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I have a 1997 Plymouth Grand voyager which started acting

Customer Question
like the fuel pump was...
I have a 1997 Plymouth Grand voyager which started acting like the fuel pump was failing a couple weeks ago. The engine would stumble like it was losing fuel or power. I check for DTCs at the time, none. it ran fine for a week or so then started again. still no DTCs. Then it would not start and had to have it towed home so I could work on it where my tools are. Still no DTCs so i changed out the fuel pump. The problem started again, now however, the check engine came on and stayed on. Got the P1391 code so I checked the wiring for issue, finding no problems I replaced the cam and crack position sensors.
JA: Do you have a scan tool to read the codes?
Customer: The code is still the same. P1391
JA: Are you fixing your Grand Voyager yourself? What have you tried so far?
Customer: dOING THE WORK MY SELF
JA: Anything else you want the mechanic to know before I connect you?
Customer: I think I've put everything I've done above.
Submitted: 5 months ago.Category: Chrysler
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Answered in 16 minutes by:
7/14/2017
Chrysler Mechanic: Ricardo Hohl, Master Certified Tech replied 5 months ago
Ricardo Hohl
Ricardo Hohl, Master Certified Tech
Category: Chrysler
Satisfied Customers: 4,304
Experience: Automotive instructor at Porter and Chester institute
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Hi welcome to just answers my name is Ricardo. inspect the wiring harness to the Camshaft Angle (CMP) sensor and Crankshaft Angle (CKP) sensor for damage, especially under the battery tray. Check the voltages at both the CMP and CKP sensors. Orange wire at both sensors is the 8 volt power supply.
Black/Blue wire is the sensor ground circuit and should have less than 50 mV present with the key-on. CMP signal wire is Tan/Yellow and should have 5 volts present with the key-on and the sensor unplugged. CKP signal wire is Grey/Black and should have 5 volts present with the key-on and the sensor unplugged.

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Customer reply replied 5 months ago
I'll check the voltages tomorrow after work.
Chrysler Mechanic: Ricardo Hohl, Master Certified Tech replied 5 months ago

okey let me know what you find good night.

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Customer reply replied 5 months ago
I checked the voltages of the orange and tan/yellow wires. Orange 8.9 volts the tan/yellow 5.03 volts.
by the way I went the entire day today without stumbling of jerking. That's one of the things with this issue, it can go days without acting up. any other ideas?
Chrysler Mechanic: Ricardo Hohl, Master Certified Tech replied 5 months ago
How about the sensor signal wire what did you get that is the black and blue wire ?
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Chrysler Mechanic: Ricardo Hohl, Master Certified Tech replied 5 months ago
It should have half of one volt on both 50mv
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Customer reply replied 5 months ago
Black/blue CMP 16.9 CKP 16.8 - 17.1
Customer reply replied 5 months ago
correction those are millavolt readings
Chrysler Mechanic: Ricardo Hohl, Master Certified Tech replied 5 months ago
Ok it all looks good but so far lest continue this tomorrow I'll get back to you on this with more detail ok good night
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Customer reply replied 5 months ago
Ricardo, Do you have any more information as to what may be causing the stumbling?
Chrysler Mechanic: Ricardo Hohl, Master Certified Tech replied 5 months ago

yes but ill get back to you tonight at 7 pm sorry for the inconvenience

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Customer reply replied 5 months ago
I question that 16 or 17 mv is good on the grey/black wire that should be 50 mv. I would say that my PCM is failing to put out the correct voltage. Is this correct? Or I may not be understanding how the PCM and sensors work.
Chrysler Mechanic: Ricardo Hohl, Master Certified Tech replied 5 months ago

Hi, sorry for the long delay, will you like to continue?

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Customer reply replied 5 months ago
Please
Chrysler Mechanic: Ricardo Hohl, Master Certified Tech replied 5 months ago

reading should be less then 50mv with out the engine cranking that voltage will increase to over .5 when cranking

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Chrysler Mechanic: Ricardo Hohl, Master Certified Tech replied 5 months ago

lest check the sensor wire for continuity from the Crank Sensor to the PCM connector do you have a multi meter?

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Chrysler Mechanic: Ricardo Hohl, Master Certified Tech replied 5 months ago

http://library.alldatapro.com/alldata/LIB~C31035~R0~OB0~P4R0H~N/0/41746678/56419268/56419273/56419275/34853741/96340231/96340248/176614765/176832245/176835404/62584134

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Customer reply replied 5 months ago
I'll check this evening when I get home.
I have several multi meters.
Chrysler Mechanic: Ricardo Hohl, Master Certified Tech replied 5 months ago

ok will continue tonight

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Customer reply replied 5 months ago
Though I had checked continuity before i contacted you and it was all good I have just completed the check a second time and the wires are all still good.I did have a lot of stumbling today some were more severe than others. I did notice that some times the tachometer would jump up and more often down when the stumbling occurred. All of this has so far occurred while at speed. It has yet to occurs ideling.
Customer reply replied 5 months ago
I had the battery light come on my way home this evening. The battery is about 2 years old. The charging system has also been good.
Chrysler Mechanic: Ricardo Hohl, Master Certified Tech replied 5 months ago

let me opt out and see if another expert may chair any ideas as to whats going on here k. do not answer back to me doing so will lock the question back to me and prolong your waiting time. good luck.

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Customer reply replied 4 months ago
Your referral never came through. I had the altinantor tested and found it was being erratic so the company warrantied it but I'm watch voltages closely to be sure the PCM is working correctly. I may go ahead and replace it to get rid of the if factor.Thanks for your insights they were helpful when I found a local mechanic to talk to as I had all the answers he asked for. He also questions the PCM.Low voltages can create all kinds of false issues. but while testing voltages they appeared fine until we found the alternator was not always putting out.
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Don - Mo Lurch
Don - Mo Lurch
Don - Mo Lurch, Aftermarket & Factory Electronics
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