DR I'm sorry not to have replied. it's because things has just got worst in the house and I didn't want to upset the husband & wife in anyway. The couple in the other room are no longer in good terms with the husband & wife. A few days ago the husband & wife and the male staying the other room had a discussion. I was in my room and I was not present in the kitchen where they had their discussion. They discussed a few of the problems happening in the house. I don't believe the subject about over charge was not discussed. However, somewhere in the discussion the male asked the husband if he entering his room without permission. The husband said "no i didn't go in your room" but the male said "yes you did and I have proof." The male showed the husband a webcam video recording from inside the couples bedroom of the husband entering their room and looking in the around the room. The husband apparently didn't know the webcam was left on. The husband then admitted he did. There were other agruments about taking things or something like but I coould not hear the rest clearly. Then after all that discussion everything seemed fine as they walked back into their rooms even saying thanks and have a light sense of humour between them. That was 2 days ago. The problem is somethings has upset the couples again and they now decided they are leaving. They said they will move their belongings by the end of this week and also be out of the residences may be next week or sooner. The couples are paid for rent & estimated bills calculated by the wife until December 19 next month but they don't care and now decide to leave and they will hand their notice in tonight. The male room mate told me that these are the very same reason the tenants before left. I'm told it was to do with the rent, the bills, the husband and finally they were forced to move out somehow. I'm also told that in todays incident the husband and wife has just become British Citizen this year or last year used that privilege and authority to say something that upset the couple today. DR on my very first question I left this information out delibrately as I had focused only on the 5 total paying adults in the residence but the Husband & Wife also has a daughter about 5 years of age that lives in their room. Apologies for this. Therefore in this household the husband, wife & daughter lives in the large room, a brother & sister lives in the meduim size room and I alone live in the small room. There is one toilet/bathroom/laundry, a kitchen, a living room and one flight of stairs down to a door that exit our upper floor flat into a Dentist Practice then and another door to exit the building. When I arrived for my interview with the wife almost 4 years ago, she gave me the rules of the house and and also stated this rule "we have a daughter who is currently living with her grandmother but she will be living with us in a few months time. Anyway is just a kid... SO SHE DOES NOT PAY right? is that ok with you anyway if we are over on the bills the we will cover that extra" at the time I naively accpeted as it is true the child can obviously afford to pay as she earns no income. However, the wife did not state either that they will contribute a portion/a fraction/ a precentage towards the bills & expenses. She only stated that they will COVER THE COST IF THE BILLS EXCEEDS their estimated charge out rate from each of the tenants. But now it has jut been brought to my attention that they really have not paid for any excess in bills becuase the calcutations is made so that the collection of the charge out rates from me and the other tenants actually covers their bills too. It is why there is a refund this year but not of last year as the wife refuses to show the bills of 2007, 2008, 2009. Q1) DR lawyer, does the couple have the right to leave by the end of the week? Yes/No and why? Q2) how many days/weeks/months notice are they supposed to give before actually leaving? Q3) how does this now affect me? Q4) everyone signed the tenancy agreement and it is until Oct.2011 but do I know have to pay for the room even though it is not yet occupied. The rent in that room is paid for until Dec.20 next month? Q5) do I have to split the bills with the husband & wife too, and I still yet to speak to them about the bills. And as far as I know my flatemate told me the wife refuses to show the bills of the past years? Q6) am I introuble here? What should do? Which authority can I call? Q7) DR i hope you understood my explanation about the wife rules and her concept of calcuating the estimated budget. but is this illegal? Q8) Can they collect /retain / redirect/ over charge us so that we are paying for their bills? Is this an offence? What offence is this called? What is the penalty for this? Q9) even if I accepted naively that the child does not pay, is it my responsibility to share the bills with the parents? Q10) Do the parents have the right impose such a rule any tenants the lives here? i) Is this an offence?ii) What offence is this called? iii) What action can I take to protect my self from this and who can help me inthis situation?iv) If it is illegal can I report them to an authority? Q11) Also if only one of the parents are home, he/she will wait until someone or me arrives home and the husband will leave the child in their room, leaves the house and comes back a while later. He doesn't notify me or anyone the child is alone. He just waits for some to arrive home and without notice he will just leave without leaving her in someones care. I'm I liable if anything happens to the child? What am I liable for? DR I hope you can help me, it's become quite serious now. Can I call any specific organisation or authority for help or any assistance for my problems? Kind RegardsChristopher Villanueva
Province/Country relating to question : Central London/ UK
I have not attempted to confront the Husband or Wife. I have remained silent and neglected knowing of anything that the couples in the other room are doing. I do not want to be involved in any of their arguements. So far I have been fed information from various ex-tenants or friends or the husband & wife and past experience & information from the my room mates deciding on leaving. I am currently gathering these information so that I am able a wise, legal, safe & strategic decision.
Hello, Many thanks for your question. I shall endeavour to assist. If there is anything in my answer that you require me to clarify please ask.
1. It depends on the tenancy - are the husband and wife the main tenants and do they then sublet to you?
2. Normally a month if it is a tenancy but it depends on what the tenancy says. If there is no written tenancy then it will depend how often they pay their rent in terms of how much notice they will have to give.
3. Depends on your answer to one above.
4. I see in your question 4 you say that you are all on the tenancy agreement. If that is the case and it is joint and several liability then the couple cannot leave and if they do they will remain liable for the rent. If they don't pay it then you will be liable with the other tenants for their share subject to your right to claim it back from them.
5. If they don't show the bills you are within your rights to refuse to pay yours share.
6. There is not an anthority that can help. All I would suggest is that you liaise with the landlord about advertising for a new housemate.
7. sorry yes I understand and no it is not illegal.
8. If they are knowingly overcharging you then this is Fraud.
10. No they have no right if they are tenants just like you but it is not an offence.
11. You could be in difficulty if something happened to the child as you are left in charge.
BA (Hons) Pgdl Pgdlp (LPC)
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Thank you DR. I will try to understand your answers as I still require more calrification. Pls give me sometime to reply.
The current update of my situation is I have spoken to the couple & they have calmed down and will not leave this week and they have not handded in their notice. However, they still want to leave as soon as they find another accommodation and they seem to on communication terms only.
On an even worst note I believe the husband & wife suspect that the couple are leaving. So in 2 days the a kettle broke & the microwave oven broke. I believe that the husband & wife are trying to replace these appliances with new ones so that they have a completely new set of appliances and us to share the cost of the applainces before the couples leave. It is their own property but we now have no choice but to pay for these items as we all use it?
DR Thank you for your answers.
Please don't take any offence DR, I appreciate the answers but I was hoping the answers would actually sway more towards my direction. I'm just disappointed that at first they seemed like genuine house mates, welcoming, trusting but I really just got conned in so to speak and with not so very clear & strong rights fully solve thing clear & simple without such a lenghty process. I would like to say "please show me the bills, ok... you owe us this much, please refund it ASPA. What you're doing is illegal, it's illegal to impose tenants to pay for your child" but knowing them it's that quick or simple.
I'm also surprised that even though I have no legal or personal relation to the child that I been expected to pay for her expenses. I understand it is not illegal but I don't believe a single person in the world would agree to paying for a strangers child's expenses. This is where the wife if is failed to described the actual truth. If she would have said "you are sharing the childs expenses with us" I would definetly not agree. but it was not worded that way. All she said was "the child does not pay" but they did not say they are the only one that will. But knowing they have no right I will have to search through other legal categories where by I can legally prove that I have no right/obligation to pay for their childs expenses and that the house rules he has impose is breaching my rights.
I have been browing the web for information and have stumbled onto these websites:
- definition of sublet (yes, they are not sub-letting)
- the types of fraud (yes)
- reciepts and it's purpose (proof of purchase)
- Small Claims Court (Citizens Advice Bureau)
- The Property Landlord (website, I'm researching through this)
Through my research I have found the definition of Fraud "Fraud is when trickery is used to gain a dishonest advantage, which is often financial, over another person."
And by them not showing the official bills it is because they are not able to proove that the estimated bills & expenses can ALL be accounted for or the bills for the items described during our verbal agreement is less than the actual Bills. So if they continue collecting money after all the bills are paid and without notifying me & my other room mates that the bills are less, this is then an act of Fraud. The next information I have to be clear on the type of Fraud: these are the closest I can to my situation:
- Abuse of position of trust
- Advance fee fraud
- False accounting fraud
- Rental fraud
I'm will have to research more on the above.
Yes, I intend to notify the Landlord, but I require legal proof they are breach my rights & they are commiting a criminal act even though it is minor.
I have further questions that is a follow up from earliers questions.
Q.1 if I approach them and ask them for the receipts & they still refuse, am I commiting and illegal act by refusing to pay anymore money just so I can claim what is owed to me? I mean, why is it my right or why do I have the right do so? pls provide a brief explanation.
Q.2 if they still refuse to show the bills and refuse to give a refund do they have the legal authority to throw me out overnight/ the next day/ next week even if they are paying tenants like me but they have been here longer? Yes/No?
Q.3 must they give me notice first for the reason they are kicking me out? Is it also a months notice?
Q.4 who has the authority to give out termination of tenancy letters?
the husband & wife (they tenants just like me) or the landlord or the estate agent?
Q.5 can I be kicked out without first agreeing to some form of resolution? (ie. dispute & resolution?
Q.6 if the husband & wife kicks me out for asking for the bills or asking for a refund of what is owed what is my legal rights in this situation?
Q.7 they are just tenants like me who signs a tenancy agreement, do they special privileges becuase they have been here for years paying bills to the landlord? Is there such a Law or outlined in a Contract somewhere?
Q.8 The gas & electricity is under the landlords name and the remaining bills is under the husband & wife's name? Does the wife & husband have the legal right to collecting the payments for the landlords bills or should we be paying directly to the landlord?
DR also please inform me when the transfer fee for your the new question should take place.
DR Lawyer, thank you very much for your legal advice. unfortunately, I situation is a bit calmer but as per my initial problem is still exist. I have not yet seen the bills, except for one (this years council tax only). The wife has started to give refunds but has not shown the bills and said "you can see the bills if you want" but i am still given an A4 paper calculation of my bills for the month.
DR Lawyer thank you so much for your help. I read the terms and condition and I understand the additional payment for your services as requested.
Thank you and I hope to contact you again for further help with my condition.
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