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2004 Ford: f450 with a 6.0 diesel..cranks..engine oil..oil pressure

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I have a 2004 Ford...
I have a 2004 Ford E-450 with a 6.0 diesel. It cranks forever before building any engine oil pressure. I removed both valve covers and ran engine. I noticed oil coming from tops off all injectors equally between injectors and oil manifold, is this normal? I then removed the icp sensor and blew air into the high pressure system. I had no leaks around oil manifolds but could hear gurgling internally in the v of the engine. I have a manual gauge in the engine oil psi sensor hole. It takes about 1min before engine will build pressure and start. Once started I only have 7psi at idle 15psi at 1200 and 20psi at 2200. While monitoring injection control pressure on scanner desired and actual seem to stay very close with pressures ranging from 850 at idle to 2200 psi at 2000rpms and 58%duty cycle. I even blew smoke into high pressure system and it did not come out. I feel this is a low pressure problem but not sure. Customer ran this engine with only 5 quarts of oil for a couple hundred miles. However this problem was preexisting. I did an oil and filter change and noticed some brass in the filter housing. I also removed the bypass valve in the front of the oil pump and it was good, no broken spring and normal wear. Please help. I have read these horror stories and found that the only way anyone fixed this is to replace everything. I am not a parts changer and would like to find the root cause.
Submitted: 8 years ago.Category: Ford
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Answered in 7 hours by:
6/25/2010
Ford Mechanic: Dieseljunky2, Ford Mechanic replied 8 years ago
Dieseljunky2
Dieseljunky2, Ford Mechanic
Category: Ford
Satisfied Customers: 3,947
Experience: ASE Certified, Ford Certified, Cummins Certified, & 20+ years in field experience
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Hello, the duty cycle on the ipr, was that at idle? How many miles on the engine and is it dirty inside? Do you have a jumper for the ipr valve? I would like to know if the gurgling stops when the ipr has a full 12 volts applied? Thanks
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Customer reply replied 8 years ago
This engine has 118,505 miles on it and the engine is clean inside. With key on engine off I have 12.6vdc on yellow and red wire going to ipr and 11.8vdc on red wire going to ipr. Once engine is started I have 12.6 on yellow and red wire and 1.1vdc on red wire at ipr. With coolant temp at 152f and engine at idle the desired ICP is 658.16 and actual is 658.33. The inj control psi regulator duty cycle is at 29%, with only 3psi of engine oil psi. The inj control psi voltage is 0.90. At 1200 rpm's the desired ICP is 750 and the actual is 750 duty cycle is 33%, inj control psi voltage is 1.0, and engine oil psi is 12. At 2000 rpm's desired ICP is 1150 and actual is 1150 at 38% duty cycle and 1.35v with 22psi of engine oil pressure.
Ford Mechanic: Dieseljunky2, Ford Mechanic replied 8 years ago
OK, the high side oil system is operating ok since the percentage is below 40% and the desired is following the actual. Pop out the oil filter and look down in the bottom of the filter housing with a light. There are two little plastic valves that let the oil filter drain down when the engine is off. I have seen these plastic valves break off. This allows oil pressure to dump back into the oil pan instead of going through the engine. Let me know what you find. Thanks
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Customer reply replied 8 years ago
This is a e450 box van and the oil filter is down low on the left side of engine instead of on top beside the secondary fuel filter. This is one area I was confused about because all the info I could find showed the filter you are referring to. This canister has nothing in the bottom. I figured this was remote mount since it was a van, so how does the oil return work in this application.
Ford Mechanic: Dieseljunky2, Ford Mechanic replied 8 years ago
Yeah, I now realize the E-series. There is no return on this application. The next step would be to remove and inspect the oil pump in the front cover for damage. I know this is not n easy task, but it is the next step in the diagnostic tree. Thanks
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Customer reply replied 8 years ago
I have removed the front cover from the oil pump and pulled the gear assembly out. No noticeable damage. The gear teeth are frosted but no flaking. There is very little aluminum debris in pump housing. The pump and front cover have very little wear. Nothing that does not seem normal.
Ford Mechanic: Dieseljunky2, Ford Mechanic replied 8 years ago
Let me think about this for a little bit, I will get back with you when I think of something. Thanks.
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Ford Mechanic: Dieseljunky2, Ford Mechanic replied 8 years ago
I have talked this over with the other techs. Are you using a Ford or Motorcraft oil filter? The only other thing we can think of besides a bad filter would be a broken piston cooler nozzle. This would cause a massive oil leak inside the engine. Unfortunately to even check these, you have to remove the oil pan. On an E-450, this requires engine removal. Thanks
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Customer reply replied 8 years ago
As I stated earlier when this truck came in it was very low on oil and we changed the oil and filter. The oil pressure problem was preexisting. I ran the engine for a short time and removed filter, it contains what appears to be bearing material, however engine is not knocking yet. When engine is warm it only has 2lbs. of oil pressure and was driven over a long distance to get here. I was wanting to know since this e-series has the remote mounted filter without the drainback valve can this filter head assembly dump oil pressure. I have over 10 years as a factory trained Caterpillar engine mechanic and have built hundreds of engines. The only time I have seen a problem with piston coolers is from improper installation. What about a cam bearing that has pushed out of the bore is this a possibility. Have you seen problems with piston coolers in this engine? I totally agree that our problem is on the low pressure lube oil side. Cat uses the same type of hydraulic electronic unit injectors with a high pressure pump and oil manifolds. All of our numbers looked good on this engine. Desired followed actual and duty cycle stayed normal. I will once again install a new ford oil filter and give it a shot even though I feel we have a serious internal leak. Thank you, XXXXX XXXXX keep you posted.
Ford Mechanic: Dieseljunky2, Ford Mechanic replied 8 years ago
On the 6.0 Ford, piston cooler nozzles are a fairly common problem. Although I have not replaced any on an E series, I have replaced many on the F series. The remote filter cannot dump pressure since it has no dump valves inside it. I have not seen any problems at all with cam bearings. Take the oil drain plug out, and then bend a piece of wire so that you can spin it around the bottom of the pan through the drain plug hole. If it is a broken nozzle, you should hit it with the wire. Thanks
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Customer reply replied 8 years ago
Ok, thank you. I'll keep you posted
Ford Mechanic: Dieseljunky2, Ford Mechanic replied 8 years ago
ok
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