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newbie jumped in a 2012 bucket loader and within 10 minutes…

newbie jumped in a 2012...
newbie jumped in a 2012 420 bucket loader and within 10 minutes the bucket joystick is dead? rear outriggers didn't work either but now a few days later they work but the bucket is stuck extended up?
Any ideas? owner is about to sue me :( is there a safety switch that might have been tripped?
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Answered in 2 hours by:
4/2/2014
Mechanic: catmastertech, Technician replied 8 years ago
catmastertech
catmastertech, Technician
Category: Construction and Road Equipment
Satisfied Customers: 3,994
Experience: Field service technician for CAT 19 years.
Verified

Hello, I will try to help you with this.

-Could you explain your situation a little more?

 

Is this a CAT machine? If so, what is the full serial number?

 

Is the battery fully charged and the alternator working correctly? Full voltage must be available to operate the electronic functions on newer machines.

 

Is the Hydraulic lockout switch off? This is the red switch on the side console.

The icon looks like an oil tank with a dashed line and an oil drop inside the tank.

 

Are other machine controls work or not work?

 

 

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Customer reply replied 8 years ago

Sorry,I should have had more info before I started this.


It's a 2012 cat 420e.


I jumped in it to remove snow,temps were sub freezing and the cat had been sitting for weeks.


After I let it warm up for about 20min I started to move snow and after 10min the bucket stopped working.


Strange thing is the the outriggers originally worked and when the bucket stopped the outriggers also stopped,half hour later they(outriggers) started working again but the bucket was not responding to the joystick?


The owner has flipped out and there is no way I'm getting near it to test anything.


I guess I'm stressed because I will need to pay for anything that might be broken and I was trying to gain info on possible issues.


Would pulling the codes off the ECM shortcut the diagnosis?


 


After the hydraulics stopped I did check the switches on the dash with no luck.


The owner I would assume knows about the switch and he has spent days trying to figure out what the issue may be.


I never tried anything like the rear boom while I was in it,just drove it back to the shed and parked it.

Mechanic: catmastertech, Technician replied 8 years ago

Thanks for the information. I am not sure you can retrieve any codes unless this machine is equipped with the messenger screen. The serial number would help me know if it was factory installed. I don't think it was available until the new F model was released. You will most like need the dealer to connect to the machine to view the codes. No many will apply to the hydraulic system anyway. Only a few attachments are controlled by the ecm and a basic machine would not likely have any options.

The simple thing to check is the filter. Remove it and cut it open, if it does not have metal in it, then you won't have damage in the hydraulic system. If your steering is working normally, then the pump is likely ok. After the steering is the rest of the hydraulic system. The loader valve has an inlet section and this contains the priority valve. If this valve is sticking, you could loose power to the rest of the hydraulics.

This could effect the stabilizers too, the pump signal for flow is tied together and could make both weak and slow.

 

The only other item that would cause this is the pilot control pressure, IF the loader has this option. Some have pilot controls for all the loader and backhoe levers.

This is a lower oil pressure system that is in the handles and controls the higher pressures for the loader and backhoe for easier operation. This lower pressure must be checked separate from the main hydraulics. The lower pressure is from a reducing valve and could have debris in it or damage.

 

 

So, the main things to check first is the filter and underneath for damage to a valve or lines.

Then pressure testing is needed to locate a problem in either the pilot system or main hydraulics.

If this machine has multiple electronic attachments, then the dealer is needed to see the codes. NOTE, most of the other functions should work. The main electrical concern is power to the solenoid from the hydraulic lockout switch. If it has power and is working, metal will stick to it.

This solenoid is located on the backhoe valve inlet section on the right side.

 

I hope this helps. If you can get the owner to give you the serial number and more details on what he has checked so far, I will be glad to help all I can.

catmastertech
catmastertech, Technician
Category: Construction and Road Equipment
Satisfied Customers: 3,994
Experience: Field service technician for CAT 19 years.
Verified
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Customer reply replied 8 years ago

Thanks for all the info.


Unfortunately I'm not getting near the backhoe,the owner did say a dealer was going to look at it
.The steering,trans all seemed to work normal.


I don't have any experience with newer backhoes and maybe this means nothing but the joy stick seemed floppy?I thought it was normal since it's not connected to a valve but the owner seemed to think it was fu$ked?


I don't understand how driving 100yrds and three bucket scoops of snow could break a caterpillar?


Thanks for your help

Mechanic: catmastertech, Technician replied 8 years ago

Sorry to hear that. I don't think it is a serious problem.

If this machine has the mechanical linkage, it could just be a broken joint. Not hard to fix. If it is a pilot problem, let's hope it is easy to find. Sometimes a problem can be difficult to pin down but, a good technician will have a strong sense of the problem in about an hour. He can then perform some detailed testing and locate the issue. The cost will be higher if his travel if far and he has to make two or more trips. Truck cost are high but, worth it if it is a quick repair.

 

I wish you the best on this problem. If you need anything else, feel free to contact me back on this post. It should remain open for a few more days.

 

Thanks for using JustAnswer! Donnie

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Customer reply replied 8 years ago

Thanks for all your info:)

Mechanic: catmastertech, Technician replied 8 years ago
You're Welcome.
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