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TJ, Esq.
TJ, Esq., Attorney
Category: Bankruptcy Law
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Experience:  JD, MBA
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can the arreages of a claim be transferred without the mortgage

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can the arreages of a claim be transferred without the mortgage being trans ferred. when a claim is transferred should more than the amount of the claim be paid than what is on it. when a mortgage or arreages are transferred do the transferre have to file a form 210A before trustee makes payment to the transferee.
Hello and thank you for allowing me the opportunity to assist you.

Something doesn't add up. I've never heard of a assigning just the arrears. Are you sure that is what happened? What makes you think that is the case?

Generally speaking, what happens when you take out a mortgage is this: A bank (let's call it "Bank") gives you the loan, and then it sells the loan to another company (let's call it "Investor"). However, Bank continues to service the loan (i.e., collect payments on behalf of Investor). This means that you continue to pay Bank even though the loan itself is owned by Investor. Over the course of the loan, the servicer may change often, however, the Investor would likely stay the same. In your case, National City likely was just the servicer, and all it transferred was the servicing rights to Bank of America, and then from Bank of America to Ocwen. Ocwen specializes in servicing loans that are in default. During the transfer of the servicing rights, the investor probably remained the same.

As for Form 210A, if you are no longer in bankruptcy, then it's a moot point. The only purpose of that Form is to alert the Trustee that the assignee should be paid. If the assignee has no problem with the arrangement, then it's not an issue.

If you can shed any more light on your situation, such as why you believe that Ocwen was only assigned the arrearages, or why you believe that you've paid $125k on a $8k claim, then please let me know and I'll do my best to help.
TJ, Esq., Attorney
Category: Bankruptcy Law
Satisfied Customers: 12358
Experience: JD, MBA
TJ, Esq. and 3 other Bankruptcy Law Specialists are ready to help you
Customer: replied 4 years ago.

.when we filed our chapter 13 wage-earners bankruptcy, we had a list of 33 creditors. we actually ended up paying only thirteen. at the time of filing we owned two real-estate properties, one rental and one residential. on the list of creditors our properties listed as claims 1, the residential property, claim 2 as the arreages, claim 3 as the rental property and claim 4 as the arreages of rental property. there was on the list a claim 5, with the name of national city's attorneys, and there was no amount only a "notice only". no payments were ever made because no proof of claim was ever filed. at the time of confirmation we had paid 11,200. dollars into the plan, shortly after confirmation the deductions began from employment. thirteen months after filing and ten months after confirmation, national city went to court to lift the stay citing a default. they stated we had defaulted because we failed to pay June's payment. they filed this in July. we cured the arreages yet they still foreclosed on the property. we had not missed any payments, but we still cured the alledged default. in December of 2004, national city filed a paper in court and I quote" national city bank, does hereby assign and transfer to ocwen federal bank, fsb its claim #5, account #33756180 of $8,673.51. as filed on march 26, 2003 against the debtor in the above referenced case. national city bank, specifically waives further notice of any matters in connection with the above referenced claim including any notice pursuant to Bankruptcy Rule 3001(e) (2) of the Code." seventeen days later the trustees office begin making payments to ocwen. and continues throughout the bankruptcy. in November of 2005 national city once again petitions the court to lift the stay citing a material default. once again our attorney agreed with them, the same as in the first incidence stating we were behind and had to pay 6.000.00 to catch up. well at this point I filed an objection, then national city withdrew. A year later national city did the same thing, again I objected and again national city withdrew its motion. two years later national city went to court again for the same thing, but this time they withdrew their own motion. In august of 2012, I wrote to ocwen asking when and how they acquired our loan, they sent a paper saying they acquired it in November of 2004. I later asked for a payment history, which showed their purchase from them of 139.000 dollars in September of 2004, three months before the transfer of the claim. ocwen also sent us paper work stating we owed them thirteen thousand dollars in back pay on the foreclosed rental property. we told them we did not own that property that national city foreclosed on that property. I wrote national city for documentation of their transfer of our property and a payment-history, national city did not respond, bank of America responded and stated they transferred our loan to ocwen federal bank in may of 2004. they transferred both loans, our rental and our residential properties to ocwen in 2004, two months before national city filed their first motion to lift stay citing a default that did not exist. our loan was serviced by Altegra credit company, that is who our payments went to and that is the servicer the trustee's office continued to send our payments to. After writing ocwen and asking for copies of the documentation transferring our mortgage payment to them they begin to send us paperwork telling us we were $13,000 dollaars behind in escrow, and starting in January we would have to pay $2,659.00 per month, an increase of $1,400.00. we asked for proof of this increase and this debt,we have not received it. we expect a lawsuit for foreclosure any day. after looking through the bankruptcy files, the payments were not deducted for escrow, although according to the debtors financial report we filled out it was to be paid, because it was listed as included in the payments. I am not willing to pay for a modification of 2,659.00 amonth. we never missed any payments. I feel that for one reason or another national city and now ocwen has consistently tried to take our home. I believe that only a partial claim was transferred to ocwen. the amount of the transfer as stated by national city was only $8,673.51., the claim #5 had no amount, so the amount listed is the same amount as our arreages on our residence at the time of filing. there is nothing that in the courts dockets where our mortgage was ever transferred to ocwen federal bank. this was transferred to Ocwen Federal Bank, fsb, not to ocwen loan service, ng. Ocwen federalBank shut down in 2005 that's when the loan started being servicd by ocwen LLC in Florida. I hope I make sense. I am convinced that the problem started in bankruptcy. I do not believe this mortgage was transferred to ocwen and that is why national city continued to petition the court three times to lift stay and then witdrew when I objected. can a claim be partially transferred and not the full amount. thank-you

Hi again.

Thank you for the new details. Unfortunately, as it is late I am now going offline for the evening. I want you to receive a response as soon as possible, so I'm going to open this question to all attorneys for their review.

Thank you for using our service.
Customer: replied 4 years ago.

I can await an answer until later tomorrow. I am also retiring for the night.

I found your web site by accident. how do I log back on. I don't know that much about computers as yet.i will leave your page on. have a good-night. I certainly need whatever advice you give me. I am retired and I cannot afford an attorney.Thank-you and have a good night. check with you do I know that my credit card is secure with you. I don't give out such information on line I have had problems before.

Customer: replied 4 years ago.

I can await an answer until later tomorrow. I am also retiring for the night.

I found your web site by accident. how do I log back on. I don't know that much about computers as yet.i will leave your page on. have a good-night. I certainly need whatever advice you give me. I am retired and I cannot afford an attorney.Thank-you and have a good night. check with you do I know that my credit card is secure with you. I don't give out such information on line I have had problems before. also I never made payments to bank of America, I only made payments to Altegra Credit company, my loan was through national city. I don't know why bank of America would reply to me instead of national city. national city transferred a claim of 8,673. to ocwen federal bank, not ocwen LLc in December 2004, bank of America replied they sold both loans to ocwen in may 2004, ocwens says they received the transfer in November 2004 from national city. however; ocwens payment history shows receipt in September 2004 for payments due may 2004, which payment had already been made by trustees office to national city in may of 2004 because according to the trustees office disbursement to creditors Altegra credit company in Pennsylvania was the servicer of record and had been since we purchased the loan on both houses from national city in 1998. I hope i'm not confusing you too much. i'm just trying to make my issues clear. good night. thank-you again

I have never seen a claim be partially transferred. I agree with VAMD, Esq.'s initial assessment that something doesn't add up. I believe your situation is too convoluted and detail-specific for us to be able to help you on this website, which is probably why this question has sat unanswered for so long; I doubt if anyone knows how to tackle such a complicated matter through an online question-and-answer service. I suspect your situation is going to take someone a few hours to review documents, pull and review the bankruptcy docket, etc, something we can't do on here.

My guess is you will need to sit down with your lawyer and get all the documents together and go through them. You will probably need a record of all of the payments you have made.

You may have to file a Motion in the Bankruptcy Court to ask the court to order the various mortgage lenders to produce documents. If the court granted relief from the stay, you may have to ask the court to reinstate the stay if you can prove you have made the payments but that they were misapplied by the various banks involved. My experience in these types of matters is this: at the end of the day, if you made the payments, you can generally get the court to rule in your favor. But, if you have missed payments, the miscommunication between the lenders won't usually save you. That's why I suggest you get a record of all the payments you have made, NOT from the mortgage lenders, but by going back to your own bank and getting copies of all the checks you wrote and your bank statements showing the checks were cashed. If you can put together your own proof that every mortgage payment was made, then you can ask the mortgage lenders where the money was applied. But, waiting on the mortgage lenders to provide the information to you seldom ever works.

Good luck!

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