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Debra, Lawyer
Category: Canada Law
Satisfied Customers: 100456
Experience:  Lawyer
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Dealing with an illegal entry issue. daughter rented what

Customer Question

Dealing with an illegal entry issue. daughter rented what she was led to believe was a shared tenancy. Turns out one of the tenants manipulated circumstance and daughter is not on tenancy agreement. The tenant (M) has twice called the police demanding my removal after my daughter confronted her about her dishonesty. Daughter, realising that she has been duped, stated she would be leaving as she feels unsafe. With police present, we were instructed as follows:
That I am allowed to return with daughter to move her property out of the house. If M didn't want to be around me she could stay in room or leave while we proceeded.
That daughter has every right to be on property and can come or go as she pleases.
If M obstructed to call RCMP and they would attend.
We advised by text the time we'd be at residence to move daughters property.
M responded with obstructive intent.
RCMP contacted. Keep the Peace bond arranged. Officer, after speaking to M, not myself or daughter, wou
Submitted: 1 year ago.
Category: Canada Law
Customer: replied 1 year ago.
We're permitted entrance to the residence. In fact M used my daughters padlock to prevent entry. The officer that attended doesn't know his tenancy law where landlord cannot keep property, nor restrict or obstruct retrieval. M and other "boarder" told officer they were going to sell daughters property re "owed money". I know they can't. M entered daughters private paid for room, callously and negligently threw daughters possessions into garbage bags. We know one bag contains now broken items (3 witnesses), and shoved my daughters relative's ashes into a bag where the containers could break. That is trespassing is it not?
Customer: replied 1 year ago.
not permit us entrance. We had been advised by officers 21 Aug 2015 that yes we could enter and remove all property. First detachment said no record of officers visit, then suddenly record with completely opposite information. I have contacted NCO but front desk deliberately avoided having me talk to anyone by sending me to NCO's voicemail and despite assurances of immediate return call.... Nothing for over 15 hours. We are being re victimized and lied to by botM and now RCMP.
Expert:  Debra replied 1 year ago.

What is the current status now? Your daughter has moved out but wants her things and M either has the or has discarded them? How much would it cost for her to replace all the items that can be replaced?

Customer: replied 1 year ago.
My daughter is 24 years old. This was to be her first foray into independent renting. She makes minimum wage. No she cannot afford to replace what is being held illegally.
Customer: replied 1 year ago.
The RTB regs clearly state no landlord can keep ANY property nor prevent or obstruct removal.
Expert:  Debra replied 1 year ago.

That was not my question. I did not ask if she could afford to replace it I asked how much it would cost to replace so that I can tell you what the appropriate remedy is.

So please let me know.

Customer: replied 1 year ago.
Replacement costs of what we currently Know is in the house ( daughter hasn't been permitted her legal entry to assess all that has been left but $5000 would not be unreasonable . We know that we can take her to small claims. You haven't addressed the illegal entry into her room etc.
Customer: replied 1 year ago.
her. Tenant who is obstructing retrieval.
Expert:  Debra replied 1 year ago.

The RTB regs do not apply. As far as the Board or Court are concerned this is a shared accommodation. So there is no route for your daughter to take aside from Small Claims Court.

And she can sue for more than what the items are worth as she can also sue for damages for inconvenience, for breach of contract and for other out-of-pocket expenses such as moving expenses or even higher rent elsewhere if that is what she incurs as well.

But she cannot rely on the Act or Regs as they simply do not apply to her. Her damages are as a result of the breach of the tenancy agreement and are based on contract law.

Do you see what I mean?

Customer: replied 1 year ago.
No I do not see at all. What I do know is whether it's M or the real owner/landlord cannot for any reason stop her entering the residence or collecting her property.
Expert:  Debra replied 1 year ago.

That is correct. The M does not have the right to keep her property, but there is no legal means for your daughter to get the property back without suing, because she cannot go to the police who have already said they will not help without an order, and she cannot go to the landlord tenant board because they do not cover shared accommodation. So while you are entirely correct, the only way you can enforce your daughter's rights is through the courts. Now, it may be that a letter from a layer threatening to sue would be good enough in the sense that it may scare M into releasing the items.

The problem is that even though a law may be very clear usually the only way to enforce a law is by obtaining a court order. One cannot simply hope that the police will assist because usually they are afraid to step in once they see there is a controversy and require a court order before they will act.

Customer: replied 1 year ago.
On the 21st Aug, the police attended by means of false allegations from M. The officer saw the lay of the land. We were already in the process of physically leaving the property. The officer clearly stated to both myself & daughter, daughter had every right to enter and to remove all of her property. I was allowed to assist as I am one of 2 people with vehicle to facilitate move. M was told that she could remain in her room or leave until we had finished. We were instructed to call police should M obstruct, they would attend to keep the peace. We followed those instructions . The officer that attended yesterday did not help in fact he hindered the process by speaking to M only, not us ... He wouldn't listen to anything, he refused to allow daughter rightful entry, refused to allow her to take photographs as we were asked to do by owner so that he could return damage deposit, paid to him directly by each tenant. It is according to the RTB a landlord situation indeed and that due to the misrepresentation by both owner of house and M, rules apply and we were advised to call police back and set another time for police to attend. This has been arranged for tomorrow at 11am.
Customer: replied 1 year ago.
Further regardless of landlord .... M illegally entered another paid tenants private room, went through her private belongings, turns out was in fact in possession of the key to the lock used to lock the back gate to prevent daughter access. A key that she told daughter she didn't have and didn't know where it could be. She emptied trunks of personal family items and threw them into garbage bags. M had no right to enter that orivate room.
Expert:  Debra replied 1 year ago.

Ok. If the police are willing to help that is fantastic. But if you find out that the police have decided that they cannot interfere without a court order then your daughter's next step will have to be to obtain a court order.

As we have already discussed, M did not have a right to enter the room nor did she have a right to throw out any of your daughter's belongings. This all goes without saying. But rights on paper are of little value unless they can be enforced, and if the police will not help, or if your daughter has suffered further damages even though she has been able to obtain her items (perhaps some are broken) then she will have to sue. The police cannot get money from M, for example.

So, the bot***** *****ne is that if the police will help that is great, but if the police won't help or if your daughter finds that she is in a worst position then she would be in because of M's unlawful conduct then your daughter will have to sue in Small Claims Court.

Customer: replied 1 year ago.
In addition police stated that daughters property would likely be sold. Not legal police did not help in fact obstructed and re victimized the victims. The officer that attended 21 Aug did not record what he said to us. He is back tomorrow.I hear you loud and clear re police and unwillingness to help however in this circumstance where we were clearly told we had police support by 3 different depts of RCMP ... There has been no follow through.
Expert:  Debra replied 1 year ago.

Yes I am very sorry about that, and if tomorrow you find that the officer who comes tomorrow cannot help then you should call and speak to the officer's supervisor.

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