
I do thank you for your continued patience while I find an Expert to assist you.
Best,
Gina
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HVAC Technician: Bill, HVAC Technician replied 3 months ago
Bill
Bill, HVAC Technician
Category: HVAC
Satisfied Customers: 112
Experience: Service Mgr
Verified

Hello,

My name is Bill. I do not have an answer for you right now...but will make some calls to my tech support team.

As soon as I have information, good or bad, I will let you know.

Bill

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HVAC Technician: Bill, HVAC Technician replied 3 months ago

Before I make the call,

Is the furnace diagnostic reading "normal" condition?

Is the thermostat wire run away from 120+ volt wiring?

Did you start with this thermostat or had a conventional thermostat first?

Is the non communicating condenser hooked to com and Y at furnace?

Is the wiring in shielded cable?

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Customer reply replied 3 months ago
Dear Bill, thank you for your questions,I have been running an Alpineaire 8800 thermostat since Dec, before that a single stage older thermostat.These tstats are non communicating designs.So your first question is answered by the fact the units run right on either of these one or two stage thermostats.After much research I found the download page for upgrading the software on the thermostat. It currently is running version 4.02.I can install 6.?? By plugging in a thumb drive and rebooting the power.As for the thermostat wire. It only uses 4 wires. I had to use 6 wires on the 8800. It is the standard brown thermostat wire, 18 gauge. I do not believe it is shielded, I have never heard on shielded thermostat wire but you learn something new everyday.My strategy is to first upgrade the software, then I will know the thermostat is working correctly. From there it will have to be a furnace hook up issue. A switch for communicating thermostats perhaps, or some other less than obvious yet simple issue.To use the communicating stat you attach the 4 wires to a plug adapter that plugs into the control board on the furnace. It is a f9mac tempstar furnace. A wonder piece even if Tempstar is a disaster to deal with. I am very unimpressed with ICP support. This is a $360 tstat and after finding one used I was told I had to go to a dealer to have it installed. I install this entity HVAC system myself and this is just ignorant of any company. In the future I will figure out tech support before buying any piece of gear.So there you have what I can offer.
Customer reply replied 3 months ago
One last answerI have the condenser wired y2 as instructed in the furnace manual.I can easily move it to Y if it matters.P
HVAC Technician: Bill, HVAC Technician replied 3 months ago

Excellent info.

First a tid bit on the shielded wire see here

not mandatory unless the thermostat wire is along side high voltage (120v) or other type communication wires.

If this is not your situation then disregard shielded wire.

Also, do you a have a model plug on PL4 connector? I have seen much grief from these.

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Customer reply replied 3 months ago
I presume you are referring to the Communicating plug for the Control board in the Furnace.The one I used came with the Observer. I do not know a model number but if there is one on the part I can retrieve it.As for the Thermo wire, no it is not running near any electrical suff. It does cross over conduit but but its not rigHt on it.When I built the HVAC system last year I gutted the electricals and put all wiring that runs above the new duct work in conduit. I had to spend a great deal of time working on the electrics before I did anything else. It was all ungrounded romex in woven sheath. Its all grounded now in conduit.I do not think I have an issue there. My house was built in 54. The original duct work was under sized for Heating only. Later a Gas heat/ Evaporator was installed. A garage was converted to be added with no registers. I had 2 7 inch registers serving over 500 Sqft of the house. I had to run two12 inch risers up into the attic from my basement and then add registers in the ceiling. So I now have lots of CFMs where I once had none.So be assured I did not leave much unfinished. I did everything to a high standard. I am installing this Observer to get the full Function out of this modulating furnace. Many think they are useless, but I found one for little money and I would like to take advantage of it. I have not had time to load software today, will not likely get to that until tomorrow.If there is anything you can find out from ICP concerning the board setup for this Thermostat that would be very help.I can envision some switch or other mod that might be blocking the 0201 from communicating.Thank you,P
Customer reply replied 3 months ago
PL4 connectorThere is a little board plugged into the PL4 location.Can it be removed, I thought you where referring to PL7 but checked the manual.So yes, if that little board is the Connector you refer to.
Customer reply replied 3 months ago
https://www.doityourself.com/forum/gas-oil-home-heating-furnaces/419133-model-plug-carrier-variable-speed-furnace.htmlI found this on how to jump the pins with resistors.I have a work station here for electronics work. I am developing electronics for my business. If this is required I can install resistors. No a big deal for me.What does this Model plug do?
HVAC Technician: Bill, HVAC Technician replied 3 months ago

the furnaces all start "generic".

The gas valve , inducer, circuit board all are standard parts and do not know what size furnace they are in or the ecm motor ramping configuration. This plug "tells" the furnace which ecm motor is being used. BUT...all the ecm motors are also pretty much the same until programmed for a given use.

A 120,000 btu single stage furnace will have different timing and ramping characteristics than a 2 stage or variable gas valve ecm blower. You cannot mix ecm motor modules due to this programming. The model plug tells the circuit board what configuration/ecm etc is being used.

If the age of the equipment is significantly different between the thermostat and furnace you may need a software upgrade.

You can also unhook the ac unit...hook up the thermostat and see if the thermostat finds just the furnace. I have a call in to my rep, but I got a off for spring break message. I am still working on this.

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Customer reply replied 3 months ago
Thank you,I use mac and setting up a bootable thumb drive requires a pc.
Do I will have to setup a thumb drive on a PC to install a new software upgraded.It's all a big cluster *"'?ICP is a complete waste of time,. This is the only thermostat that works to control the modulating furnace I own,. Wow!I'm just chasing my tail
Customer reply replied 3 months ago
OK Bill,I upgraded the software in the thermostat. To my complete shock it loaded without issue in about a minute. I did not think it would boot because I setup the thumb drive on my Mac laptop and I could not designate it as a root folder.So now I have 6.10 software and no communication with the furnace.If you would please, contact ICP and ask them what to do next. I am confident after this software upgrade that the thermostat is functional.I will disconnect the AC and let you know if that solves the problem.Also, this is a F9mac 100BTU furnace not a 120.I was not aware that the AC hook up could be interfering with the model plug.Thank you,P
Customer reply replied 3 months ago
OK, I disconnected the AC and rebooted, no equipment found.
Customer reply replied 3 months ago
Bill, Here are the Model and control board numbers if you need them:F9mac(###) ###-####1board numbers-CEPL 130988-20-2V17 Hk42FZ20442611I wonder if there is a later control board upgradeP
HVAC Technician: Bill, HVAC Technician replied 3 months ago

Thank you for your patience...

The R and C inputs...do you measure 24v ~ on those 2 terminals?

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Customer reply replied 3 months ago
I did not check because I have power at the tstat.Let me check right now, 28 volts at the tstat.A bit higher that advertised but then my meter could be off.
HVAC Technician: Bill, HVAC Technician replied 3 months ago

ok I got a call back...but to delay things even further for you....I need the age or serial number of the furnace and is this the original circuit board that came with furnace?...and if NOT..I need the number REV on the circuit board

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Customer reply replied 3 months ago
I believe when I looked it up in the past the Furnace was manufactured in 2011. Not sure though.P
Customer reply replied 3 months ago
Its right in the pic of the label - Manufactured in Sept of 2011
Customer reply replied 3 months ago
Bill, any word from ICP.I put my 8800 stat back in use, its cooled off here and will be cold through this weekend.I am going to wire the 0201 to the plug-in module for the control board and simply pull the 8800 off the wall to test the 0201 at the furnace until I can get it to function properly. This way I will not be without HVAC. I can easily go between the two Tstats this way simply by plugging and unplugging them.
Customer reply replied 3 months ago
Bill I re read your questions and realized I had missed some.I do not know how to run a furnace diagnostic. The condenser is hooked up to Y and Com.
Customer reply replied 3 months ago
I guess the obvious question is?Does the dealer change out the model plug for non communicating thermostats?Are there two model plugs for either type thermostat?
Customer reply replied 3 months ago
Bill,Your last post was 10 days ago,Are you done with this question?
HVAC Technician: Bill, HVAC Technician replied 3 months ago

I apologize,

I had to take some time off with a family situation.

The news I have back is the current circuit board is not recognizable or the thermostat is doa.

Unfortunately there is no simple test in the field to determine which. It looks like you would be changing parts to see which is the culprit.

This is contingent on the points covered earlier like electrical interference of wire being too close to line voltage or fluorescent fixtures.

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Customer reply replied 3 months ago
I will hook up the stat at the furnace to eliminate the interference issue.The stat took an upgrade so it is at least progrmable.iCP is a disaster,. I may need to go see the HVAC guy I know to ask him to test it .
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