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Our cat th220b telehandler wont shift into its foward gears.

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Our cat th220b telehandler won't...
Our cat th220b telehandler won't shift into its foward gears. All other hydraulics are fine, reverse gears, boom, tilt, etc. I suspect electrical problem since machine only has 300 hrs on it and transmission was working perfectly. Isn't the forward/reverse selector simply an electrical switch that actuates solenoids in the transmission?? Anybody???
Submitted: 8 years ago.Category: Construction and Road Equipment
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Answered in 1 minute by:
3/20/2014
Mechanic: catmastertech, Technician replied 8 years ago
catmastertech
catmastertech, Technician
Category: Construction and Road Equipment
Satisfied Customers: 3,997
Experience: Field service technician for CAT 19 years.
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catmastertech :

Hello,

catmastertech :

No the selector is only a part of the controller.

catmastertech :

It sends the command to the ecm for the desired gear.

catmastertech :

Do you have the serial number for this machine?

catmastertech :

Transmission Control

Transmission Direction Control Lever

The transmission direction control lever contains two switch inputs that are connected to the battery and two switch inputs that are connected to ground. When the transmission direction control lever is in the forward position, the output for the forward direction is closed to ground and the output for the forward direction is closed to the battery. When the transmission direction control lever is not in the forward position both of the outputs are open. When the transmission direction control lever is in the reverse position, the output for the reverse direction is closed to ground and the output for the reverse direction is closed to the battery. When the transmission direction control lever is not in the reverse position both of the outputs are open. When the transmission direction control lever is in the neutral position, all four of the inputs should be open. The transmission direction control lever connects to the ECM through contacts J2-59, J2-60, J1-24, and J1-25.

Transmission Speed Selector

The speed and the direction of the machine are determined by the position of the transmission speed selector and the position of the speed selector. The transmission speed selector sends information about the requested speed to the machine ECM over the CAT data link.

catmastertech :

To find the problem with this system you will need to view the codes.

catmastertech :

You can view them through the dash.

catmastertech :

Diagnostic codes can be displayed on the instrument panel. The codes can be viewed when the panel is in the service mode. To enter the service mode, begin with the key switch in the OFF position. Cycle the key switch three times within ten seconds. Then, leave the key in the ON position. The displays are used to show active diagnostic codes and logged diagnostic codes. The MID is shown on the left display. The CID and the FMI are shown on the right display. When a diagnostic code is active, the letter "A" is shown in the left display. When a diagnostic code is inactive, only the code is shown. Each code is shown for several seconds. Then, the display will show the next code. After all the codes are shown, "---" will appear. The display will then cycle through all the codes again. To exit the service mode, turn the key to the OFF position for five seconds.

catmastertech :

Please try to retrieve the codes and let me know what you find. Once you have the codes we can better pinpoint the problem.

JACUSTOMER-cg8b7is8- :

Isn't an enclosed cab so no serial number there but the serial number on the engine is C06-02285. I think it's a 05 or 06 model. We bought it several years ago with only 120 hrs and very rarely use the machine.

catmastertech :

A common issues is damage to the wires on the transmission.

catmastertech :

Look under the machine for damage on under the boom .

JACUSTOMER-cg8b7is8- :

I will look for damage but doubt that being problem. I'm only one that uses the machine and I really baby it

catmastertech :

Look beside the left front tire on the frame, plate is positioned on the left side of the main frame.

catmastertech :

The other issue is low voltage.

catmastertech :

A weak battery will prevent this system working.

catmastertech :

You must have a good battery and charging system.

catmastertech :

Some other problems have been from corroded connections.

catmastertech :

This could be anywhere on the machine from the shifter to the transmission and the ecm.

catmastertech :

If you can retrieve the codes , that will be the best help you can get.

catmastertech :

That or have the dealer connect to the machine to read them for you.

JACUSTOMER-cg8b7is8- :

Serial number is CATTH220PSLA01022

catmastertech :

Thanks for the serial number.

catmastertech :

I just looked for any service issues for your machine.

catmastertech :

I did not find anything related to your problem.

catmastertech :

The codes will be needed to troubleshoot this problem. This transmission only has two clutches.

catmastertech :

Forward and reverse. The speeds are a synchromesh transmission that is shifted hydraulically. If all the reverse paeeds are working, I would focus on the forward solenoid.

catmastertech :

Full Size Image

catmastertech :

Sorry, I cannot get an image to upload.

catmastertech :

(18) First gear (solenoid valve)

(19) Second gear (solenoid valve)

(20) Third gear (solenoid valve)

(21) Fourth gear (solenoid valve)

(23) Forward clutch (solenoid valve)

(24) Reverse clutch (solenoid valve)

(25) Differential lock (solenoid valve)

catmastertech :

Full Size Image

catmastertech :

Try this link, maybe you will see the picture here.

catmastertech :

The forward solenoid will have a green wire and an orange wire connected to it.

catmastertech :

A good solenoid will have 2.2 ohms resistance.

catmastertech :

This is low valve coil, do not apply battery voltage or it will fail.

catmastertech :

The ecm may show 7 to 10 volts to the solenoid when operating.

catmastertech :

If you have power, the clutch should lock.

catmastertech :

Beyond these basic checks, we will need to see the codes to continue.

JACUSTOMER-cg8b7is8- :

The codes are 039

JACUSTOMER-cg8b7is8- :

039 0590 02, 039 0668 02, 039 1251 08, 039 0811 09, 039 0271 04, 039 0271 05, 039 1834 03, 039 1658 02, 039 1482 04, 117 0668 02, and 036 1684 07

catmastertech :

Which codes had the letter A at the beginning?

catmastertech :
0590 Engine ECM
catmastertech :
0668 Transmission control (shift lever)
catmastertech :
1251 Alternator R terminal
catmastertech :
0811 Display module (instrument cluster)
catmastertech :
0271 Action alarm
catmastertech :
1834 Key start switch
catmastertech :
1658 Position sensor (left thumb lever) of the joystick control
catmastertech :
1482 10 volt PHS power supply
catmastertech :

The first codes that begin with 039 are from the machine ecm.

catmastertech :

The last code the begins with 036 is from the engine ecm.

catmastertech :
1684-07 Fuel Injection Pump not responding properly
catmastertech :

You have several that relate to low power. Is you battery and charging system working at full voltage? 14 volts running.

catmastertech :

The 0688 02 code means you have an intermittent problem with the shifter, not a failure.

catmastertech :

If no codes are showing the letter A, then no code is currently active. You may have a mechanical problem, not electrical.

catmastertech :

If this is the order in which they scrolled by, the first code on the list is the last code seen by the ecm.

JACUSTOMER-cg8b7is8- :

There was an A on the left side when it ran through the numbers the first time.. When I came back later and took pics I didn't see an A.. Should I try and cycle through them again or do you have any idea from what numbers I sent?

catmastertech :

Is you battery and charging system working at full voltage? 14 volts running.

catmastertech :

You may need to run the machine to see the fault code again or to force it to become active again. Some codes will show with the action light when it flashes.

catmastertech :

You have a code for the action alarm, has someone disconnected the alarm horn (beeper)?

JACUSTOMER-cg8b7is8- :

Horn is disconnected because I thought I might need to pull steering wheel to access under the control panel. I"ll check battery but right now it is cranking great..we let the machine sit for days and days sometimes and the battery gets a little low but everything works/starts great when using regularly. I'll run it a few minutes and see if it shows an A with any other code.

catmastertech :

Not the machine horn, the alarm horn (beeper).

catmastertech :

Did you get the picture link and view it?

catmastertech :

Did you check the wires to the forward solenoid?

catmastertech :

You could try swapping the forward and reverse connections to see if the problem is with the wiring or the transmission.

JACUSTOMER-cg8b7is8- :

I ran it for a minute or two but no A came up. This time I only got 9 sets of numbers instead of 11. The 039 0590 02 and 117 0668 02 didn't show up this go around. Any ideas??

JACUSTOMER-cg8b7is8- :

My son and I were just talking about switching the forward/reverse connections to narrow down the problem. I'll wait until I hear from you about whether there is anything significant about it showing fewer numbers this last time I checked it and I'll switch the connections tomorrow to see what that tells us.

catmastertech :

It is an intermittent problem. Not sure why you don't get an active code.

catmastertech :

It may be connection problem at the solenoid.

catmastertech :

Test the ohm reading for both the forward and reverse coils to see how they compare.

catmastertech :

Compare voltages too. Note, this may create new code.

catmastertech :

Old code will drop off after a certain time.

JACUSTOMER-cg8b7is8- :

The transmission selector has 4 wires coming out of it: a white wire marked 1, black marked 2, brown marked 3, and green marked 4. Could you tell me which two are for the forward gears and which two are for the reverse?

catmastertech :

It is more complicated that that. This shifter is actually and ecm. It sends data signals to the machine/transmission ecm and then that ecm send the control voltage to the transmission solenoids.

catmastertech :

Since this is a transmission shift issue I will send you the guide to test the MID 039 - CID 0668 - FMI 02 fault code.

catmastertech :

Use this guide to test the machine harness. The transmission ecm is under a box on the right front side of the engine pod, next to the frame.

catmastertech :

Let me know what you find and maybe we can move forward from there.

catmastertech :

I should be nearby and reply earlier than today, I have been out in the field all day.

JACUSTOMER-cg8b7is8- :

I've been too busy last few days to look at my cat but plan to tomorrow or the next day. If I wanted to switch the forward/reverse wire leads from the shift lever where would I need to do this? Where they exit the shift lever or on the ECM? Also is there any type of electrical test (such as continuity test) that can be done on the shift lever between the 4 electrical pins on the shifter that would rule out the shifter being the problem??

catmastertech :

It is more complicated that that. This shifter is actually and ecm. It sends data signals to the machine/transmission ecm and then that ecm send the control voltage to the transmission solenoids.

catmastertech :

You have no way to switch any wires at the shift lever. None. If you reverse any wires, the shifter will not communicate with the ecm.

catmastertech :

The only thing you can try swapping is the connectors on the transmission we discussed earlier. The forward and reverse connectors at the forward and reverse solenoids.

catmastertech :

The file is sent you earlier also covers testing the wires to the ecm from the shifter.

catmastertech :

Click on the MID 039 - CID 0668 - FMI 02 blue line above to see the guide. This is the repair information I would use to troubleshoot the problem.

catmastertech :

Once you have tried these test, please let me know the results of each step.

catmastertech :

You will receive emails from the site about my reply. You can ignore them until you have a chance to do the testing. These are automatic and not from me. I am fine with waiting until you have time to work on this machine. I am only available at night anyway so, I do appreciate your patience.

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catmastertech
catmastertech, Technician
Category: Construction and Road Equipment
Satisfied Customers: 3,997
3,997 Satisfied Customers
Experience: Field service technician for CAT 19 years.

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