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I have a 1986 Case backhoe super E model that I purchased a…

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Hi! I have a...

Hi! I have a 1986 Case backhoe super E model that I purchased a year ago. The original owners manual indicates that you push the clutch cutout pedal when changing gears however this backhoe is not equipped with a clutch cutout pedal. The seller said that he always kept in first but if he need to change gears he would shut the machine down then change gears. My father-in-law says that you can change gear on the fly but you first put it in neutral and very quickly change gears. Do you know how you are suppose to change gears on a super e that is built without clutch cutout pedal?.

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1986 Case 580 Super E, serial # 17038708

Submitted: 3 years ago.Category: Construction and Road Equipment
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Answered in 2 hours by:
5/29/2019
Mechanic: catmastertech, Technician replied 3 years ago
catmastertech
catmastertech, Technician
Category: Construction and Road Equipment
Satisfied Customers: 3,963
Experience: Field service technician for CAT 19 years.
Verified

Hello,

Unless you have a special model, the 580 Super E has a shuttle shift lever by the steering column (forward and reverse) with a four-speed manual in the floor.

The shuttle shift transmission uses an electric control solenoid to "declutch" the transmission for shifting. You may have two buttons for this purpose.

One will be on the four-speed shift lever and the other may be on the loader control lever. Some had the power passing through these push button switches to turn on the declutch solenoid but, most use the switches to ground the circuit and that would allow the solenoid to activate the declutch function.

This often failed so most operators would just move the shuttle lever to neutral and then shift the transmission to the desired speed.

You only need to stay in first speed for hard pushing with the loader bucket. The second speed is more practical for most operations. The third can be used as long as you don' push heavy loads into the bucket as a long stall of the torque converter can cause it to overheat.

Four speed should only be used for roading the machine. You can start in fourth if you do not have any steep elevations to climb. It is a good practice to never road a machine for more than thirty minutes without allowing a thirty minute cooldown period.

I hope this helps answer your question. If you do need more help, please let me know.

Thanks, Don

CATMASTERTECH

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Customer reply replied 3 years ago
Thank you for your thorough response. Don’ have button on shift level but do on loader control lever however it does nothing. When I move the shuttle lever to neutral and shift gears, can I do this while moving or gas to be in stop position. I will test shifting gears tomorrow.
Mechanic: catmastertech, Technician replied 3 years ago

It is recommended for stationary shifts but, I have not seen any issue as long as you shift with the throttle at idle and the shuttle in neutral. (like shifting from third to fourth)

Do not shift while power is applied to the transmission or at very high speeds. Downshift to a lower speed ONLY at a stop.

The second reason they have a button on the loader lever is to allow you to declutch the transmission and have full engine power supplied to the loader bucket for heavy work.

(If you were digging into hard ground and need more engine power to the loader lift function then you can press the declutch button and get full power without having to move the shift lever to neutral.)

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Customer reply replied 3 years ago
Hi! I tried changing gears with backhoe in a stationary position, shuttle lever in neutral and throttle in idle but it still grinds. I tried 1st to 2nd, neutral to 2nd, but it still grinds. Is it possible that my clutch solenoid is not getting power or is not working? If so, can I check power at the solenoid connector with a test light(does any levers have to be in a certain position? Does the key need to be in the on position?)? I can change gears to any gear when the machine is turned off. Thanks
Mechanic: catmastertech, Technician replied 3 years ago

Hello,

Does this machine try to move when the shuttle is in neutral? Does it spin the wheels fast when you lift the wheels off the ground?

Are you noticing high transmission oil temperatures?

The solenoid will work or not work but, it will never cause this problem. It only dumps pressure from the drive so, you would either move or not move if it stuck on.

I don't have a schematic but, the circuit is fairly simple. It may send power to the solenoid and then the switch will provide a ground when pressed.

I don't use test lights anymore as I feel it is more important to know the exact voltage present and the resistance of the circuit over just powering a light.

Many machines I work on have these disconnected as a short in the harness will prevent the shuttle transmission from engaging.

It should not be required to change speeds. You may have worn synchronizers in the speed transmission or something is causing a drag in the shuttle transmission and keeps it spinning.

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Customer reply replied 3 years ago
Hi,
The machine doesn’t want to move in neutral and the wheels don’t spin when the wheels are off the ground. There is no high transmission oil temperatures.I am not a mechanic and I really don’t want to get into checking voltages. I just have a test light. There is a wire with a connector coming off the solenoid. Can I just check the wire going to the solenoid to see if there is power?Also, if I do have some other issue such as worn synchronizes or some drag, if the solenoid is working then I should be able to shift gears, right? Just trying to understand my options.I appreciate your help.
Mechanic: catmastertech, Technician replied 3 years ago

The worn synchronizers would be in the four-speed manual transmission. If either the input shaft from the shuttle or the output shaft from the rear axle are turning, the gears may clash and grind. Drag from the shuttle transmission would not stop by using the solenoid.

Using a test light is fine, but you need to know which way the circuit is working. I don't have a schematic so I am guessing it is like the CATs I work on currently.

Power may go to the solenoid directly or it may go to the switch first. I just cannot say for certain how this circuit works.

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Customer reply replied 3 years ago
Just trying to clarify. Forgive me for my dum questions. Are you saying the worn synchronizers cause either the input shaft of the shuttle or output shaft of the rear axle to turn? What would cause the drag on the shuttle transmission?My parts manual shows the main harness going to neutral switch/clutch cutout solenoid/ shuttle oil temperature and to the switch on the bucket lever. Not clear if it goes to one prior to other.So your saying that if I have the above issues, having a working clutch cutout solenoid won’ help?
Mechanic: catmastertech, Technician replied 3 years ago

Sorry for not being more clear.

I mean if either side of the four-speed transmission is turning and you have worn synchronizers, you will likely hear it grind when shifting.

Even if it were new, you may hear some gear clash when shifting as these were never meant to be road vehicles.

You have not complained about it jumping out of gear so, I don't see this as a serious issue.

If the shuttle transmission has warped clutch disc (which can happen from slipping) they will cause some drag even without the clutch being engaged.

I do not understand your question about the harness.

Yes, even if the solenoid is working, it will not change the grinding problem. It is only there to act as a declutch to release the shuttle drive just as you would shifting the shuttle to neutral.

So, if shifting to neutral does not stop it from grinding, then neither will fixing the declutch solenoid.

Please feel free to ask as much as you need. I am here to help.

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