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Dr. Bruce
Dr. Bruce, Veterinarian
Category: Dog Veterinary
Satisfied Customers: 18930
Experience:  15 years of experience as a small animal veterinarian
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We took our beloved well cared for poodle to our vet he had

Customer Question

We took our beloved well cared for poodle to our vet he had gone early went to other he suggested he said she needs critical care could be pneumonia or pulmonary embolism I drove 46 minutes told exactly what the vet said to relay they took another dog ahead of us who had a temp when we got in vet kept accusing us we are in late 70's of tramatizing dog falling on it or rat bait because she had so much fluid on lungs started coughing blood we are with her 24//7 she is our darling she gave her lascivious and nitroglycerin afraid if she drew blood it might kill her put her n oxygen chamber 62% and young purple when we left orig vet he said younger pink heart rate good breathing sounded like some wheezing
In less than a. Hour we lost her I just called asked her to give blood results I paid for them to be done after she passed her white count was 31,000 clotting normal help me I feel she was an elderly uncaring poorly aware vet
Submitted: 1 year ago.
Category: Dog Veterinary
Customer: replied 1 year ago.
I gave info need answers
Expert:  Dr. Bruce replied 1 year ago.

Hi. My name is***** I'm very sorry to hear about your loss of Daisy. This is a very sad situation. When a dog is coughing up blood, I get really concerned for underlying heart disease, electrocution injuries, trauma / contusions, and coagulation issues. If her clotting times were normal, then it would seem that a coagulopathy would not be present. Did they hear any murmurs or did she have a history of a heart murmur? Was she one to chew on things?

Customer: replied 1 year ago.
No heart murmurs she was just a vet for usual check up never chewed on anything I have her X-rays and lab work on my e ail do you want them she started coughing blood in the oxygen chamber I am extremely concerned about the quality of care provided
Customer: replied 1 year ago.
Her reg vet is shocked the vet we took her to before he said go to speciality care said she was not that bad he had us take her as he was going to be out starting tommorow for 4 weeks due to back surgery other vet is closed on Wednesday
Customer: replied 1 year ago.
Dog was not coughing or coughing blood until put in oxygen cage
Customer: replied 1 year ago.
Will you be responding
Expert:  Dr. Bruce replied 1 year ago.

Sorry for my delay. IF she had no heart murmurs in the past, then that is would seem to make heart issues more unlikely. But not totally impossible. I've seen two dogs in my career go into fulminant heart failure and look just like this because they tore a valve in their heart. So this is a possibility here. When they are coughing up blood, the situation is very, very, very bad. Honestly, when a dog is coughing up blood, that is just a fraction of the blood that is in the lungs. The overall lung function is very critically compromised and when this happens, almost all are going to be lost unless they can be ventilated for. This is something that not very many clinics have available.

Customer: replied 1 year ago.
I will wait 5 more minutes for response if not I will cancel service for full refund thank you
Expert:  Dr. Bruce replied 1 year ago.

The reason the blood started to be coughed up in the oxygen cage is not because of anything they did. IT is because the underlying problem was progressing. The lungs were filling with a hemorrhagic fluid and it finally was enough to physically be brought up.

Customer: replied 1 year ago.
What is the underlying problem ? My husband is a medical dr and I'm a retired lawyer he said with any suspicions for infection a bolt of antibiotics is indicated what was presented gave immediate rise to potential infection
Expert:  Dr. Bruce replied 1 year ago.

The underlying problem is what caused the hemorrhagic fluid in the lungs. Was this due to a heart valve tearing? Was it due to an electrocution injury? I've seen similar cases when dogs chew on electrical cords and get shocked and they get this fluid in the lungs.

Customer: replied 1 year ago.
There are no electrical cords for her to chew on we have grandchildren our home has been professionally child proofed we paid in excess of $6000 to have every cord coved in pvc every door is child proof and we have security nanny cams in every room I just pulled the tapes while waiting for the last 32 days I can track movement in every room and she did not chew nor have access to any elect cords so that is no a consideration often also my husband said in an injury such as this when present n the ear there can be evidence on the tongue nothing
Customer: replied 1 year ago.
Electrocution when presented in the e r spell check correction
Expert:  Dr. Bruce replied 1 year ago.

You have the house in a condition that makes that electrocution injury basically a non-issue. Your husband is correct in that looking for a burn / lesion on the lips, tongue, or check could further indicate that. I've seen some though that have no oral lesions that can be found. If there wasn't a coagulation issue, no electrocution injury, no trauma / contusions, then a tearing of a chordae tendinae with one of the valves may just be the underlying cause. I remember my first one so clearly as it was a greyhound that presented acutely with increased respiratory effort that progressed quickly to fulminant pulmonary edema with frothy blood tinged fluid. It was an eye opener in my early career about how quickly a body can be compromised and pass when that serious of an injury happens.

Customer: replied 1 year ago.
I find it hard to handle when she said I don't really know maybe pneumonia way to vague to be acceptable from an e r specialist fortunately I have x rays( radiographs) and labs . What is your next possible thought
Expert:  Dr. Bruce replied 1 year ago.

Pneumonia typically doesn't have this quick of a progression and bloody fluid being coughed up. Could there have been a situation where a very odd situation like a lung tumor ruptured and started to bleed into the lungs?

Customer: replied 1 year ago.
The vet took radiographs said when my husband looked with her both agreed no evidence of tumor has to be something and we will get to the bottom most vets are caring and compassionate I believe she was beyond her depth and I will get to the bottom I still see no reason why she is gone she repeatedly seemed to be guessing I had to beg her to check her oxygen rate and then she said she's dying I walked out devestated then she came back and said you won't believe it but she's hanging on I said why can't you test her blood she shrugged Never had I had a vet so uncertain of anything my husband could read the x Ray better than she did
Expert:  Dr. Bruce replied 1 year ago.

One of the things you could request is to have the x-rays reviewed / sent to a boarded veterinary radiologist to see what their interpretation of the films are. I will say this, some veterinarians are better than others. That is just the nature of it. Just the other day, my wife's cousins's puppy was handled in a manner by two veterinarians prior to myself being involved that I was a tad (that is phrasing it very nicely) frustrated with.

Customer: replied 1 year ago.
My husband said had it bed a valve tear the blood would have been significant this was minimal I will call the board tommorow as well as my former firm I hope your puppy is still alive ours is gone and I will get to the bottom of this and if I find any incompetence I will take every action legally afforded me no one should suffer like we are unless someone can convince me why and why it wasn't preventable it make necessitate the courts and I am willing to go there
Expert:  Dr. Bruce replied 1 year ago.

To get a specific answer at this time as to the passing may be something that isn't possible. If you want to get more answers, I don't know if doing a necropsy is something that can still be done. The case I was referencing early in my career had the torn cordae diagnosed at necropsy as nothing before it had given that answer. Our puppy is doing well at this time, thank you for your concern. I wish I could do something else for your little one. I hate to say it like this, but sometimes some conditions are so severe that nothing in our power can reverse / treat the situation. I've had numerous cases in my career where all my knowledge, skill and care didn't save the patient as the underlying disease / injury was just too severe.

Customer: replied 1 year ago.
Thank you just off the phone with chairman of vet med at my husbands alma mata good to have friends in great places. I defend his son in a high profile case successfully and he said if I ever needed him call we did. I have sent him all documents. I feel I'm on more solid ground the concentration on trauma was not evidenced in what he saw he is board certified in radiology and his dept chairman in that field . Saw nothing . Questioning why blood not drawn stat when she wasn't in such distress and why as triage facility was she passed over for others arriving later. My husband noted the chief complaints as owners expressed to receptionist. None warranted priority including slight fever after Inj a day earlier. As stated I intend to escalate this. Including legal system if needed.
Expert:  Dr. Bruce replied 1 year ago.

I'm glad you have that sounding board of a friend to run things by and to have them check things over. They are going to be the best at this time as far as helping you to determine where and what the next step is. I can't say why and what reasoning things were done as they were. I absolutely understand that heart break at this time of not having Daisy with you. My deepest condolences go out to you and your husband.

Expert:  Dr. Bruce replied 1 year ago.
Hi,

I'm just following up on our conversation about Daisy. How is everything going?

Dr. Bruce

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