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My truck is an early 2004 (03 style motor) Ford F-250 6.0.

Has 303000 miles. It started having...
My truck is an early 2004 (03 style motor) Ford F-250 6.0. Has 303000 miles.
It started having a long crank to start followed by my dash oil pressure gauge falling to zero at idle but going to normal with higher rpms. I changed the low pressure oil sensor and it did not fix my issue next I used an actual pressure gauge at the pressure sensor port and read only 4psi at idle and with the truck throttled up it crept towards 12-15psi this is when my turbo started to spool up as well, I have been having some turbo issues but have checked the actuator and it was good. Thinking it’s related to my low pressure oil problem.
While cranking I use AE to monitor my high pressure oil it starts at zero and while cranking it bounces around 200-300psi up and down then finally hits 500+ and the truck starts. The ipr duty goes to 85 while cranking then once it fires up settles around 30-35% . The hpop pressure is around 1200psi at idle.
At first I was thinking low pressure pump and checked the pressure relief valve under the crank shaft Pully and it all slid right out.
Next I pulled my oil filter cap and pushed the drain back valve down and cranked the motor over the oil filter housing filled with out in a few seconds. Please help! I’m ready to pull my hair out. Thanks Rick
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Answered in 53 minutes by:
3/1/2018
Jeremy
Jeremy, Certified Diesel Technician/Electrician
Category: Ford
Satisfied Customers: 3,785
Experience: ASE, NATEF Engines and Electrical certified, EPA 608/609
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Drop the pan and check the oil pick up tube. Make sure there are no blockages or cracks. If none, then swap that pump. It sounds like the low oil pump is bad. It may have too much wear and causing a large gap in the gearing which is causing the pressure to be low due to wear.

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Customer reply replied 4 months ago
Ok I will drop the oil pan today and check it out. If the low oil pump was bad wouldn’t it just not work at all? The part that confuses me is I can hold the drain back plug down in the oil filter housing and crank the engine and the housing fills with oil within a few seconds.

It could still be debris at the screen though that gets sucked up.

These are bad to have that high pressure pump anti-drain back go bad. Have you changed that out or pulled it off to see if it is acting up?

With your AE, you wrote that the pressure bounces around 200-300. Does it fully drop out or only about 50 psi, then shoots up?

Was the IPR pulled to see if the screen was trashed up?

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Customer reply replied 4 months ago
I’m thinking it could be the oil pick up plugged a while back I changed a bad glow plug on the passenger side and plastic pieces of the glow plug wire harness were brittle and broke off falling down into the oil galley in the head that goes down to the crank case after looking around online most posts I found said the small pieces would be fine that If they made it to the pump they would just get chewed up but no one mantioned the pieces plugging up the oil pickup I have my fingers crossed that this is my problem.You are talking about the anti drain back in the oil filter housing correct? It does work I had my truck sitting for a week and then pulled the filter cap to see if I could tell if it had had oil in it and the filter was wet with oil up to about 3/4.I have pulled the ipr and the screen was fine still there nothing on it, when I have the truck running before I used AE to control the IPR and would notice a change in engine sound so I know it was working.The high pressure oil usually starts out 0 then 200-300 then back down to 0 for a few seconds then spikes around 2-300 then 500+ it fires up

I'm referring to the oil drain back at the HPOP. You pull the HPOP and there is a check valve under it. A lot of people forget it is there. It's job is to keep the reservoir full for cranking the engine. When it acts up, it will drain off the oil and the pump has to basically reprime the rail and the HPOP. that may be the reason for the shock. With the new info, that debris may have gotten caught by the pump and chewed up, but got stuck in that check valve and is holding it open.

I would check there and replace it. It is a common problem on the early 6.0L, same as that oil line leaking. It will blow out, but when it leaks, the pressure won't build. This one it does, but acts like it is oil starving the first few rotations and then primes up and bam, engine start.

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Customer reply replied 4 months ago
Ok so I was already on the mission to check the low pressure pump and oil pick up since the LPOP looked easier to get to I checked it and it looks ok there is a tiny line in the back cover my finger nail barley catches on it and I don’t see any marks on the gears would this small scratch cause my problem? I haven’t gotten to the oil pickup yet kind of dreading it. At this point wondering if I really need to fork over the $600 or so that the back covers go for or if I should just replace the gears the front cover looks perfect, or just put it back together and check it off the list? The truck has over 300k miles could the LPOP gears be worn so much that they don’t build enough pressure at idle?
I also haven’t gotten a chance to check the HPOP drain back valve do I have to pull the turbo and intake to access this? I read on some forums there may be a place to check and see if the HPOP resiviour has oil in it or not without taking everything apart?

If you are at idle and the low pressure guage in the truck was at 1/4 or less, then the pump may be worn at that mileage. That isbordere line for the mileage anyway for a LPOP.

That line you see wouldn't cause the low oil pressure, but that does scream out that debris did get into that pump so there may be gears in the pump that may be damaged. I know it is a bear, but you might need to pull it and look at those gears, and that "kiss" distance on the gearing. If the gears are spaced more than 1/4", toss that pump and get a new one. I believe the spec is 1/16", but they still flow at that much.

If more comfortable, get a high flow one. If you run any tunes on the truck or plan to, I suggest a high flow one for it will give your best performance. Look for a 60 psi relief on the high flow. You can do a 80 lbs relief as well if you tow a lot, but a 60 is ideal. They are cheaper aftermarket than dealer, and built better. They use cast instead of aluminum gears.

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Customer reply replied 4 months ago
your talking about replacing the low pressure gears with high flow ones?

Replace the pump with a high flow pump if the low pump is worn out. If it isn't worn out, then move to the top of the engine. If you start cranking the engine and the oil gauge immediately jumps up, then the low pump should be good.

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Customer reply replied 4 months ago
When I crank the engine the low pressure does not immediatley jump up.

That is a low oil pressure pump fault then. The oil pressure should jump the moment you start cranking.

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Look for a Melling brand pump if you can. The other would be from here CLICK HERE for they have cast instead of aluminum. It will last a whole lot longer and you'll most likely never need to change it again. I buy from them often.

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Customer reply replied 4 months ago
I looked all over just now for a high flow melling LPOP with no luck only found them for the 7.3L mine is a 6.0 any ideas where I can find one? Thanks

I have a high HP tuner specialist expert next to me tell me that TamerX bought the pump rights from Melling and doubled the price of the pumps by selling as a full on kit instead of just the gears. It used to be that you buy the gears from Melling and the plate from Black Diamond, but TamerX now has them together as a full on kit and the other 2 are no longer selling them. I haven't looked at the price yet, but they are apparently now $200 more than they used to be because of demand. He said he just bought 2 of them for a customer with 2 trucks that he is bullet proofing next week. He said to try there if you want the best pump on the market.

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SKU: TX-EOP60K

Part# TX-EOP60K

BARCODE: 086547479899

That is what is on the box.

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He just sent me the link.

CLICK HERE

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Customer reply replied 4 months ago
That is crazy expensive compared to a stock one only difference I can tell is they sell it with a steel plate that can cover any scratches that may be in the front cover so that it doesn’t have to be replaced but didn’t notice anything in the details about it being higher volume than stock. I just found a New genuine Ford gear set with the same part number you sent me for $50 and made an offer of $40 and they accepted. So I will install this new pump when it comes in and see if it helps. Will also still be dropping the pan and checking oil pickup for debris when I get time. Thanks

You're welcome.

I agree, it is super expensive. I dropped my jaw when I saw it, too.

You can get the plate for cheaper too. I prefer the Melling for they run about $140 with the Black Diamond brand cover, but I have been looking for a bit now and can't find anyone that has them anymore. I doubt my shop customers will pay the other price for that pump, too.

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Customer reply replied 4 months ago
I ordered the fitting that goes into the ICP port for air testing the HPOP system for leaks, will this also show me if the anti drain back in the HPOP resiviour is leaking?

Yes for you will hear the air blasting through the back of the HPOP under the cover. You can hear it quite well. If the oil is still drained, it will send a lot of pressure out the oil drain hole too.

You'll need to power the IPR and do so briefly to close it fully to be sure the air is not coming through it.

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Customer reply replied 4 months ago
Ok so I installed a new ipr tonight and put my adapter in the ICP port and pressured it up to 150psi with shop air. I could feel air coming out of the driver side valve cover vent and also the oil fill cap on the passenger side I used AE to adjust my ipr all the way closed and could still feel air coming out of both sides and when I commanded ipr full open noticed more air coming out. Looks like I have a high HPO leak somewhere will try pulling the valve covers next to see if it’s leaking from either oil rail, if the HPOP was bad would it be leaking the air or does the leak just mean a bad seal somewhere in the system? Thanks

That would be a bad seal in the system with what you described. Not the HPOP.

So the rail is leaking the oil down and cause starvation when the engine is off. That now explains a lot more of what is going on.

The kits are inexpensive. I suggest if you are doing one side to knock them both out. It will save you aggravation later. Been down that road many times. I would do one side to have the truck come back a month later for the other.

Jeremy
Jeremy, Certified Diesel Technician/Electrician
Category: Ford
Satisfied Customers: 3,785
Experience: ASE, NATEF Engines and Electrical certified, EPA 608/609
Verified
Jeremy and 87 other Ford Specialists are ready to help you
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Customer reply replied 4 months ago
I pulled my turbo off tonight and then repressured the system using shop air and comanded ipr closed I can hear air noticeably louder coming out of the turbo drain back tube this goes into the hpop cover correct? The hissing sound is loudest at the drain back tube using a piece of vac line to my ear and putting it into the oil fill spout on passenger side and and then the ccv hole on the driver side.
Customer reply replied 4 months ago
Finally found time to drop the oil pan PITA! Found all 12 pieces of plastic that broke off of my glow plug connectors and also the remains of 3 injector screws that were broken when I first got the truck which I already replace all injectors. There were a couple of pieces of plastic in the oil pickup the rest were in the pan not sure if there were more blocking the pickup before it dropped into the pan so that I could pull the pan out or not but either way they aren’t in there any more. Also installed my new LPOP and packed it with grease. Going to clean up the pan and reinstall it then move back up top to find that high pressure oil leak. I’m thinking maybe oring at the top tube on the HPOP.

If you have that plastic in the pan like that, it probably got into the HPOP as well. Clean the whole system out of what you can find, then use a oil cleaner wit ha really cheap oil for a 50 mile run and dump to get rid of all the other junk in there. That plastic can cause havoc on the IPR later.

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Customer reply replied 4 months ago
When the pieces of plastic first broke off of the glow plug connector I counted 12 missing pieces, I found 12 pieces in the oil pan they were all to big to go through the screen on the oil pickup.

You're good then.

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Customer reply replied 4 months ago
Ok update and I’m 100% sure I found my problem! Finally found time to pull the HPOP and what do you know the ball/plug on the side of the pump is missing I found the ball down the back of the engine cover on the passenger side just need to retrieve it. Was going to just tap some threads into the pump hole and install a threaded plug but I do notice that while applying pressure to one side of the pump I can hear a small hiss on the other side so might as well replace the pump while I’m this far in anyways. Going with an adrenaline pump as my replacement as I have read 2 out of 3 reman pumps fail shortly after install.

Do not do a reman pump. I agree. They have a lot of issues on them.

That ball is an anti-drain back.

The adrenaline pumps are good pumps.

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