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For expert: Ok so I talked to his parents. Their influence

For expert Martin: Ok so I...
For expert Martin:
Ok so I talked to his parents. Their influence probably finally allowed him to accept the fact that the hooker did try to destroy our relationship. He also forgives me for all the vengeful things I did, because I just reacted to a terrible situation the hooker maliciously put me in.But he is firm we are not getting back together. He is firm on and stand by his decision. It sounds hopeless right? But then I recalled something: in august and September, the first two contacts I made after I did the worst revenge on him, he was so reactive, told me he doesn't want to talk to me, we should never speak again, he hates me and know for sure he will never forgive me. I said you never know the future. He emphasized he knows clearly about himself and he knows for sure he won't forgive. But guess what, merely a few days later when I contacted his parents, he forgive me. Now he is willing to be friendly.So now I am making my final throttle to get back with him. Starts from friendship. Could you offer various suggestions in strategy, tactics and ideas (e.g. Earlier you suggested invite him to crazy project etc) to run the final mile? To ensure he will take it in without rejecting it. Right now he is on the fence to hangout because he thinks I want to get back with him that way. So I have to get around that to make him willing to hangout without being in guard.
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Answered in 1 hour by:
10/8/2017
Josie-Mod
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Category: General
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Hello,
I'm Josie, a moderator for this topic.
I sent your requested Expert a message to follow up with you here, when he is back online.
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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Great thank you!
Martin
Martin, Engineer
Category: General
Satisfied Customers: 4,963
Experience: i'm 41 and i never stopped studying and experimenting
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You can try to add a third person into the mix, making it seem the initiative of the adventure is from him or her and you want to have someone you trust more to be part of it. You may also do something on your own, and then speak of this experience to him without asking him to come on board and just offering him to join if he want to, making sure he know you will do it that he come or not.

You need to play it as you are independent or else the trick will show and he will think you are stalking him and/or putting pressure on him.

As for why he changed his mind, this is like i said, time change us. The you of today is not 100% the same as the you of one month ago (some things is added, some things are removed). On that subject, you can work on yourself a lot to be more advantageous to him (as long as you are also happy in the change and in the end result). You can learn to cook better, stop smoking or drinking cola, to get in shape, to read and cultivate your brain a bit more than currently, to make more contacts, to be more efficient in what you do (especially time management), perhaps to push your career a bit higher... and then make sure in some way he get to notice all this. He will not react right away but it will seep into is mind and as he compare you to other from time to time, the math will add-up and it will change his view and opinion. Seduction is not something that end at one point, it is an on-going process.

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
I am not looking at long run. This must be finished in the next two months. Also he is hanging out with someone right now, and they haven't get there yet. But this person will only be a f**k buddy if it happens. He is not looking for long term.I don't feel good about it even he is not serious. What can I do to kick this one out asap?

Identify her faults, the things that annoy him the most, and bring them directly or indirectly in situations where those fault will boil and spill everywhere and show in broad light. In other word, do not push him away from the light, push him into the sun so he burn himself.

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
There is no way I could get into contact with this person.

why?

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Of course not. I am not in his life. Even I am he won't let us meet

From where does the two month limit from from?

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*come from

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
I have to set myself a time frame. Also he said he is moving away in two months. So I am hoping to convince him to stay

I guess he mean in another town? If this is his choice, it might be part of his own self discovery process to know where to go from that point. That is a thing he need to go through, not much we can do about this. His familly will still be there that said, so he will have to come back. ALso not a bad thing is that someone that go away for a while is more open to speak about his experience when he come back, that mean multiple chance for you at those points.

Unless you can get him a good paid job, i don't see a reason for him to stay if he really want to go away. It really boil down to what he have to gain at that point because he will not fall in love with anyone anytime soon, and the effect is always lower anyway with someone where it already happened.

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
First of all, the love hasn't happened yet before it got interrupted but we know we had some connection back then. Second he is moving back to home town. It is just a matter of maybe losing hope for a city so if there is someone here for him then it is another story.

Ok, so his familly are at the hometown now?

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Right

What was the initial reason to move to your town?

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Get away ftom home, getting bored there. America is great
Customer reply replied 1 month ago
He wasn't able to transfer to his ideal school, also our fights last semester add lots of stress. So he probably got frustrated

And the other girl, she is his hometown?

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Here

is in his hometown?

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
No here

Then that solve that problem if he move away. A good strategy would be to let him move, crushing that new crush and then hope he might come back in your town from time to time, he could then live with you for a few days instead of an hotel room. Everybody have to come back to his previous time a few time to view friend or attend some business not finished.

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*previous town (sorry i make a lot of typo today:))

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
The thing is they are still early stage and trying to feel. Also as I mentioned he is not going to be serious with anyone right now. We are different because we were trying a relationship.But I think you made a good point. I should encourage him to move. Then he will probably want to stay. With men you have to do the opposite. And also because I am familiar with and into his country I can go there. But he can find new people back there lol.But how can I make him feel like I don't really want him so he will want me more? In the meanwhile I still have to see him regularly otherwise things can't move forwards
Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Right now I tried to message him every day hoping to get on top of his head
Customer reply replied 1 month ago
The messages are nice. So hopefully it will become a drug to him

Keeping contact is nice, but you need to keep some "hunting" pleasure in all this, don't make it too easy for him. You could play the jaelousy card saying you saw someone interesting.

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
But every day message is ok?

For someone used to message, yes. For others it might be a bit much. Having messages at always the same time of the day make them less annoying also. You can also send them in a time when you know he his relax so his attention are on them and he don't read them in a hurry.

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
I don't know if he will be jealous. He told me to find someone else. Or maybe he knows I am not looking so he is bold enough to say that

no need to say you found someone, just that you saw someone interesting.

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
every day message is ok?He is pretty smart and I don't think any gimmick works unless it is real.

every day is ok, especially if he respond also every day. Not more than that that said.

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Unfortunately he is not responding. But he told me it is ok to semd

At this point it is your only weapon, so using it is not bad.

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
But even he wants to check out other women, if my offer is strong and luring enough he will be tempted to take it right?I didn't call. He usually pick up calls

If you mention he have to move in two month, it does not give him much time to toy with other women that much. That mean that you offer a easier choice in a convenience context.

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
He akways has short term fling so nothing bazaar for him.You offer an easier choice - what do you mean?
Customer reply replied 1 month ago
He probably also conveniently use this to not get too involved with anyone :)

Easier in a sense of being available, low risk (no angry current boyfriend around), a good knowledge of your temper etc...

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Well not easier when it comes to past hurt feelings
Customer reply replied 1 month ago
How often should I call him?

Calling is more intrusive, i would not call more than 3 time a week.

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
But by keep messaging him, his mind and mental energy will allocate less to anyone else?

yes, especially if you manage to setup an activity that may interest him.

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Right I will keep inviting him on various things till he takes the offer
Customer reply replied 1 month ago
But for past hurt feelings, just don't ever brought it up right?

Indeed, past is past.

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
But even if he keeps insisting he is firm on his decision and will not get back with me, by messaging him every day, it can wear down his firmness and possibly making him change his mind?

Always possible, but with more time than two month chance would increase about that. Also if that happen it will be by unnoticeable step, so he will not even notice the transition so the firmness will not be broke because the change being so small remove any appearance of change and the promise would be forgotten.

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Haha I agree with you. He already broke one firm decision without him even noticing. He previously said he hates me and will never forgave me. But then situation changed, and he realized it was very situational that I did certain things, now he forgived me. But back then he said he knows himself well and know that for sure he won't forgive :)I had a friend I got angry over something and told myself I am done with him forever. He tried to contact me a few times and I never pick up the phone while saying to myself don't even think about we'll ever talk again. Then after almost 6-8 months, I bumped into him at an event, he said hi and I was lukewarm. Then a few days after that, I don't even know why, I felt all the grudge is not necessary any more and my wall is broken down. I contacted him. LOL!

You must not remind him of that first promise he made with himself, you must also not say "i tell you so" if he broke that second promise with himself and lastly you must not feed Mogwai after midnight.

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
sir!feed Mogwai after midnight - you refer to not remind him the promise he broke?

yes, Mogwai as in the movie Gremlins :) I needed a third rule because rules are better remembered by group of 3 :)

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Haha :)))
Customer reply replied 1 month ago
But still I am so frustrated that he hasn't showed any guestures yet. It makes you feel like he is going to stick to his decision forever...
Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Also I am stressed out seeing him with someone, even he says they are still just trying to know each other and haven't done anything yet
Customer reply replied 1 month ago
When I remind him our past, if he is like what he says, has no feelings any more, will it still somehow impact him?Also he says he has no feelings any more. Is it true or the feeling has just been blocked?

It depend of his personallity. Some are nostalgic by nature and like to watch old photo all the time because the quality of the emotion at those time was greater than in the present. Some like to live more in the present because they have weak emotional memory. Another thing that may be at cause is that he was angry about you. Even if he forgive now, it does not happen emotionally in a digital switching manner, instead it have a very long discharge delay that may vary from one person to another.

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
What is the most efficient way to remove the grudge besides what we already discussed?
Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Ps how do I know if it is more of a matter of getting hurt, or he just wants to date around?He said he is not ready for settling down yet.

The most effective way to remove a grudge it to put it in perspective with other things. It can be insulting to have it pointed out, it is better to talk casually about something objectively worst hopping his brain will weight down his own grudge and slowly adjusting to reality.

I also don't think he is ready. He would not talk to another girl and say he want to go in two month if it was the case. He might not really want to date, he may feel just lonely.

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Got it.So how to change his blueprint and make him ready?

That can be hard, some think of themself as invincible, that they still have lot of time to live (when in reality we are always a heart beat away from death).

He may think he don't have enough fund to start a familly, that there is enough person in his close familly to propagate their DNA. He might also fear the responsibility and/or the additional work that come with it. He may also think he did not lived enough experience yet (when in fact nothing prevent someone to do anything later on). He may think the earth is overcrowded. He perhaps want some pre-requesite to be well established before going for it.

You have the option to make him change/evolve his mind about this limitation or just speedup the process to reach the enabling conditions as fast as possible.

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
What if he wants to experience more girls? Could this be a possibility?
Customer reply replied 1 month ago
He also said relationship takes work and he doesn't want work. He doesn't like responsibility, drama etc.

More girls, yes, but for what goal? trophy? to get more knowledgeable about girls(i doubt this)? Look like he have a big ego and need to dull it a bit. He might also think highly of his capacity and think he won't need to rely on someone at one point.

No drama... Perhaps he would enjoy a simple life in the country side, perhaps you could sell this to him. Not only is it simpler with girl, it is simpler for everythings!

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Make sense. I think he want simple, easy, no drama, work, so short term fling suites him most.
Customer reply replied 1 month ago
he said he doesn't think he needs anyone.Have a big ego and need to dull a little
- what do you mean?

I mean he need to get himself (for his own good) into a situation where he will be overwelmed and where he will have to ask for help and learn that having someone reliable around is a good asset for those cases.

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
learn that having someone reliable around is a good asset for those cases.
- you got some examples?
Customer reply replied 1 month ago
I recall that I did created some emotional drama. What can I do to best reduce the impact of it on him?
Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Let him move away
- once moved away, it is harder to move back

Like if get sick to the point of not being able to get out of the bed

Like if he loose a lot of money in one shot and risk to land in the street

Like if he need to redo his roof in a week with rainy meteo etc...

Any kind of situration where being alone is not adventeagous.

He like stability, you fix the drama in this case by creating stability and simplicity around him.

He moved once, the reason why he moved is probably still there and it will push him to move again.

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Yeah he said he may went back to home country to finish his college, and maybe come back later for masters. But still if he were giving hope, he counts change his kind and finish the study here.
Customer reply replied 1 month ago
I mean he already has an impression of me creating drama, how to remove that?
Customer reply replied 1 month ago
What is the most effective way to get him change his decision of "we'll never be together again"?
Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Why once a decision is made, he sticks to it so firmly?

Drama is always relative to his culture and how he is atttached to it (when we talk about foreign country).

Ask him to be a "teacher". I don't see why he would not help doing it in a little game/thought experiment. Get him to write a list of things that create very mild drama according to him up to tollerable drama then all the way to full color saturation drama pedal to the metal. Then ask him what he think created the condition that allowed them to grow. Then ask him what are the sing that he or you should see comming that a drama is comming. Then ask him what you can do while in the present moment of a drama, and lastly what he expect to do after a drama in case is was unstoppable.

This is a diplomacy game, a conflict resolution game, in essence a game. Whatever he will say you must never take it against him on the moment later as it is a game. What happen in the fight club, stay in the fight club.

Once he know you are informed about the "science" of drama, especially HIS science, he should be in position to trust you better to avoid those drama. He need to BELIEVE you changed.

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Not sure if I get it.What do you think he is thinking when I keep sending messages?
Customer reply replied 1 month ago
I can't believe he is not moved by any of my advances. It is like what he says, once he makes a decision, he sticks to it.
Customer reply replied 1 month ago
The other thing is, according to himself, he is that kind of guy who once something happened, he will never forget and things can never go back to before. So this means whether you changed or not, it has already happened and nothing can be done now.In this case, what to do?

I understand that, i never forget anything either... somehow there is always "space" for it in my brain. What you can do is make that memory pop less often by diluting that memory in a lot more memories gained by load of experiences. It will really need a very special thing/stimuli to trigger such an old memory that is not often requested.

There is also hypnosis that can help, but not everybody respond to that and the subject need to want to forget, you can't force tha on him.

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Do you think my messages have any effect on him at all?

Depend of how good of a seller you are :)

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Lol give me example of a good sell
Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Next time if he says he has no feelings any more, I should move on, what should I say back?

Hummm, one thing i noticed young guys like these days is to have a girlfriend that genuinely like to play videogames. This is very rare and quite an appreciate trait. Usually friends rate those girlfriend as keeper as much as those knowing how to cook well.

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
I don't think he plays video games. Next time if he says he has no feelings any more, I should move on, what should I say back?When I invite him, what do I say if he turns it down?

It is not just what you can say but what you can propose/sell. He might not have feeling anymore but he may be interested in an activity (going see Blade Runner 2049 at the cinema) and then you are physically with him and pheromone may do their trick.

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Right but in case he brings it up what should respond? Same if he rejects my invite yo do something together.
Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Also he is cautious of the hanging out and my motives so he might completely insulate himself

You need to have plan B, C and D ready. You also should not reply with an alternative too fast because he will be for some mimutes in a refusal state of mind, you wait 15 min and then propose something else when his barrier get tired. Eventually he will get annoyed or accept. Usually someone with a minimum of empathy will give some respect and accept, just for the effort showed.

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Ok.
Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Is it ok if I go uninvited to his place? While it is not following the rules, it actually creates an impact?

I see no problem with that. If he can't let you in, the worst is that he will tell it to you. If he don't want you around, he will also tell it to you (just don't go back or it will then be stalking and that is NOT good).

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Since he already knows I want to get back, there really is no way to make him believe I won't want to get back any more right?
Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Since he already knows I want to get back, there really is no way to make him believe I won't want to get back any more right?
Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Well I already did it once. But I feel like if I bring him nice food or snacks, then he will be more open to it and the unexpectancy creates excitement?

Yes, especially if the time you did it he did not mention to not show anymore there.

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Well he did mention but so what? He will maybe get used to it and feel important lol :)

If he did, do not do it too often, you don't want him to get an restricting injunction on you

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
No it is on friendly basis
Customer reply replied 1 month ago
If I have good intentions, he won't at least be hostile

Then go for it. As i said many time, interaction on "social media" often are a dead end.

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Since he already know I want to get back together and he is on the guard, how do I make him ignore this and be willing to meet?

You talk about, you know, things friend talk together and common interest. Really when you remove sex, cuddle and dual ownership, everything else is not about couple at all.

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
He says he and that woman is just friends. He said he is still trying to figure out what to do with her (friend or more). He said we are more like date, but she is more like hanging out (not that serious). Do you think he is honest? Do you think he airways wants something to do with her (not relationship)?
Customer reply replied 1 month ago
He already wants something to do with her *

A guy always want sex. That does not mean he want a long term relation with her that said. So he is honest?, probably and he may not make a move on her to have sex but if she ask for it then it is another story.

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
He may not make a move
- you mean he is waiting for her to make the move? He is slow in making move himself.

Then nothing may happen.

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Well she can make the move. But it is unlikely he just decide not to have anything to do with her right?

She may not want to either, he might act very protective of himself right now and that may bother her.

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Protective of himself against her?

Yes.

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
He tried to make it sound like they are friends. I guess he is just trying to be low key to not hurt my feelings.Well the day I went to his place. He told her he will call her. Then after she left, we started having a conversation. After a while she started keep calling him. He tried to turn his phone off lol. So that means she wants him.

Wanting to put an exclusivity zone around one male does not mean she want him now. She may just want to keep him in reserve while she pursue other men or want to annalyse if he is a worthy try.

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
I think he tried to lie by saying they take a Lyft to a friend' place. But her car is there so why they need to take a Lyft. I think she probably hanged out at his place and it is almost midnight so she might be going home and he is seeing her off and then I bumped into them.
Customer reply replied 1 month ago
He is trying to project that they have mutual friend and she is just a friend.

Perhaps they planned to drink, hence the Lyft.

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
True. But she still has to drive home.

I sadly can only speculate on this part as i am not there.

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Do you think the fights are the main reason of breaking up, or he is not ready is the main reason?

Some are strong enough to withstand a tempest until it settle down, some just can't take the steam. If you live in the present, fight are lot less enjoyable than when you are a planner that know it will end in a few hour.

I think it is a mix of not wanting fight in his life and also not be ready.

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
I see. I heard some advice that since he already closed his heart to me and be on alert I am trying to get back with him, so messaging him every day or invite him to events won't really affect them.The advice is to do something that tap into his needs that he can't reject, e.g. His visa and school issue. This way he will also not feel threatened that I am trying to get back with him. Then once we get into touch more I can work on getting him back.Do you think this is a better approach or you think the messaging and invite to bazaar event is better?

Both can help, but a trojan horse strategy is often the best, ***** ***** someone with a high gard.

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Which helps more?What do you mean by Trojan horse strategy here?
Customer reply replied 1 month ago
I think you meant the material approach is more of a Trojan horse

Yes, the material approach, and yes this is a more powerfull hook.

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Ok got it :))
Customer reply replied 1 month ago
This guy always has short term flings. You used to say it can be an engraved pattern that is hard to change.Do you think he is more of a serial dater; or it is more because he hasn't met the right one that is enough to make him stop looking?

"always has short term flings" That is a sign on not be ready or "mature" if you prefer. Yes that is hard to change, it would require many reading of Aesop "The Ant and the Grasshopper".

Serial dater, possible. Has he still study, it is not enough to look at is job history. If he is, it is probable than in the future he will change job at least one time a year (not by being fired, just by quiting).

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
I found people hop in one area usually are very stable in other areas. Probably as a balance. So he stayed with one of his job for 5 years.
Customer reply replied 1 month ago
do you think I should still invite him to events or just focus solely on the material aspects?

Start with the material, then when you feel you have an openning for an event, take the shot.

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Do not ask him to do it with you, just mention that you are going to do it and if he want to tag along he can if he want.

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Great! I found a way to invite to event as well, by saying I need his business advice.
Customer reply replied 1 month ago
But seriously do you even marginally believe a very stubborn guy will changed his decision? We discussed this but realistic how good is the chance? It hardly works or with the right strategy the chance can be drastically increased?
Customer reply replied 1 month ago
would you say reverse psychology works really well for them? E.g. Maybe now I should disclose that I lost my patience, got really frustrated and don't really care much about (getting back with) him any more. Do you think this might work well with him?

Every one can change his mind, we are annalog computers, not digital ones.

If you want a C3P0 statistic, i would say 1 on 10 chance.

Reverse strategy can work if you are equally inteligent to someone else, but if you want it to surely work, you need to be 4 time more intelligent to hide the trap well enough.

The more important thing to ask when resolving a problem (like the one we have or any other): Is it really a problem?. It may not be one just by you deciding it, you may also solve it in another way. You also need to decide how many different paths can resolve the problem and take the one requiring the mix of less effort with the most reward. Perhaps working on regaining him while also working on seducing another guy will solve the problem better. So if we reformulate the problem from i want that guy back to simply i am alone and i don't want to be alone, it become lot more easier to seduce one of the billions of men on eartht that to select one in particular.

So the strategy of disclosing your lack of patience is a no lose proposition in case you have reformuled the problem to " i don't want to be alone", while at the same time accelerating the whole problem solving that it work or not because then you have more time to spend on other guys.

If the problem is "i lost something i want back" or "i invested too much time in that relation to let it go" or "i can't accept to be dumped", it become lot more complicated for nothing that if it is simply reconfigured as "i don't want to be alone". Please always keep that in mind for any future problems you may have in life.

1 chance on 10 may not seem much, but a scientist often pursue goal with chance lower than 1/500, the difference between a succesful and a bad scientist is that the successful will run hundred of experiment in parralel to increase is chance to get "anything" out of the whole adventure.

Martin
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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Excellent! I know I don't like a 1/10 chance. But I also realized I have to hunt for someone else in the meanwhile to lower my expectations ftom him and also lower my risk. So yes I will try both at my best :)
Customer reply replied 1 month ago
In this process, how can I unnoticeably drug him to get him addicted and fall in love lol?:)Since he doesn't even know what love is, how to make him feel and realize "this is it; this is love"?

Love is a chemical thing that have to do with multiple factors. Pheromones, body lenght ratios, smell, taste, collagen content, immuno system sampling etc.. All things happeing automatically. The brain can overwite a lot of those. Being in a sensory depravation area could help those reflex to come back. Like a rural area, no internet, less services of any kinds. That put the body in a reasearch for more alliance to fight the harshness of the environment.

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
You are talking about attraction and sensual. But I mean the profound love which is a feeling with depth
Customer reply replied 1 month ago
I would say respect, admire, trust, acceptance, compliments/appreciation, encouragement, all of these make a guy fall in love.

For that kind of love, one have to see the other as an extension of himself. That is the definition of a couple. The other must have a need of you to greatly increase his survival chance with you around. Hense the expression "sweet half".

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
He said the woman I caught him with is just a friend. I said yeah maybe you are just friend now but eventually you want to get into her pant. He said he won't do anything with her. Do you think what I said might push him to do something quicker with her? Will he really not do anything with her like he said?He said they took a Lyft together to a friend' place. I said she has a car why you need a Lyft? He then says never mind. I pushed him by saying oh so why you can't answer. He then said because we thought we are going to drink. I said she still has to drive home so it Durant make sense. He said because she didn't drink. Do you think he is lying? She was probably just at his place the whole time.

If she is only a friend and don'T plan to have that changing, he should have no problem to do an activiry with you 3.

About his Lyft story , it work but like you say, we can only say "probabl", no proof of anything else.

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Well you forgot he wouldn't meet me. Do you believe what he says that he will not do anything with her?
Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Should I tell him I am discouraged by his rejection to get back together? Also tell him my new interest, not individuals but more like certain type of people. Even ask his advice? Well he told me to go find someone better lol. This reverse psychology might work better?

I see no reason why he would say that and at the same time say he surely won't go back with you. If he really don't you back, i would have no reason to hise any new relation. If he plan to get back with you, it make no sense to start any relation either.

You sure can talk of this with him that you are discouraged but like i said, he need time and you decided you don't plan to give him much.

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
I mean sex. I know for sure he would look at her as relationship potential.Ok to show my other interest in men lol?
Customer reply replied 1 month ago
I mean sex. I know for sure he wouldn't look at her as relationship potential.Ok to show my other interest in men lol?

Yes you can show your interest in other men. Keep reminding him he is still in the race thats said.

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
do you think he will stick to his words that he won't do anything with her?
Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Still in the race - good idea ;)

If he said it, he probably wont. But if she decide to make an agressive move, and he drank, then who know.

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Lol!
Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Was it because he is embarrassed that I caught him so he decided better not to mess her with me?

Hard to say. What is important that said is to confront him with an humoristic tone because guys do NOT like an inquisitive girl, ex or not.

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Right I guess in any confrontations lol
Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Hi...you know I really thought about it. I think whatever we discussed in this thread might not be the most fundamental reasons. The foundamental reason is because he doesn't want a relationship and he is not looking for anyone. The fight is just the excuse to get out earlier. That is why after breaking up he is pretty clear on not looking for anyone.He was even saying he will never get married. After I called him a narcissist, in order to make himself look more normal, now he is saying he hasn't found the one. This guy changes his words all the time.So what do you think? The strategy would be revised a little bit or the same?You once said at age 30 the pattern starts set in and hard to change for life.
Customer reply replied 1 month ago
The other thing is I still have grudge and anger toward him for making me the victim of a dump whore so I can't hold back from scolding him. Any tips on refraining myself? I mean the emotions are real and legit just think about how this evil pathetic whore turned us enemies

He might never get a girlfriend ever again, it happen with a lot of men in reality. He does not like the word "commitment". He probably enjoy freedom more than any advantage of couple life.

The strategy need to be based on his most inner drive and need, anything targetting outside this will eventually fail over time even if it may look like a win initially.

As for the grudge, it is simple yet not easy. You simply have to decide that it does not matter, or you immerse yourself in so much hobby and activities or work that you won't have time anymore to thing about the grudge. Thinking about all the shitty things going on in the world help a lot to put things in perspective.

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
I think since I scolded him a lot, he is trying to project himself in a better way. So he changed his words from he will never get married to he is just not ready; from he doesn't need companionship to he just hasn't found the one.Also he is certain he wants kids 10 years later. But not necessarily want to be with the mom.He doesn't want any work, any drama, he wants anything easy. Even for friends, he doesn't want to put much time or effort into it and try to keep it as easy and simple as possible. Would you say he is narcissistic? My scolding probably helped him improve himself.So how to address the inner needs of someone like him?:) Note he is also freaking good at finding faults in others and use that to justify why he shouldn't commit. And he can even produce problems and magnify it. Just like how he did it with this whore. He made the issues much bigger and worse by playing a role of staying by the whore's side and ignore my needs.
Customer reply replied 1 month ago
Hi...so in order to make him believe I am not wanting to get back with him, I told him I am going out with guys, and even told him I went out with some very handsome guy in his country. And I am going again and a next door country which also has hot guys. I also messaged him some shit about the hooker, the new commoner and himself. Guess what? He called me, the first time ever since we broke up! I figured he is going to tell me to not send shit any more so I didn't pick up. But I think partly he was also triggered to call me. What do you think?Now I recalled I have several guys' phone number from that next door country. They also study at his school and same department. I figured I should try to go out with these guys, which will probably pgit his interest again (even a weird one). But these guys I met once at an event a long time ago. How do I find excuses to chat with them after months?

Not sure it is that is such a good idea to take some close to him like that. They may talk to each other and it may end up in your face into some kind of revenge Carrie style (the 1976 movie).

As for the phone call, good call to not pick it up right away, better to call him later for a surprise effect.

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Customer reply replied 1 month ago
I doubt he is that kind or theyvdvrn know each other. But I need some twisted angles that will blow him off. Talking about restricting someone, you have to have something shocking. It is not like the first time chemistry is enough. You can attract someone with the same quality. It has to be mind blowing
Customer reply replied 1 month ago
They don't know each other *Reattract someone *
Customer reply replied 1 month ago
You can't reattract someone with the same quality *
Customer reply replied 1 month ago
How do you think he feels when I tell him my story and interests with those men from his country or next door country, despite he told me to find someone better?

I can't talk for him. It may start jealousy in some or the thrill to fight to get you back. Others may see this as a case of too much competition and will decide to fade away instead of fighting.

What you will know that said is how much he care by the time he respond to this. If he was keeping you as a second choice, he may say something. If he really is not interessted in relationship anymore he will not react much.

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Customer reply replied 30 days ago
He called me for the first time, whatever the reason he reacted for the first time.Apparently he is done with the relationship as he said. But whether that change or not, would depend on how I make it happen.
Customer reply replied 30 days ago
The other reason telling him my interested in other guys work because he is on guard that I want to get back with him. He only wants to be friends if I really moved on so telling him my other interest will inform him I am no longer a threat because I moved on.The potential bonus is he gets jealous and kiggg think I have higher value now, especially I don't need him any more. That might drive him to the direction toward me.Either way I think I gain from this strategy. Because if he refused to be friends again, he would look unreasonable because I moved on :)
Customer reply replied 29 days ago
Do you think it is better I call or text him?

For serious matter, never text.

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Customer reply replied 29 days ago
But you think I should certainly call him back? Giving our situation...And what to talk about on the phone and the attitude if I am going to call him at least once a week

Yes, if you want to keep contact. Exchange news, both way. At this point you need to be friend again before being lovers again.

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Customer reply replied 29 days ago
It worked! Once I showed interest in other men, he lowered his guard and we had a good conversation today. Because I don't request anything, he can't reject so he didn't say let's say good bye for now.I just have to keep the conversation going and after a little while things will warm up and get natural. At that time I can work on taking things to the next level.What are your suggestions at that point to move things to the next level, besides those we already talked about?
Customer reply replied 29 days ago
Ps he is not jealous when I talk about other guys. He said he Durant care. Do you think he 100% doesn't or at least a little bit?And how can I make him gradually care more? By time it will happen right?

Other than letting time work, not much to do.

I don't like to give this trick, but if you genuinely love animals (and don't mind to be stuck with him if thing do not work out) , you could ask him to come with you to choose a pet at a shelter, mentioning that you need him to choose one with a good character. This may create a connection and he may want to see back the pet from time to time (if he also like animal).

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Customer reply replied 28 days ago
Well it is too early to ask to meet because he just lowered his guard. I think I probably have thrown him out a little bit by mentioning other guys. He was going online a lot last night probably trying to check my reactions.
Customer reply replied 28 days ago
Ps he is not jealous when I talk about other guys. He said he Durant care. Do you think he 100% doesn't or at least a little bit?
Customer reply replied 28 days ago
Do you think he really 100% doesn't care other guys, or more or less a little bit? I think he is also checking on my social page. What is he curious about?

Is is really hard to say if he really is 100% serious. I know a lot of guys that don't want relationship anymore, it is more common than 10 years ago.

He was perhaps curious about what they look like, thinking you perhaps posted picture of you with one.

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Customer reply replied 27 days ago
Oh I mean if he really doesn't care about other guys in terms of me, or more or less he could be a little jealous even he won't show it?
Customer reply replied 27 days ago
Is it possible to change the perspective of him not wanting a relationship?

That would require a big change in his environment to have him need an alliance with someone. That mean living in a remote area or chronically not able to get a job and starve a bit about money.

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Customer reply replied 26 days ago
I think there must be other ways, e.g. If I appear to be so unique to him, or make him fear losing me etc.So do you think he really doesn't care or jealousy?

That is the thing. You need to establish your value to him versus the drama and end up with a positive balance. I can personally appreciate all the quality of a good motorbike, yet i will never buy one.

As for jealousy, it usually come fast as those encline to it have no patience. If in a week, it does not do effect, he is not jealous at all.

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Customer reply replied 26 days ago
Well he could be jealous. But that doesn't mean it is enough to make him want to get back. So it is not necessary he'd act on it. It is not like you can just say a few words and do a few things then you are back together. It takes continuous effort till it reached the point of quantum leap

Yes, and that point is that he need to see value in the relation, and if he have a minimum of empathy that the value work in both sense. Just contiunous effort can equal an habit, and an habit is not a solid base. A well understood and logical need will be lot stable and also lot easier to fix if problem arise.

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Customer reply replied 26 days ago
Well for him to see value, we have to be in constant touch. And that is what I am establishing right now: a friend who has interest in other guys and not necessarily him. Without this nothing happens.You still didn't confirm if he is more or less a little bit jealousy or not. I noticed some behavior changes though when I acted like caring less
Customer reply replied 26 days ago
Behavior change in him

The behavoir change may come from the reducing in drama (the pressure you put on him to get him back). In any case, if in 2-3 days he does not make a definitive move, i would not call him very jealous if at all.

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Customer reply replied 25 days ago
Of course he will never be very jealousy. We have broken up. And don't think doing one thing will make things suddenly change. It is a process takes at least 2-3 months of continuous effort.
Customer reply replied 25 days ago
He was obviously coming online more and on bazaar schedules. That means more or less he cared tiny but more
Customer reply replied 25 days ago
Tiny bit more*
Customer reply replied 25 days ago
I'd say things are finally on the right track and by continuing it will gradually warm up.

" 2-3 months of continuous effort." That is why i mentioned initially the whole process will require time, you are the one that bring the two month limit :)

As long as you keep this very casual to not cause non needed pressure on him you might very well be on the right track.

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Customer reply replied 25 days ago
You are the one saying if he is not acting then he is not jealousy. My point is it takes continuous effort, not just a few actions. But I can feel since our last conversation I felt the best since breakup.I think it is not that he doesn't want relationship. He doesn't want drama and burden. If we try to establish "friendship" and there is no pressure, no drama, improvement from who we are in the past, I think getting back is just a natural result.
Customer reply replied 25 days ago
No one wants to pass a good deal, including him :) I don't think he wants to miss a good opportunity just for the sake of singlehood principle. But of course I have to become that opportunity for him.

Sure, if you can sell him the idea that you changed and are now less than ever a drama source and that you not only understand that but also firmly beleive it. Remember that said that he might have reacted on the surface sometime but hide his reaction to drama a lot of time making it not so obvious to you what are ALL the sources for him. You will need a lot of casual conversation with him to uncover all those sources and find all the pattern to them.

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Customer reply replied 23 days ago
Ok cool. What is a bummer is he will never reach out to me, and so basically that is what I have to do (keep talking to him) till the table turns around?
Customer reply replied 23 days ago
What are the ways to change the situation around if he would never initiate the contact? He did once after I mentioned other guys and yelled about his mistakes and the shit whxxx

Nothing much to do other than to keep the contact. What you need to do is to relate him stories that happened with you (where he would expect drama) and you end them with an anti-climatic no drama at all ending. Same if you can get into an argument with him over the phone, then very soon into the argument you say to him that he might be right and you bother too much for nothing about thins like that, to make him feel that you are now very easy to live with.

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Customer reply replied 23 days ago
I am feeling so unprivileged to have to be the one to keep calling so he can feel good about himself. And not much I can do to make him call me instead? And before that happens, I have to remain in contact correct? How often, once a week?
Customer reply replied 23 days ago
I mean the habit that he never calls. Nothing to do with drama but he thinks we broke up so he shouldn't give me any thoughts that he wants to get back so he wouldn't call to mislead me.
Customer reply replied 23 days ago
he does this to everyone, maybe feeling good that others call him and he feels being wanted. It is like a mindset. And you can't beat someone who thinks he doesn't need anyone (so he can always talk himself out of wanting to call you or go after you).What to do to change this?!! Why do I have to chase him lol
Customer reply replied 23 days ago
you said: no need to say you found someone, just that you saw someone interesting.
- well i said it. It obviously worked a bit on him. What to do next?
Customer reply replied 23 days ago
Hey since we are getting more friendly, do you think I should contact more frequently? And each time push it even more closer, warmer and deeper? Or Right now (I mean for the next contact) I should take a step back, and wait a little more longer so that way he will expect more? Then I will make it more frequent. But just do one time of longer waiting. Please let me know!
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