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we have a 2007 324dL excavator it will start after a long crank…

we have a 2007 324dL...
we have a 2007 324dL excavator it will start after a long crank and will misfire for a minute or two puffing black smoke then machine runs fine.
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Answered in 7 hours by:
3/28/2014
Mechanic: Gina-Moderator, Moderator replied 8 years ago
Gina-Moderator
Gina-Moderator, Moderator
Category: Construction and Road Equipment
Satisfied Customers: 16
Experience: Moderator at JustAnswer
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Hello,

I'm Gina and I'm a moderator for this topic.

We have been working with the Experts to try to help you with your question. Sometimes it may take a bit of time to find the right fit.

I was checking to see if you had already found your answer or if you still needing assistance from one of the Experts?

Please let me know if you wish to continue waiting or if you would like for us to close your question.

Also remember that JustAnswer has a multitude of categories to help you with all your needs from Pet to Legal.

Thank you,


Gina~Moderator
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Customer reply replied 8 years ago

Still looking to discuss this problem with an expert .

Mechanic: Gina-Moderator, Moderator replied 8 years ago
Hello Marc

Thank you we will continue to look for an Expert to assist you. Please let me know if I can be of any further assistance while you wait.

Best,
Gina~Moderator
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Mechanic: catmastertech, Technician replied 8 years ago
catmastertech
catmastertech, Technician
Category: Construction and Road Equipment
Satisfied Customers: 3,998
Experience: Field service technician for CAT 19 years.
Verified

Hello, I would like to help with this problem.

 

-Could you explain your situation a little more?

 

Have you check for fault codes for the engine? If so, what did you find?

 

Have you looked under the valve cover to see if oil is leaking from and injector more than the others?

 

Have you checked the HEUI pump pressure and fuel pressure?

 

Have you tried replacing the fuel pressure regulator?

 

Are you using Biofuel?

 

Have you had any recent problems repaired?

 

How many hours are on the HEUI pump and injectors? How many hours are on the engine/machine?

 

What is the full machine serial number?

 

Please provide as much detail as you can about this machine and how long you have had this problem.

 

I will be glad to help all I can.

 

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Customer reply replied 8 years ago

Oh, I will get all the info u ask on monday when Im nack to work

Mechanic: catmastertech, Technician replied 8 years ago

Thanks for the reply. I will be working Monday as well. I will not be able to reply until the evening but, will be glad to help you more then.

If this is not helpful for you, please let me know and I can OPT-OUT to allow others to help.

Thanks, Donnie

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Customer reply replied 8 years ago

I can wait till evening.

Mechanic: catmastertech, Technician replied 8 years ago
That is great. I look forward to helping you.
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Customer reply replied 8 years ago

On wednesday I will see machine again I will get you a.complete serial number and the supply fuel pressure spec . And if that is all good u suggest we remove valve cover and check for oil leaking from injectors while cranking. .. the fuel pressure regulator is for the low pressure supply fuel I assume ? .. I cannot ger troubled codes asni dont have a scanner that will do cats.

Mechanic: catmastertech, Technician replied 8 years ago

Thanks for the reply.

Yes, checking the injectors is a simple and easy test. It will not be easy to see a problem unless one is really different from the rest. If all are spraying oil and the engine is running, this is normal. If all are spray and the engine will not run, then you would understand why the oil pressure must be up to allow the injector to operate.

I am assuming the oil and filter is new and main engine oil pressure is fine.

When one injector begins to leak heavily, this would cause a starting issue. Usually this will progress into a no start problem quickly. So, I don't think you will actually see one injector worst than the others.

 

Yes this engine only has a low pressure system. HEUI and MUI build all high fuel pressure internally only. The regulator is on the return port of the head and maintains the pressure in the head. It is also the check valve to prevent fuel draining out of the return line.

 

You can see the codes using the monitor on D series machines. This is the best part for the new monitor. Some extra details are shown that were not available on older models.

 

Just scroll over to the service menu and select ok.

Then enter password XXXXX

NOTE: DO NOT make any changes to the machine settings. If you enter a screen you did not want to enter, just turn the key off and wait ten seconds. If you make changes to the wrong setting, the machine may not be usable and a service call to the dealer will be required to correct it.

Scroll down to diagnostics window and then you can read the codes.

NOTE: NEVER clear any codes until all the repairs are complete. You may need this information later to help reference other problems. You do not need to clear any codes. Most will delete themselves after 100 hours without a repeat of the same code.

 

Copy all the codes and all the info related to each code. Keep this in the same order they are viewed, this is important to help know which code is the most recent.

 

Once we have this information, much more details about the problem will be available to help us determine the real problem.

 

Thanks, Donnie

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Customer reply replied 8 years ago

Thank you .

Mechanic: catmastertech, Technician replied 8 years ago
You're Welcome.
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Customer reply replied 8 years ago

Again I have not had time to look at rhis machine looks like its comming to the yard friday now.

Mechanic: catmastertech, Technician replied 8 years ago

That is fine with me. I have no problem waiting. The site will send auto-generated emails out, you can ignore these. However, the question will go dead after a period of time.

I must reply last to every post or, I cannot work on other questions. Sorry, I know it can be annoying.

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Customer reply replied 8 years ago

hey sorry about the long wait i have the machine in the yard now the serial number is XXXXX . i did remove the remove the heck valve on the rr of the cylinder head i did find that i could blow through it in both directions i am assuming this part is faulty i have ordered one from cat. I am now going to attempt to pull codes using the data base in the operators station .


i will let u know what i find.


Thanks


Marc Toepp

Customer reply replied 8 years ago

codes are logged errors are 39:110-9 39:167-12 39:190-8 39:374-5 39:581-5 39:586-5 39:586-12 39:590-9


logged events are 36:E00198 39:E00015-02 39:E00017-02 39:E00043-02 39:E00600-02



i will go no further with this until i hear back thanks a lot for waiting.

Mechanic: catmastertech, Technician replied 8 years ago

Thanks for the information.

Wow, that is some strange set of codes you have on this machine. These are not normally from operation. Someone has been tampering with this unit or you may have some serious electric problems. I am hoping this is from a previous repair, that is why I was asking for the machine history of what has been done to this machine or problems that have been repaired.

Below is a list of the codes and what them mean. Since none were active, I am not sure which way to start. Please read through this list and let me know which are current issues or have already been repaired.

If your monitor indicated hours for each code, we can use that to narrow down this list. Sometimes extra information is seen by selecting each code. Once in this screen, the delete option may be present.

If no hours are shown for the codes, you may need to delete them and see what comes back.

NOTE: The event list at the bottom is a serious issue. If the engine and hydraulics are overheating, this will cut power to the engine. This should always cause a flashing light and sound the alarm, it is something that is hard to miss.

Did anyone report these warnings?

 

 

Code list;

 

39:110-9 This diagnostic code is associated with the "Engine Coolant Temperature" sensor.

This diagnostic code is recorded when the Machine ECM does not receive expected information through the Cat Data Link from the Engine ECM. The possible causes of this diagnostic code are listed below:


The wires for the Cat Data Link to the Engine ECM are open or the wires are shorted.

The wrong software is installed on an ECM.

39:167-12 This diagnostic code is associated with the "Alternator Charging Voltage" sensor. The FMI 12 diagnostic code means that the ECM has determined that the signal (frequency) of the sensor is below the normal range.

This diagnostic code is recorded when the Machine ECM does not receive expected information from the "Monitor Display". The possible causes of this diagnostic code are listed below:


Harness wires for the "CAN Data Link" to the Machine ECM are open or the wires are shorted.

The wrong software is installed on an ECM.

Note: Check the "R" term voltage at the alternator and all of the ECM contacts with the wire 403-GN. All "R" term voltage checks should match. If one voltage is missing check for an open harness to that ECM

39:190-8 This diagnostic code is for the Engine Speed sensor. This sensor is located near the top of the flywheel housing.

The Machine ECM monitors the input signals from the speed sensor in order to determine the rotation speed of the flywheel. The frequency of the sensor output signal varies as the teeth on the flywheel pass the sensor. The frequency of the sensor output signal is proportional to the speed of the flywheel.

An FMI 8 diagnostic code indicates the machine ECM has determined the sensor output signal has an abnormal frequency, pulse width, or period.

Possible causes of this diagnostic code are:


Speed sensor air gap is out of adjustment

Failed or damaged speed sensor

Open wire connections or intermittent open connections in the speed sensor circuit

Shorted wire connections or intermittent shorted connections in the speed sensor circuit

Failed machine ECM. ECM failure is most unlikely

Note: The following test procedure may create other diagnostic codes. Ignore these created diagnostic codes now, but clear those codes after the original diagnostic code has been corrected.

Note: Poor connections are often the cause of a problem in electrical circuits. Before performing this procedure, inspect all of the harness connectors involved in the circuit. Verify that all of the connections in the circuit are clean, secure, and in good condition. If a problem is found with any of the connections: correct the problem and verify that the 190-8 diagnostic code is still active, before performing the following procedures.

Note: The engine must be running in order for this diagnostic code to be active.


39:374-5 This diagnostic code is associated with the Swing Brake solenoid. An FMI 05 diagnostic code means the ECM has determined the current of the solenoid circuit is below normal.

Possible causes of this diagnostic code are:


The Swing Brake solenoid has failed.

An open wire in the Swing Brake solenoid circuits.

The Backup EPR Valve switch has failed, if applicable.

The Machine ECM may have failed, but this situation is unlikely.

Note: The following test procedure may create other diagnostic codes. Ignore these created diagnostic codes now, but clear those codes after the original diagnostic code has been corrected.

Note: Poor connections are often the cause of a problem in electrical circuits. Before performing this procedure, inspect all of the harness connectors involved in the circuit. Verify that all of the connections in the circuit are clean, secure, and in good condition. If a problem is found with any of the connections: correct the problem and verify that diagnostic code CID 0374 FMI 05 is still active

39:581-5 This diagnostic code is for the Power Shift Pressure solenoid. An FMI 05 diagnostic code indicates the machine ECM has determined the solenoid circuit current is below normal.

Possible causes for this diagnostic code are:


The Backup Switch has failed.

The solenoid has failed.

There is an open in the solenoid circuit.

The machine ECM has failed, but is most unlikely.

Note: Poor connections are often the cause of a problem in electrical circuits. Before performing this procedure, inspect all the machine harnesses and connectors involved in the circuit. Make sure to verify that all of the connections in the circuit are clean, secure, and in good condition. Correct any problems found with any of the connections. Verify the diagnostic code CID 0581 FMI 05 is still active

39:586-5 This diagnostic code is associated with the "engine speed dial" switch. The FMI 05 diagnostic code means that the ECM has determined that the current of the switch is below normal.

The possible causes of this diagnostic code are listed below:


The circuit of the switch is open.

The switch has failed.

The ECM has failed, but is unlikely.

39:586-12 This diagnostic code is recorded when the ECM cannot communicate with the Engine Speed Dial switch.

Possible causes of this diagnostic code are:


The switch has failed.

The machine harness has failed.

The Machine ECM may have failed, but this situation is unlikely.

39:590-9 This diagnostic code is recorded when the Machine ECM does not receive expected information from the Engine ECM. The possible causes of this diagnostic code are listed below:


The wires for the Cat Data Link to the Engine ECM are open or the wires are shorted.

The wrong software is installed on an ECM.



36:E00198 The Engine (ECM) detects a problem with the engine's fuel pressure.
39:E00015-02 High Coolant Temperature Derate
39:E00017-02 High Coolant Temperature Warning
39:E00043-02 Low system voltage
39:E00600-02 High Hydraulic oil temperature

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Customer reply replied 8 years ago

So I will clear all coded and let you know which ones come.back . Thebteason for many of these codes I assume is because the wire that powers yhe quick disconect melted the main conector between then cab and chassis I had some dificulties when I made repair.. so ill delete all codes for. Now.

And yes hudrailics did overheat last year it was easily corrected by cleaning out rads .

Mechanic: catmastertech, Technician replied 8 years ago

Ok, that may help.

Have you checked fuel pressure yet?

Did you get the regulator installed?

Is the fuel tank clean?

Do all the other functions work correctly?

Have you operated the machine in backup mode?

 

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Customer reply replied 8 years ago

I changed the regulator and deleted all of tge engine codes.n

Mechanic: catmastertech, Technician replied 8 years ago
Thanks for the reply. How is the machine doing now?
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Customer reply replied 8 years ago

Im going to.try it in the morning see.how it starts.

Mechanic: catmastertech, Technician replied 8 years ago
Ok, let me know what happens. I will be glad to help more if needed.
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Customer reply replied 8 years ago

The machine runs at about 85 psi at idle and slightly higher at wide open throttle. It does still missfires a little when first starting you can hear the sharp cracking noise that an injector makes when the.nozzle is syuck open. . I removed fuel suction line beyween water separator on lift pump it was wet with fuel and cracked. Ill replace them friday.

Mechanic: catmastertech, Technician replied 8 years ago

Thanks for the update. Let me know how it goes and if you need more help.

Thanks, Donnie

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Customer reply replied 8 years ago

I replaced the two lines im going to get back to you on how it goes .I better pay you now or can u wait another week.

Mechanic: catmastertech, Technician replied 8 years ago

I will wait but, please include details of what has been done and how the machine is operating. Please include fault codes and pressures from all testing.

If you do not reply in a certain time frame, the site will automatically send emails. After awhile, the question is going dead.

catmastertech
catmastertech, Technician
Category: Construction and Road Equipment
Satisfied Customers: 3,998
Experience: Field service technician for CAT 19 years.
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