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Can i install a gfci breaker box when i have only three

Customer Question
wires coming from the main...
can i install a gfci breaker box when i have only three wires coming from the main panel two hots and a ground?
Submitted: 1 year ago.Category: Electrical
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Customer reply replied 1 year ago
no netural wire from main panel to hot tub
Answered in 23 minutes by:
9/9/2016
Electrician: Kevin, Licensed Electrical Contractor replied 1 year ago
Kevin
Kevin, Licensed Electrical Contractor
Category: Electrical
Satisfied Customers: 3,791
Experience: 31 years Licensed Electrical Contractor in Illinois, Adjunct College Electrical Instructor, Former Electrical Inspector, Diploma: Digital Electronics, FCC Technician License
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Hello and welcome to Just Answer. My name is ***** ***** I will be happy to assist you with your electrical question.

1) Yes, it is called a double pole GFCI disconnect circuit breaker.

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Customer reply replied 1 year ago
How do i wire the gfci woth no netural from main panel
Electrician: Kevin, Licensed Electrical Contractor replied 1 year ago

1) Install a double pole GFCI breaker at the main panel or at a sub-panel. A GFCI double pole breaker requires a neutral bus bar connection for the white neutral pigtail. Otherwise, the GFCI breaker will not work.

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Customer reply replied 1 year ago
Ok im install the sub panel with the gfci breaker but were to i get the netural wire from ,can not be ran from main panel?
Electrician: Kevin, Licensed Electrical Contractor replied 1 year ago

1) If the hot tub is exterior, then the disco box feeder circuit requires 2 hots, 1 neutral and 1 equipment ground. Won't work without a neutral wire from the feeder circuit.

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Customer reply replied 1 year ago
exterior tub so im screwed then?
Customer reply replied 1 year ago
Can i make the ground wire from the feeder circuit the neturalwire?
And put a ground wire on the disco box?
Electrician: Kevin, Licensed Electrical Contractor replied 1 year ago

1) If the feeder conductors from the main panel to the exterior disco panel were installed using a raceway (conduit), it may be possible to add the required neutral conductor.

2) No, a bare copper ground wire is only allowed to act as an equipment ground and never allowed to act as a neutral. Code violation:)

Refer to the diagram shown below for a hot tub disco switch connection:

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Customer reply replied 1 year ago
I believe its a just a wire not bare
Can it be done that way then?
Electrician: Kevin, Licensed Electrical Contractor replied 1 year ago

1) Another option, is to install a double pole exterior rated NEMA 3R weatherproof disconnect switch for the outside and install a double pole GFCI breaker in the house panel.

2) The 3rd wire can only be used as a neutral if it is white, grey or black (re-identified as a white neutral). However, the hot tub will not contain an equipment ground. Hot tub disco's require a 4 wire circuit or at a minimum, a 2 wire circuit for the 240 volt connection and the 3rd wire to be used as an equipment ground if a double pole disco switch is used.

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Customer reply replied 1 year ago
But i will still not have a neutral wire at the dsco box?
Customer reply replied 1 year ago
Thats a throw swicth?
Customer reply replied 1 year ago
Thats what they use for air conditioners
Electrician: Kevin, Licensed Electrical Contractor replied 1 year ago

1) If the feeder circuit was installed in metal conduit, then the metal conduit will act as the equipment ground. If the feeder was installed in PVC gray electrical conmduit, then a separate equipment ground wire is required.

2) Hot tubs are either a combo of 120/240 or 240 volts only. Your model only requires 240 volts. Therefore, a neutral is not required for the tub connection. Look at the diagram I sent you. However, a double pole GFCI breaker requires a neutral connection for the white curly pigtail to a neutral bus bar. Your feeder circuit does not contain a neutral, therefore, you either need to install a neutral for the feeder or install a new 4 wire circuit or install a doublee pole disconnect switch at the exterior. No other choices on the matter in order to be code compliant.

3) Yes, it is called a NEMA rated 3R double pole disco switch. The disco switch must be rated for the same amps as the double pole breaker.

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Electrician: Kevin, Licensed Electrical Contractor replied 1 year ago

1) If the feeder circuit was installed in metal conduit, then the metal conduit will act as the equipment ground. If the feeder was installed in PVC gray electrical conmduit, then a separate equipment ground wire is required.

2) Hot tubs are either a combo of 120/240 or 240 volts only. Your model only requires 240 volts. Therefore, a neutral is not required for the tub connection. Look at the diagram I sent you. However, a double pole GFCI breaker requires a neutral connection for the white curly pigtail to a neutral bus bar. Your feeder circuit does not contain a neutral, therefore, you either need to install a neutral for the feeder or install a new 4 wire circuit or install a double pole disconnect switch at the exterior. No other choices on the matter in order to be code compliant.

3) Yes, it is called a NEMA rated 3R double pole disco switch. The disco switch must be rated for the same amps as the double pole breaker.

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Customer reply replied 1 year ago
if i install the gfci breaker in the main box and a quick disconnect at the outside then im gf i protected?
Electrician: Kevin, Licensed Electrical Contractor replied 1 year ago

1) The hot tub must have a means of disconnect nearby. Either install a:

A) GFCI disco switch installed at the exterior using a 4 wire feeder circuit

or

B) A GFCI breaker installed in the main or sub-panel and and exterior disco switch. One of these is required to meet code.

2) Yes that is correct. If installing a double pole GFCI breaker at the main panel and an exterior rated NEMA 3R double pole disco switch, the hot tub will still be GFCI protected from the breaker installed at the panel. Totally code compliant and GFCI protected:)

If you have any additional questions, just let me know and I’ll be glad to answer them for you.

Otherwise, don’t forget to rate me before you log Off.

Thanks...........Kevin:)

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Customer reply replied 1 year ago
Thank you very much for your help
Electrician: Kevin, Licensed Electrical Contractor replied 1 year ago

No problem, glad to assist.

If you have any additional questions, just let me know and I’ll be glad to answer them for you.

Otherwise, don’t forget to rate me before you log Off.

Thanks...........Kevin:)

Ask Your Own Electrical Question
Electrician: Kevin, Licensed Electrical Contractor replied 1 year ago

If you have any additional questions, just let me know and I’ll be glad to answer them for you.

Otherwise, don’t forget to rate me before you log Off.

Thanks............Kevin:)

Ask Your Own Electrical Question
Electrician: Kevin, Licensed Electrical Contractor replied 1 year ago

If you have any additional questions, just let me know and I’ll be glad to answer them for you.

Otherwise, don’t forget to rate me before you log Off.

Thanks..............Kevin:)

Ask Your Own Electrical Question
Electrician: Kevin, Licensed Electrical Contractor replied 1 year ago

If you have any additional questions, just let me know and I’ll be glad to answer them for you.

Otherwise, don’t forget to rate me before you log Off.

Thanks...............Kevin:)

Ask Your Own Electrical Question
Electrician: Kevin, Licensed Electrical Contractor replied 1 year ago

If you have any additional questions, just let me know and I’ll be glad to answer them for you.

Otherwise, don’t forget to rate me before you log Off.

Thanks...............Kevin:)

Ask Your Own Electrical Question
Electrician: Kevin, Licensed Electrical Contractor replied 1 year ago

If you have any additional questions, just let me know and I’ll be glad to answer them for you.

Otherwise, don’t forget to rate me before you log Off.

Thanks...............Kevin:)

Ask Your Own Electrical Question
Electrician: Kevin, Licensed Electrical Contractor replied 1 year ago

If you have any additional questions, just let me know and I’ll be glad to answer them for you.

Otherwise, don’t forget to rate me before you log Off.

Thanks...............Kevin:)

Ask Your Own Electrical Question
Ask Kevin Your Own Question
Kevin
Kevin
Kevin, Licensed Electrical Contractor
Category: Electrical
Satisfied Customers: 3,791
3,791 Satisfied Customers
Experience: 31 years Licensed Electrical Contractor in Illinois, Adjunct College Electrical Instructor, Former Electrical Inspector, Diploma: Digital Electronics, FCC Technician License

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