Hi. Thank you for your inputs. I have a few more queries to clarify with regards XXXXX XXXXX above question, please:1) Do you mean that the applicant must provide evidence of bank statements etc even if there's no or very little funds in their account?2)How can an applicant prove that their mother, relatives etc are residing in their home country and hence has ties leading to their home country? I.e. what documentation is needed to prove that? Thanks3) Will switching into a different immigration category make a difference to a refusal made under paragraph 320 (7B)?4) Why is the duration 12 months during which any application could face automatic refusal? Finally,
5) Is an EEA family permit independent of a refused Visit clearance (one which has been refused under paragraph 320 (7B) ) I.e. can someone who's been refused under paragraph 320 (7B) be allowed to apply for an EEA permit, given that they're eligible to do so? Thanks.Thanks for your response in advance.Kind regards.
Hi there. Thank you for your last responses. I would like to ask a further follow up question, please.If an applicant has been refused a UK visit visa under Paragraph 320 (7B), can he or she then apply for a Fiance visa before the expiry of the 12 month ban period?And if so, what documents are required for a Fiance visa? Thanks
Can you please clarify why switching into a Fiance visa category would eliminate/lift the 12 month ban, whilst switching into a student visa Tier 4 category wouldn't have the same effect?The sponsor is an EU national from Portugal, who has resided in the UK for a substantial period of time. What documents would he need to provide on his behalf for the marriage to take place? Would he need a birth certificate? And is the18,600 per annum? Which authority needs to obtain the marriage certificate, after it has taken place? (e.g. Home Office?)But in order to book the wedding at the registry office, both parties need to attend an appointment with the registrar, so how could that be possible, whilst the applicant is facing a 12 month ban to the UK? (now 8 and a half months left)What documents does the non EU (Middle East) applicant need? Could you kindly list them? Thanks.Finally, how long is the processing time for the UK Fiance visa?Thanks
Thank you for your detailed reply.1)Can you please explain the paragraphs you outline in Point 3 in Layman's terms? Thanks.2)Also, could you kindly confirm whether or not there is a fee, as when I click the link, it mentions that there is a fee on the site and states that the EEA family permit is free of charge, whilst you mention that you have to pay, so could you please clarify what you mean? Thanks3)How long is the EEA family permit valid for, please? And would it be a Visa in the non EU applicant's passport (just like a normal visa stamp?) Plus, would that change after the non EU applicant decides to apply for an EEA residence card? In addition, does the application for the EEA residence card have to be submitted well in advance, before the expiry of the current EEA family permit (once the EEA family permit has been issued, of course)4)Moreover, the non EU applicant is applying from Kuwait, would she have to apply in person via a UK visa application center, after completing the application online and printing it off?5)Finally, if the non EU applicant is currently not employed (taking a gap year) would she still have to provide bank statements, even if she's not earning a fixed rate salary? Would a bank statement produced 28 days after the funds have been in the account, prior to applying, be sufficient? And she will be relying on a family member as a sponsor (financial, maintenance costs etc), thus would she need to provide a sponsor letter and bank statements for the sponsor? ThanksHowever, since the non EU applicant is getting married to the EEA national, would the EEA national be the sole sponsor for then entire application? Thank you.Kind regards.
Dear UK Lawyer,I would like to ask you with regards XXXXX XXXXX UK fiance visa. If my sponsor's last wage slip is dated on the 15th of June 2013 and is issued once every month, hence is valid till the end of June 2013, when the UKBA mentions that the wage slips/bank statements have to be dated no more than 28 days prior to submission, what do they mean by this? I.e. what's the latest I can apply if the last wage slip was dated on 15th June 2013, please?And does the UKBA count the day when an applicant applies and pays the application fees at the visa application centre as DAY 1, or when the application reaches them as DAY 1, if that makes sense please?Furthermore, the working days in the country in which I'm applying are Sun-Thurs, so if I apply on 11th July 2013, which is a Thurs and pay the fees, do the biometrics etc, will it be considered late by the UKBA, if say for e.g. the application reaches them on 14th July 2013, as I'm not sure how these things work i.e. whether or not my application is forwarded the same day, if I was to apply first thing in the morning. Could you kindly explain this? Thank you.
Dear UK lawyer, Thank you for your reply.But can the latest wage slip issued on 15th June 2013, be relied upon until 28th July 2013, as I presume the wage slip covers the period up to 30th June 2013? So do you count the 28 calendar days from the date on which the wage slip was last issued, i.e. 15th June 2013, or do you count 28 calendar days from 30th June 2013, please?n.b. working days here are from Sun-Thurs, so the 12th of July wouldn't be possible, since that is a Friday.Thank you.Kind regards.
Dear UK Lawyer,Thank you for clarifying the matter.So as long as I apply before 13th July 2013, is it ok to rely on the latest bank statement dated up today's date; 24th June 2013 and the last wage slip dated on 15th June 2013? Thanks.Otherwise I'd have to wait till my sponsor's next pay date, 15th July 2013 and order subsequent bank statements to show the salary being paid in?Bank statements usually take up to 7-10 working days.Why is it that the UKBA can only accept bank statements sent via post, as opposed to printing them and getting them stamped and signed by the manager at the branch etc? It is so frustrating waiting on bank statements...Next, I've noticed that there will be some new immigration law changes scheduled for July 2013, will this affect the UK fiancee visa in any way? ThanksFinally, do you have an office based in London, if so do you specialise in immigration law? Thanks.Kind regards.
Thank you for your inputs.In case that I cannot submit my application before 12th July 2013, do I have wait until my sponsor received the next wage slip (15th July) and then wait on bank statements to arrive, which show the salary being paid in?How long do UK fiance visas take to process, please? I've been told that they can take up to 12 weeks? Is that the minimum time? Or can it be processed in a much shorter period than this? Thanks.What happens after I get married in the UK on a UK fiance visa? Can I remain in the UK or do I have to go home. I am planning on marrying an EU national. Can I be eligible for an EEA residence card, which entitles me to travel without restrictions within Europe? Could you kindly clarify this? Thanks.Kind regards.
Thank you for your reply.I would like to ask, is a digital signature by a barrister (legal submissions) on PDF acceptable by the UKBA, please?ThanksKind regards.
Dear UK lawyer,I would like to ask you, that if an applican,t previously refused under paragraph 320 (7B) and was subsequently issued a 12 month period ban, then applies for a UK fiance visa, before the expiry of the 12 month period, will the ban still be intact or will it be eliminated, please? Please give reasons for why that is the case (if the ban is either applicable or eliminated) Thanks.Kind regards.
Dear UK lawyer, I would like to ask what the various UK VAC online status mean, with re to tracking an application.The status was initially, 'application has been dispatched to the British Embassy', then 'application is under process at British High Commission', then 'application is under assessment at visa section' and only a few days ago, the status was reverted back to 'application is under process at the British High Commission'.Can you kindly explain what each status means and why a possible reason for the revert in status?Thanks for your time and inputs in advance.
Thank you for your inputs.Do you know what the next status updates are, after 'application is under process at BHC', please?Thanks
Thank you for your quick response.From my experience, the UKBA does not disclose decisions on the online tracking system, the final status update would be documents/passport are ready for collection from the visa application centre'. Thank you for your positive outlook.My question is, since the status has been reverted, shouldn't the next step be, the previous one, which was, 'application under assessment at visa section'? Also, should I be worried, the fact that the status has been reverted (from 'application under assessment at visa section' to 'application is under process at British High Commission'?Thanks.Kind regards.
Thank you for your advice. Much appreciated.You are absolutely correct.Is the British Embassy likely to return all my documents, once a decision has been made, if I have requested for them back and my legal advisor has written a cover letter asking for them back?Thanks.
Dear UK lawyer,Hope this finds you well.I attended an interview at the British Embassy yesterday and I was made uncomfortable by one of the questions the interviewer asked.I expected to be quizzed about the contents of my witness statement and to confirm that our relationship is genuine etc but none of the questions I expected came up, instead emphasis was placed on a previous arrest. Result: NFA.Me and my sponsor meet all the criteria for a fiance visa in terms of eligibility, supporting docs etc, but we didn't declare this crucial info about an altercation which occurred between us, last Autumn, which led to an arrest, but my sponsor dropped the charges later, early this year. Neither of us informed our lawyer about this, as we were saving face, also we did not think it would hold any merit to this application, as the case never even reached the CPS nor the courts.So the interviewer prompted the following question to me:'have you ever been arrested', I was almost speechless as I never expected the UKBA to have news of my arrest, if I never got charged etc, so I denied it twice, then at third instance, the interviewer stated that the UKBA have information to prove otherwise, that I was arrested, then I said, if you were referring to the incident in which I didn't get charged, then yes, I handed myself over to the authorities last October and was released on bail the next day, then the case and charges were dropped and the result was: NFA. I also said, that I didn't think the UKBA would take account of arrests which didn't result in charges, his reply was, I should have stated 'yes' at the first instance. I was truly gutted. I didn't use deception, it was an innocent mistake. I should have informed my lawyer, but was too embarrassed. The interviewer also asked me for the nature of the suspected offence, I said domestic violence. Does GBH fall under the same category? (Domestic Violence) The incident did take place on the premises of my flat, at the time.
The other questions which the interviewer asked me was to confirm my name, date of birth and whether I have been married before, which are all straight forward. I regret not asking him to clarify that question relating to the arrest. I was confused and it was an naive response on my behalf.I mean given the fact that I meet all the other criteria for a UK fiance entry clearance, would not declaring this fact re my arrest likely to outweigh everything else? I am really frightened.Why does this matter so much when my sponsor forgave me and is now sponsoring my application for entry clearance as a fiance and wants to get married to me? I admit that I should have declared this info in my witness statement.My sponsor told me that when he spoke to the DC who dealt with the matter that if he chooses to drop charges, then I could be allowed in to the UK, yet this matter is still pending 6 months later?!So could you advise me on the likely outcome please? The interviewer mentioned that they will investigate further on the info I've given him and that my visa application is still in process. Would I have a strong case if the my application was to be refused and I would then appeal? If my application was refused on the basis of not providing this information relating to a previous, would I have been informed of it at the Embassy, there and then? Or they would have to investigate the matter further? I mean, they wouldn't hesitate to inform me that my case was unsuccessful at the Embassy, am I correct in saying that? But what normally happens after a decision has been made is that I will be prompted to collect my documents from the visa application centre rather from the Embassy itself, so perhaps they wouldn't tell me the outcome at the Embassy after all.Thanks for your inputs in advance.Kind regards.
Dear UK Lawyer,Thank you for your response. I wasn't aware that the UKBA would know of previous arrests, even though no charges or convictions were made with re to that previous arrest. Now I am aware of that.I did not mention to the interviewer that the incident involved me and my sponsor, but I'm sure that they can investigate that and find out the full story? Am i correct?Everything else is in the supporting documents is truthful and consistent.The interviewer also asked me regarding the date that we intend to get married, I said that we were unable to get a povisional booking for the wedding, as the registrar would need to see both me and my sponsor in person, so we only have a provisional booking for the venue, so I provided him with an e-mail of the provisional booking for the wedding, set to 29th November 2013.Was I right in stating that the arrest involved a domestic violence charge? Even though it was a GBH within a domestic violence charge? ThanksWhat I meant about the refusal, is that in my opinion they wouldn't hesitate to tell me that my application was refused at the interview? For not telling them the truth at the 1st instance? So hopefully, since the visa application is under process may be a positive indication that they are weighing up everything else against this previous arrest?Thank you for your inputs in advance.
Dear UK lawyer,Thank you for your last comprehensive reply.I would like to ask you a question with regards XXXXX XXXXX Human Rights Act under Article 8 of the European Laws.Can the UKBA and do the UKBA have the authority to refuse an applicant, entry clearance if the sponsor is an EU national residing in the UK and having exercised treaty rights for more than 5 years? I.e. can they deny my sponsor from marrying me? Based on not disclosing the previous arrest immediately in the interview, plus we didn't disclose it in the paperwork, but was eventually disclosed to the interviewer, after the interviewer mentioned that there is information to suggest otherwise re a previous arrest and I have explained why I didn't disclose it immediately? Although I didn't notice the interviewer jotting down my explanation, so I'm not sure whether he would have communicated that over to his colleagues?Is the fact that I denied it twice and confessed it the third time and not having disclosed that enough grounds for refusal, bearing in mind that a UK fiance visa carries a Human Rights criteria, unlike a visitor or a student visa etc Also, everything provided within the supporting documents checks out and there is no doubt about that (we are definitely in a genuine and subsisting relationship and we definitely intend to get married within 6 months etc)Or can they issue a visa with restrictions? And what would the restrictions normally be, from your experience? Thank you.Kind regards.
Dear UK Lawyer,Does Paragraph 320 (7A) apply to a UK fiance visa application? Or is it exempt from that based on the Human Rights Article 8? I mean, is it enough grounds for refusal if the interviewer believes that the applicant is not telling the truth, despite confessing the truth at the 3rd go? And as mentioned, everything else with re to UK fiance document requirements, is consistent. Does a refusal under Paragraph 320 (7A) affect future applications for a UK spouse visa, please? ThanksAre appeals under Article 8 of the HR pact usually successfully and are they a strong enough basis on which to appeal? i.e. if the only means of appealing a decision is under the Human Rights Act, is that a sufficient reason on its own, for a refusal to be overturned/revoked?ThanksKind regards
Dear UK lawyer,Thank you for your inputs.What do you mean in Point 1. 'But there is nothing preventing them for not issuing you a visa based on the fact that may withheld information from them. 'Do you mean that they can still issue me a visa, despite not disclosing material facts, both written and orally (at the interview)? What confuses me, is why did the interviewer state that the UKBA have information re a previous arrest, after I denied it twice?I was previously present in the UK on a visitor visa, and me my fiance made enquiries into getting married, but found out that I could not marry on a visitor visa and I'm assuming the registrar wouldn't go ahead with the marriage once he/she sees that I was on a visitor visa? So I'm quite confused about your statement re the right to marry regardless of the UK visa category? Could you kindly elaborate on that?Thank you.Kind regards.
Dear UK lawyer,What do you mean by 'they are pulling the strings so they have the power to reduce your visa', how will they reduce my visa?And the fact that I never got charged, even though I didn't disclose information re a previous arrest in writing, and denied it twice at the interview, then confessing it at the third instance, hinder the 'good character' definition in their eyes? And is the fact that I didn't confess straight away enough grounds for refusal for 'deception'?Does refusal for not maintaining a good character carry a ban? Also, why do you think the interviewer state that the UKBA have information re a previous arrest, after I denied it twice?Does 'Article 14 of the European Convention on Human Rights' apply to a couple, where one is an EU national exercising treaty rights in the UK and the other person is a Non EU national?Does a refusal under Paragraph 320 (7A) affect future applications for a UK spouse visa, please? Thanks I.e. if a fiance visa is refused under Paragraph 320 (7A) and then I decided to get married to my fiance elsewhere, then apply for a UK spousal visa, would the ban still be intact?Finally, What you would need to do if it does go to appeal is "explain the effects of the refusal clearly" and back it up with evidence so the judge can take into account all the information and make a decision in your favor. What do you mean by that statement in inverted commas, please?ThanksKind regards.
Dear UK lawyer, Thank you for your detailed reply.Given the facts of my scenario, do you think that there's a strong grounds for refusal under deception? And what does it carry with it, a refusal on its own, or a refusal and a ban? Please. ThanksIs the human rights basis a strong enough reason on its own to overturn a refusal under Paragraph 320 (7A)? As you mention that these refusals are hard to overturn.Could they just refuse me for not disclosing material facts, without a ban?So let me get this right, please. If my UK fiancee was refused under Paragraph 320 (7A), the decision would need to be overtuned/appealed etc, before I make an application for a UK spouse visa? Otherwise it will still be intact? How can they stop a wife from being re-united with her husband? It's unreal.Thanks.Kind regards.
Dear UK lawyer,Thank you for your response.With regards XXXXX XXXXX 3 of your reply. I wasn't aware of disclosing that previous arrest in the forms etc, as I thought it didn't matter, since no charge or conviction was ever made, and everything was dropped in the end, i.e. NFA. I did explain that reason during the interview, that the reason why I did not disclose it is because I don't have a criminal record and I never got charged or convicted. Also, as far as I remember, on the online visa form, VAF4A, it states whether there has been any previous charges or convictions, not arrests only, so I ticked no for that.How long do I have to appeal after a refusal was made? And how long do appeals usually take?Also, do they require my passport for the appeal process?Is it best to get married elsewhere then to submit the marriage certificate along with the other appeal documents? What's the success rate of appeals for deception, under the human rights, please?Also, if my fiance would uproot and leave the UK in order to settle with me in Kuwait, would he 'lose' his status as having exercised treaty rights in the UK for over 5 years? Does he need to obtain an EEA residence card before he leaves the UK?Thanks.
Dear UK lawyer,I have been refused under paragraph 320(7B) yet again. And they have questioned my income, despite my sponsor earning well above 18,600 per annum, and surely he is sponsoring my application, so I don't need to show any proof of income, as my fiance is my sponsor etc and my immigration advisor would have definitely advised me prior to this. Nowhere on the documents required by the UKBA do they state that the applicant has to show evidence of their income? Could you advise me on this? Clearly they have breached my rights and this refusal is unjust. Do I have a strong case for an appeal? Thanks
Dear UK Lawyer,Please see attached the refusal letter.They have basically refused me on the same basis as my last refused visitor visa application, for having being refused entry on arrival to the UK on 14/12/2012.Kind regards.
Dear UK Lawyer,Thank you for your inputs.What originally led to this ban, was due to the fact that on the application form of my last granted visitor entry clearance on 24th June 2012, I stated that I wanted to stay for a duration of 30 days, following my graduation, whereas I ended up staying 5 months. But my visa was still valid, so I wasn't in breach of any conditions attached to my leave, I left in a hurry due to mitigating circumstances back home. So when I tried to re-enter the UK on 14th Dec 2012, in order to collect my belongings and complete my affairs in the UK, I was refused entry upon arrival, was interviewed and they asked me why I've stayed for 5 months. I said that I wanted to apply for a Masters course, so that I would go home and re-apply as a student and that I wanted to spend time with my partner. I even had a return plane ticket.They penalised me for not disclosing this fact on my granted visitor application. But I wasn't prompted to provide such information. It's a visitor application and my main reason was to attend my graduation ceremony, not to spend time with my partner. So I was sent home. I voluntarily chose to do so. Then when I tried to re-apply for a visitor visa in Feb 2013, I was refused entry clearance due to being refused entry on arrival on 14/12/2012. I was refused under paragraph 320(7B), plus they were not sure of my intentions to visit and that I would return home afterwards and was issued with a one year ban. They also weren't sure of my family and financial conditions.Which was fair enough, as it was a visitor visa. But they still drag it onto the settlement visa.I then enquired about circumventing the ban and the UK fiance visa was a promising option, as paragraph 320(7B) wouldn't apply to the UK fiance visa. Since my fiance is sponsoring my fiance application and the onus was mainly on him to provide most of the documents, yet they still ban me upon the same basis and they question my financial circumstances, I'm really annoyed and frustrated with their decision. They seem adamant on refusing me entry clearance. What assets do they expect me to have, when I've graduated last year? But what's really insane is that it clearly states on the UKBA site that the sponsor is a person settled and living in the UK and that he is responsible for maintaining me me throughout my stay in the UK, he earns well above the threshold needed, by at least 3 times. They clearly don't understand the rules.How long do you think it would take to overturn this matter? As it does mention that on the second page, second paragraph of the 'Your right of Appeal' section. Does it even reach the courts for this/ appeal procedures? Finally, what baffles me is that there is no mention of the interview on the refusal letter, in fact they said that it wasn't necessary to interview me.Third paragraph, on the first page of the refusal letter, under 'Your application' section. That's a blatant lie. I was made to attend to interview last Monday, 30th July 2013. They were concerned with a wedding booking, even though it wasn't a requirement on the UKBA's site. But we provided them with a wedding booking anyhow. Then they question me about a previous arrest, which has nothing to do with the application, I was really concerned that I would get refused for deception, but what saved me is that I confessed in the end. The previous arrest carries no charge or conviction. Surely they would have brought it up in my last visitor visa refusal letter. They're trying to pick on whatever they can, to refuse me, I don't know why though. I've kept a clean immigration history to the UK, I never once overstayed nor breached any conditions attached to my leave. Thanks.Kind regards.
Dear UK Lawyer,Thank you for your last response and inputs.I have now lodged an appeal with the IAT in Leicester. They received it last Tues. I have been told that it takes them a month to process it and then up to 12 weeks for an ECM review decision, is that correct?I am hoping that the ECM will see some sense and decide to overturn the UKBA's decision and grant me a visa. I don't see my matter escalating to court, to be honest. As it's not in the public's interest nor in the UKBA's interest, to dispute the matter further. Do you see it going to court? As you've mentioned, by the time the ECM makes a decision, the ban period would have 'expired', so there are no other grounds of refusal, as I meet all the other requirements.We are appealing on the grounds that paragraph 320 (7B) doesn't apply to a UK fiance visa, that the refusal letter was unsigned, undated, that I have attended an interview, despite of what they state on the refusal letter and that they treated my application as a visitor visa with the rights to marriage, which is incorrect, as it is a settlement visa. Does such visitor visa exist? (A marriage visitor visa) Thanks.Kind regards.
Dear UK Laywer,Juts to clarify. Although I made my original UK Fiance visa application outside the UK, the appeal was lodged within the UK, at the IAT in the UK. My sponsor has lodged the appeal in the UK. I was advised that the ECM reviewing the papers would be one based in the UK and hence would be independent from the Embassy over in my country. And I was advised that it takes a month for them to process it and then up to 12 weeks to review and make a decision. (Before and if, it goes to court).Thanks.Kind regards.
Dear UK Lawyer,1. That is understood.2. Don't all appeals get reviewed by an ECM in the UK first, before and if needed to proceed to court though?3. As far as I know the UKBA has been merged with the home office, so do you think it wouldn't be in the public's interest to pursue the matter to court? I mean after the ban expires, what other grounds for refusal do they have? It seems from the refusal letter that the UKBA's only grounds for refusal is the ban under paragraph 320 (7B), which expires in under 3 months' time. Please refer to the refusal letter, in my previous reply (above). Thanks.Kind regards.
Dear UK Lawyer,Thank you for clarifying the matter.Kind regards.
Dear UK Lawyer,I know this is slightly off your expertise area, but do you any knowledge of what a country's national security deals with please? Does it deal with crimes committed against the state in the country itself, or abroad? If I have been previously arrested for a domestic violence matter in the UK, does the national security in my country know about it or have any concerns about that, please? Thanks.Kind regards.
Dear UK lawyer,Thank you for clarifying the matter.Just a few more questions on this topic, please; would national security in my country even be informed of a previous arrest in the UK, re a domestic incident or would they even be interested in the matter, in the first instance?Today was the first day that I got my fingerprints/photo taken for a passport renewal, so they wouldn't have had details on their system prior to this? (I'm guessing)Finally, would the authorities over here be interested in why I got my continuing visitor visa cancelled (red-stamped) by the UKBA? I would personally doubt it, as it is a matter that concerns the UK and the UKBA, not over here.Thank you.Kind regards.
Dear UK Lawyer,Thank you for clarifying the matter.with re to point 2. I meant the passport issuing authority over here have asked for my fingerprints, not the UKBA. As I was under 18, when I was issued a passport. So my question was, the authorities wouldn't have any or much information on me, if this is the first time they have asked for my fingerprints to be taken?Thanks.Kind regards.
Dear UK Lawyer,Thank you for all your inputs.Kind regards.
Dear UK Lawyer,I'm sorry to ask you this again. But you kindly clarify what the ECM appeal procedure is, please? I mean is it the ECM in the UK who makes the decision to overturn the visa refusal or is it the British Embassy in the UK that makes that decision please?What would have happened had I not travelled to the UK on the 14th of December 2012 (when I was refused entry on arrival), after stating that I intended to stay 30 days on my visitor visa application, but then stayed 5 months? I mean would they still pick on this criteria one way or another? And which date would they have counted the ban from? (27th November 2012; the date I left the UK)Finally, a bit off the subject, if the police were called via the emergency number re an incident that occurred at home, of which I was the victim, the police turned up, but they were not admitted to the scene and no statement was taken, they were turned away and they didn't follow up the matter. However, I gave them my first and surnames. Would this be logged on their system? Bearing in mind that no statement was ever written or anything. I just told them that I was being threatened by a member of my family, who has been abusive to me and has been abusive to me in the past. Also,since the authorities in my country don't have any record or v.little record on me, since I've only recently done my fingerprints, and they've only recently entered those details on their system, if they carry out any security checks through their national computer or state security systems, not much, if any info, would come up on me, is that correct? Because I'm stateless and never done my fingerprints before? Thanks.Kind regards.
Dear UK Lawyer, Thank you for clarifying the matter. I was advised by my lawyer that the ECM in the UK would review the decision and can overturn it, after which the Embassy in my home country have no choice but to comply with the IAT's decision. I wasn't told that the visa section who refused me, would have the power to overturn the decision.I believe that we have a strong grounds to appeal the refusal, purely due to errors committed by the UKBA rather than us, i.e. the refusal was not due to a lack of supporting documents etc, they treated my fiance visa, as a visitor visa, which is absurd, but there you go.Do you think that they would have picked on the issue, re staying 5 months, despite stating on my visitor visa application that I only wanted to stay for 30 day? Had I not traveled back to the UK on 14th Dec 2012, please?Also, if the ECM was to overturn the decision, is it likely to be before the ban expires or afterwards? And how long does it take the Embassy to issue a visa, once the ECM decides to overturn the decision, please? Thanks.Next, I have read somewhere that the UKBA can still refuse a UK fiance visa application under 320 (7B) 'Where the applicant has contrived in a significant way to frustrate the intentions of the immigration rules' what does that mean, please?Finally, have you come across cases, where an applicant has been previously refused under paragraph 320 (7B) for a visitor visa, after which the applicant has then applied for a fiance/settlement visa, and then got granted a visa? Hence the ban under 320 (7B) was not applied. And in contrast, have you come across cases, where an applicant has been previously refused under 320 (7B) for a visitor visa, then applied for a settlement visa, then was refused under paragraph 320 (7B), as the ban didn't yet expire (as in my case) and then appealed/ or had the ECM overturn the decision and grant it in their favour, and subsequently got granted a visa? Thank you.Kind regards.
Dear UK lawyer,Thank you for your inputs.With re to point 2 of your last answer, I stayed for 5 months in total, rather than 6 months, although I had stated on my application that I was planning to stay for 30 days. They detained me and interviewed me at Heathrow, after which I did explain to the Interviewing officer that I wanted to spend time with my partner etc he said I should have disclosed that in the visitor visa application, which I had originally made, but I wasn't prompted to provide such information (i.e. details of my relationship), as my main purpose was to attend my graduation ceremony. I was given the option to appeal from the UK or back home, so I decided to get back on the next available flight. I did ask the interviewing immigration officer, whether this refusal on entry would affect any future applications, he said no, then I applied for entry clearance to the UK as a visitor, this time disclosing details about my partner, but I was refused, under paragraph 320 (7B), for having been refused entry on arrival on 14th Dec 2012.With re to point 3 of your last reply. The ban expires on 14/12/2013. So is it likely that the ECM will overturn their decision before that date or afterwards? Also, when you state 19 weeks, is that from the date the appeal was lodged at the tribunal, which was 13th August 2013, or does the 19 weeks start from the date they take the payment for the appeal from my partner's credit card, which is 140 pounds? As of yet, they haven't sent us an acknowledgement letter nor take the payment out. We sent the papers via DHL to the IAT in Leicester and they were signed for on 13th August 2013.How long does it take to receive an acknowledgment letter from the UKBA and how long will it take them to process their fee, please? We have lodged the appeal on 13th August 2013.They treated my last UK fiance application as a visitor visa with the intention to get married. We provided all the necessary documents and we meet all the eligibility criteria, yet they still applied the ban under 320 (7B).Hopefully, this matter won't proceed to court, as there chances of winning are less than 1%, if the only obstacle is the ban. Once the ban expires, there shouldn't be any grounds for refusal. How could they mistake this for a visitor visa, with the intentions of getting married, when the words, UK fiance were written everywhere? It's absurd.Why was I issued with a ban under paragraph 320 (7B), in the first place, if I still had a valid visa and had they taken my entire immigration history to the UK into account, they would see that I had never overstayed. So what made them think all of a sudden that I would overstay. I even had a return flight ticket in hand.Kind regards.
Dear UK Lawyer,Thank you for your inputs.The IAT haven't deducted the appeal fees yet. Will the appeal be logged only after they process the fee? I would have thought that they would be quick to process the fee, but it has now been over 3 weeks and they haven't processed the fee.You mention that there's a 6-8 weeks back log, does that mean it will take them 6-8 weeks to log the appeal and to process the fee, please? Or to send a letter of acknowledgment?I did mention all the relevant points in the grounds of appeal, in the paperwork we've submitted to the IAT, which includes that they have considered my visa as a visitor marriage visa, which is incorrect, as it's a fiance visa, that the ban under paragraph 320(7B) doesn't apply to the fiance visa, I was in fact interviewed and that paragraph 320(7C) is no longer in force. And, the refusal letter was unsigned and undated, which could invalidate it.When I was refused entry upon arrival on 14th December 2012, I did mention in the interview that my relationship with my partner had broken down and that I was only intending to collect my belongings, which included some important certificates and then go back. I even had a return ticket. They knew that me and my partner were involved in a domestic incident, as they had a look through my luggage and I confessed to them prior to that. I should have been given temporary admission to collect my belongings. It doesn't make sense that throughout my immigration history I have never once overstayed, yet all of a sudden, they would think I'd overstay, plus my relationship had broken down, as mentioned.It's surreal to believe that the UKBA have 'mistaken' my application for a visitor one. I think they are annoyed that I managed to find a loophole past the ban under paragraph 320(7B), via the fiance visa route and so they refused me on purpose, so that I can serve out the ban. That's what I personally believe. Because they know how long it takes to appeal and an ECM review would take up to 4 months, is that correct? So 4 months from 13th August would take us up to the expiry of the ban date. Thank you so much.Kind regards.
Dear UK Lawyer,Thank you for your inputs.Do you mean that it's taking the tribunal 6-8 weeks to process the appeal fee and to acknowledge the appeal? And do they only acknowledge the appeal after they have processed the fee, please? Thanks.We have confirmation that the appeal has been lodged, as the appeal was sent to the IAT via DHL and someone has signed for it. So we are in receipt of that. But they are yet to process the fee and to acknowledge the appeal. Hence, we haven't received any written correspondence from the tribunal.Can you kindly clarify, what you mean by the above sentence in point 4'it is obvious that the home office have interpreted the circumstances differently.' In what ways have the home office misinterpreted the situation, please? Thanks.Finally, the refusal letter was totally incoherent, how could they possibly treat my UK fiance application as a marriage visitor visa, it must have been deliberate, unfortunately there is no way of proving that, unless I appeal. Fingers crossed, my application will be overturned at the ECM review stage. Is it true, that it's not up to the visa section that refused the application, in the first place, to decide to escalate the matter to court? That is decided by the adjudicator in the UK? I have been told that the UKBA are under pressure to clear the back log and wasting tax payer's money is a key issue, therefore one would hope that they would be sensible enough to overturn the decision at the ECM stage; because the ban would have been expired by then (It's mentioned in the appeal papers).Many thanks and Kind Regards.
Dear UK Lawyer,I would like to ask you with regards XXXXX XXXXX appeal process timelines.If the ECM decides to uphold the decision, does it take an additional 6-8 months to obtain a hearing date after the 19 weeks period, or does the 6-8 months start from the date that the appeal was logged, i.e. 13th August 2013, please? Kind regards
Dear UK Lawyer,Thank you for your inputs.Have you ever seen a refusal letter that hasn't been signed or dated by the ECO? Could that itself invalidate the refusal letter itself? My gut feeling is that since the only criteria the UKBA has against me is the 'ban', once that expires, there's no grounds for the UKBA to take the court, as the ban would have expired by then?
I doubt the UKBA would accidentally forget to sign and date a letter, knowing how demanding and scrutinising they are. I believe the refusal letter was deliberately not signed or dated, as it's highly unlikely the matter would proceed to court, at least I hope it won't and the UKBA know that won't reach the court, as by the time the ECM makes a decision, the ban would have been well expired?Thanks.Kind regards.
Dear UK lawyer,Thank you for your inputs.What's the longest time can appeals take (oral hearing) for settlement visas, bearing in time the delays that the tribunal is facing, please? Does it take years to resolve? or 12 months at the most? Thanks.Do I have to withdraw the pending appeal if I was to apply for a student visa? And is it likely for my student visa to be refused, since I was refused a settlement visa? I mean would my refused settlement visa affect future UK visa applications? Thanks.Kind regards.
Dear UK Lawyer,Thank you for your inputs.I would like to comment on your earlier reply. Although at the time the application for the UK fiance visa was made, the ban was still active, they didn't however treat my application as a fiance settlement application, they treated it as a marriage visitor visa, hence the ban would apply. Had they assessed my application under the correct criteria, i.e. UK fiance visa, the ban under paragraph 320(7B) doesn't come into affect. Therefore the decision made was incorrect, as it was a settlement visa I applied for, not a marriage visitor visa.Is there any way of tracking my application? It's been over 5 weeks now and still no news. I mean where can I find out about delays etc? Is there a website? I don't have an appeal number, all I have is the post ref no of the embassy that made the decision and a receipt that the bundle was sent and signed for.Should I instruct my lawyer to contact the tribunal if I don't hear anything within the next 2 weeks or so? As I've been told that it's currently taking the tribunal up to 8 weeks to process appeals.Also, are they (tribunal) likely to send a letter of acknowledgement etc to my sponsor in the UK or to me? (abroad)Finally, how will I know if the matter proceeds to court etc? I will instruct my lawyer to write to them after the ban expires. Thanks.Kind regards
Dear UK Lawyer,Thank you for your inputs.It doesn't make sense for the tribunal to send a letter to me all over in Kuwait, when both my sponsor and legal representative are in the UK? Could you kindly confirm this? The postal system is very unreliable over here, I don't think I would ever receive the letter, if it was sent over here. Both my sponsor and legal representative have provided their details on the forms (address, e-mail, phone numbers etc) Plus, my sponsor's card details are on there, as he's making the payment on my behalf.My sponsor has previously tried ringing that number, you stated above, but there's some sort of automatic message on there, so you can't actually talk to anyone?I'm just worried that they may have displaced it, but it's most likely they haven't got round to processing it yet?What would the acknowledgment letter state, please?The date until the ECM has to respond? Plus, the appeal date? If the matter goes to court, the latest a hearing date would be issued is approx around Feb-April next year? If it was lodged last last Aug? The papers were signed by someone, but is it some building that it goes to or a P.O. Box, do you know, please? Finally, what happens if I don't receive the letter after a while? Should my lawyer chase it up? Thanks.Kind regards.
Dear UK Lawyer,Thank you for your inputs.With re to Point 1. My lawyer has prepare and drafted the ground of appeal on my behalf, but my sponsor had to send it to the tribunal via courier, as my lawyer is not permitted to lodge appeals on a client's behalf. But within the bundle, he mentions that he will be representing my case in the UK etc and I have signed to show my approval, so the tribunal are aware that he's going to be my legal representative etcIs it best for my lawyer to contact the tribunals number, rather than my sponsor, as that might 'annoy them', if you know what I mean.My goodness! It's taking 3 months to get an appeal date from inside the UK? How long does it usually take to get a hearing date for appeals within the UK? But you say that you did manage to get an appeal number, after calling them, right? Was that recent? If you don't mind me asking. ThanksIs it possible to know the firm that you represent, please? Or a linkedin account?Kind regards.
1. Yes my legal representative has filled out the relevant section on the appeal form. He is an immigration barrister and has advised us that according to the bar regulations, he's not permitted to lodge appeals on a client's behalf.2. All three names are XXXXX XXXXX the form; my name, my sponsor and my legal representative.3. That's a pity. So I am not permitted to give you an e-mail address to contact me or for me to your name etc? Sorry for any inconvenience caused.Kind regards.
Thank you for your kind words. It's just a really painful wait. I haven't seen my partner since last September, almost a year now.Is it true that barristers cannot lodge appeals on a client's behalf?Finally, how can the ECM make a decision, when the embassy has returned back all the original docs? Will they make a decision based on the legal submissions, which were submitted at the time of the application and of which they are in receipt of?Thank you so much.Kind regards.
Thank you for confirming that.Well my barrister has copies of everything that we submitted anyways. The embassy has all the print outs, such as Skype, phone bills, e-mails, texts, the legal submissions and witness statements of both me and my sponsor and friends/relatives.Do you know of anyone (a client perhaps) who has recently lodged an appeal outside the UK and timelines it's taking?Kind regards.
Thanks.Sorry what do you mean by 'when processed'? When my representative receives the letter or when the appeal fee is processed? ThanksMay I know, which month you client submitted an appeal and roughly how long it took for your them to receive a letter of acknowledgement and for the tribunal to process the fee? Was it relating to a settlement visa, like myself?
If you don't mind. Thank you for your help, in advance.Kind regards.
Thank you for your inputs.Fair enough. Thank you anyhow.Just a final question, please. When you mentioned that you had a client who's appeal date is in April, was that for an appeal lodged within the UK or outside the UK, please? ThanksKind regards.
Dear UK Lawyer,I would like to ask, with regards XXXXX XXXXX delays at the IAT. Are the delays only with the processing or with the entire appeal process please? I mean, once they process my appeal and send out a letter, does the ECM have 19 weeks from the date my appeal is processed or from the date the appeal is lodged, please? Bearing in mind, the extra 4 weeks delays in processing, therefore 8 weeks processing time. And are there delays with issuing a hearing date (if needed), please? Next, do ECMs always respond or have there been cases when they don't respond during the 19 weeks period? Thanks.Finally, do marriage visitor visas carry a full rights of appeal? If not, then do you think my lawyer should point out to the tribunal, if the case goes to a hearing, that it's strange for the UKBA to issue me with full rights of appeal forms, despite treating my application as a marriage visitor visa, which I don't think carries a full rights of appeal? Could you kindly confirm this? Or is it routine, to issue a full rights of appeal?ThanksKind regards
Dear UK Lawyer,Thank you for your inputs.What do you mean, by they are giving earlier dates if possible, with regards XXXXX XXXXX hearing date? If the appeal was to be processed this week, how long will it take the appeals tribunal to send off the notice to the ECM, is it within 28 days? I'm sorry if I've asked this already, but does the 19 weeks ECM review period start from the day the appeal is lodged i.e. 13th Aug 2013 or this week, once it gets processed or after the 28 days, after the ECM has received the notice of appeal? ThanksKind regards.
Thank you for your inputs.May I ask you one final question re the 19 weeks ECM review period. If the ECM believes that the matter is 100% NOT in their favour, are they likely to sit on it for the whole of the 19 weeks period, then overturn it, or overturn it before the 19 weeks period?I have also read cases, where the ECM overturns the decision a few days before the hearing date or on the day of the hearing date? Who decides to take the matter to court, is it the home office or an independent adjudicator, please? ThanksKind regards.
Dear UK Lawyer,Thank you for you inputs.That is understood. But my question is who decides to take the matter to a hearing tribunal, should the ECM uphold the original decision, please?And have you come across cases where an ECM has overturned their decision before the expiry of the 19 weeks period? Or is it rare? Thanks.Kind regards.
Thank you for your inputs. Much appreciated.I would like to ask, would new immigration rules re to a fiance visa, affect an ongoing appeal in any way?Thanks,Kind regards.
Dear UK Lawyer,I would like to ask you with regards XXXXX XXXXX UK fiance visa. After I get granted a UK fiance visa and I get married within 6 months, what happens next?After how long would I be eligible for Indefinite Leave to Remain, please?And at which stage am I allowed to end the marriage and still be allowed to stay in the UK permanently without being under the mercy of the UKBA or Home Office, please?Kind regards.
Thank you for your inputs. I thought after I get married, I can apply for FLR(M), which lasts for two and a half years and then a further extension which last for another two and a half years?Is the minimum 5 consecutive years for ILR? How does obtaining a British passport and nationality work after that?Thanks.
Dear UK lawyer,The appeals tribunal have finally confirmed the payment last week and said that they would be sending out the appeal bundle starting from last week. So 19 weeks from last week, plus holidays, would mean that the ECM review period would expire on 17th Feb 2014.My question is, if I don't hear from the ECM after 18 weeks have elapsed, should I send them an e-mail to enquire about the matter? And how will I know if the matter is proceeding to a hearing? Next, is a hearing date given approximately 6 months after lodging the appeal? So if I lodged mines in August, a hearing date is likely to be in March or April 2014?Finally, how long after the appeal is won, does a visa get issued? Thanks.Kind regards.
Thank you for your inputs.Sorry, but what do you mean by 'There is nothing preventing you from sending the letter to them now stating the reason why you feel that your application was wrongly refused.' The appeals tribunal have already sent out the appeal bundle and should reach the embassy within the next few weeks. So I don't see the point in sending them another letter? Or do you mean e-mail? Can you kindly clarify. Thanks.I'm no expert in immigration law, but I believe that my legal representative has highlighted every point in the appeal bundle. All the points are in my favour, i.e. there are no errors on my side, no documents missing or anything. So hopefully they will make a sensible decision.Finally, are the UKBA likely to admit to making an unlawful decision? i.e. a decision that is not in accordance with the immigration rules or guidelines? My legal representative says it's highly unlikely for the matter to proceed to court, as the UKBA would have to admit to their unlawful decision and they are unlikely to do so. Plus, they have to give a reason for upholding their decision, before the matter can proceed to court, is that correct? Thanks.Kind regards.
Should the letter state the same points highlighted by my legal representative or just in my own words, please? Also, should the letter be sent to the embassy via local post or via e-mail? Thanks
I just don't know what other reason(s) the ECM would come up with to uphold their decision, if the only issue was the ban. And that is due to expire is just over 2 months?What I meant is if the ECO has made an illegal decision, which is my case h/she has, they would not want to take the matter to court, as that would mean they'd have to admit of their wrongdoing, which is a big risk, am I correct in saying this? Thanks.Kind regards.
To UK Lawyer,I would like to ask, is the ECM allowed to use new reasons and new evidence to uphold their decision, upon reviewing the appeal bundle? I.e. new reasons not relating to the last refusal, under paragraph 320(7b). As I've heard that both the appellant and the ECM are not allowed to produce new evidence etc Can you kindly clarify this? ThanksAlso, if a decision was to be overturned, does that usually happen before the expiry of the 19 weeks period? And how long does it take a visa to be stamped after a decision has been overturned? ThanksKind regards.
Dear UK Lawyer,Thank you for your inputs.My question is, is the ECM allowed to raise new issues, come up with a new reason (e.g. regarding any previous applications) other than the reasons already stated in the refusal notice, in relation to this particular refusal (fiance visa refusal)? ThanksAlso, once the decision is overturned, does the tribunal or embassy inform me or write to me? I.e. If I haven't heard anything after 19 weeks, should I call up the appeals tribunal? ThanksKind regards.
Thank you.If the ECM overturns the decision, would the tribunal be informed of this? And would the tribunal write a letter to confirm this? Thanks
Dear UK Lawyer,Do you agree that the following statement is incorrect, please?"I am concerned by your statement that your Fiance is an EEA national exercising Treaty Rights in the UK. If this is the case then you should NOT have applied for a Fiance visa.To join your EEA Partner in the UK you would either need to prove 2 years co-habitation for a relationship akin to marriage or be married (durable relationship). You cannot get a Fiance visa to join an EEA National in the UK. You would actually need to apply at best for a visit for marriage visa and then leave and apply for an EEA Family visa once married.Based on your statement above it might be the case that the High Commission has not made a mistake at all and that you were making the wrong type of application?"My argument:My sponsor has been exercising treaty rights and HAS provided 5 years worth of bank statements, payslips, p60s, proof of previous addresses, to cover the whole period of 5 years, because he does not have an EEA residence card, but I was advised it is not a requirement to have such a card, as long as you can prove 5 years worth of supporting documents, proving that he has worked and lived in the UK for 5 years, which he has.So I doubt that the embassy has made a correct decision based on this information.Can you kindly confirm that I was provided with an incorrect answer? Because as far as I know, 5 years worth of supporting evidence (EU sponsor)= settled person.Many thanks and kind regards.
Dear UK Lawyer,Thank you so much for your inputs.That's what I though. Just to re-iterate please, my EU sponsor has been eligible to support my UK fiance application due to the fact that he is a settled person in the UK?Not just exercising treaty rights (on the UKBA site, it mentions that a UK fiance visa is for those who either have a British sponsor or a settled person sponsor, which is in my case)
My adviser told me that it wasn't necessary to have an EEA residence card (although it makes things easier), as long as we provide 5 years worth of supporting documents, proving that my sponsor has lived and worked in the UK for at least 5 years? Is that correct?Yes, I totally agree, if the application was incorrect, I wouldn't have been given full rights of appeal. And they would have mentioned that on the refusal notice. But they didn't. The UKBA was only bothered by the re-entry ban.Do you think that there may be a possibility that the ECO may have not understood that 5 years worth of supporting evidence for my sponsor qualifies him as a settled person? Hence, he/she treated my application as a marriage visitor visa? ThanksFinally, do you think that the refusal had anything to do with statelessness? It doesn't make sense, as I've been granted leave to the UK several times.Plus, my sponsor would be supporting me financially, so I wouldn't been on benefits etc and I've never overstayed or claimed benefits before.Many thanks for your time and efforts.Kind regards.
Thank you for your reply.I agree with the points you mention above.With re to point 4, is there such a rule by the UKBA to prevent stateless persons from coming to the UK? I could perhaps understand if they were unemployed and seeking to come to the UK as a visitor, as this may pose a risk of them overstaying and claiming asylum etc, but I'm not applying for a visitor visa this time round, I am applying for a fiance visa and my sponsor is entitled to marry who he wants? I do not need to show my financial situation to the UKBA, as my partner would be sponsoring me and supporting me financially. So if they were preventing me from coming to the UK on a fiance visa, that would be a breach of both of our human rights. Plus, I think if the stateless would be an issue, they would state that on the refusal letter. It doesn't make sense for the UKBA to refuse me on that basis, if I've been granted a visitor and student leave to the UK before? Am I correct in saying that? ThanksDoes the ECO 'not know' that paragraph 320 (7b) DOES NOT apply to settlement type visas? That's bizarre. Thanks.
Thank you so much for your reply.With re to the following point you made earlier:4. I do not think it has anything to do with any other issue apart from the fact that you were banned from the UK at the time of application. This is the only issue in question.Do you mean the re-entry ban under paragraph 320 (7b)? ThanksKind regards.
Thank you for clarifying the question.One final question, please:Does my previous 'clean' immigration history to the UK count in my favour? Especially with regards XXXXX XXXXX stateless issue. I mean, it doesn't make sense to all of a sudden be concerned with that status issue, if I have been granted leave on numerous occasions, is that correct, please?Have you ever come across a case like mines?Many thanks.You are by far the best UK immigration expert on this website.
You're welcome.Thank you for clarifying this matter.I meant, have you dealt with previous cases where a fiance visa application was treated as a marriage visitor visa, and was subsequently refused under paragraph 320 7?Thanks.Kind regards.
Dear UK Lawyer,I have a few questions which I'd like to ask you in relation to the appeal process, please:1) Is it appropriate to e-mail the embassy after 14th Dec, to confirm that they have received my documents from the tribunal? (As there is no other way of confirming it otherwise and I just want to be rest assured) Also, what format does the e-mail have to be in? e.g. to those concerned, my appeal number etc?2) Can I ask them what method of correspondence do they use to contact the applicant? (phone, letter or email)3)How much time is the ECM given to prepare a bundle for a settlement appeal hearing? I've read it's 90 working days on the UKBA's site. So does that mean that hearing would be 90 working days approx after the expiry of the ECM review period?http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/visas-immigration/general-info/appeals/
If the ECM does not overturn the decision, an entry clearance officer (ECO) will write a statement explaining why the ECM has upheld the decision to refuse your application. We will send this and all your papers (known as 'the appeal bundle') to the FTTIAC. We will prepare and send your appeal bundle within:
These timings exclude postage times to and from the visa office.
4) How long after the expiry of the ECM review period, do we receive a letter from the appeals tribunal, confirming the hearing date?Thanks.Kind regards.
Dear UK Lawyer,What I meant regarding the 90 working days is, is that included within the 19 weeks in which the ECM has to review the papers, or is the ECM given 'extra time' to prepare an appeal bundle for a hearing? Essentially the ECM has until the hearing date to prepare the bundle, if he or she doesn't overturn the original decision, is that correct? Or does the deadline for preparing an appeal bundle end after the 19 weeks, please? ThanksFinally, is it 90 working days or 90 days, after the expiry of the 19 weeks, does the hearing take place? So we're look at around 3 months after Feb 21st for a hearing date, which would be approximately in May?ThanksKind regards.
Dear UK Lawyer,Thank you for your inputs.Can you kindly clarify why it states 90 working days as oppose to 90 days on the UKBA's website? ThanksPlease see under 'What happens next?'http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/visas-immigration/general-info/appeals/Thanks.Kind regards.
Dear UK Lawyer,Thank you for your inputs.Can you kindly clarify why it states 90 working days as oppose to 90 days on the UKBA's website?Please see under 'What happens next?'http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/visas-immigration/general-info/appeals/Thanks.Kind regards.
Thank you so much for your detailed reply.Kind regards.
Dear UK Lawyer,I have read that it's becoming a common trend for the UKBA to withdraw before the hearing or a few hrs before the hearing day itself. Can the UKBA still withdraw their decision before a hearing date?And does it mean that the appellant has won the case, if the UKBA withdraws their decision before the hearing? Or is the appellant left at the mercy of the UKBA once again?Does it take approximately 12 weeks to get a call letter (to submit the passport) after the UKBA has withdrawn their decision to proceed to a hearing? If I don't hear after the expiry of the 19 weeks period, do I presume that it's going to a hearing?Finally, if the UKBA decides to overturn their original decision at any point, does the tribunal and does my representative get a written confirmation? Or just a call in letter? (either phone, post or email)Thanks.Kind regards.
Thank you for your reply.If I don't hear from the home office after 19 weeks, do I assume that the matter is heading straight for a hearing?How will I know if the decision has been overturned, will the home office inform the tribunal, after which the tribunal sends out a letter to my representative? Or does the home office contact me directly?Thanks.Kind regards.
Thank you for your quick response.How long is it currently taking to get a hearing date, after the 19 weeks have expired, please? Thanks.
Can you kindly clarify what you mean by your last statement, please:'Appeals from the uk are taking at least 6 months to process, appeals from outside the uk will take longer'.Do you mean it's taking about 6 months inside the UK from the start of the appeal till the end of the appeal? And about 9 months for the entire duration of appeals from abroad? Thanks
Has being refused entry on arrival last year and receiving a re-entry ban under paragraph 320 (7b) had an affect on my UK immigration history? Even though the ban is unjust and hence I am appealing the last refusal based on paragraph 320? Am I doing the correct thing by appealing?And if I win the appeal, would it remove this bad mark off my record?The re-entry ban expires in less than a month, doesn't that mean that after it expires, there will no longer be a bad mark on my record?Is there a bad mark on my immigration record as it stands? And would this make it difficult to obtain visas in the future?Finally, how come at the time when they refused me entry last year, they didn't tell me that I was being refused for another year? I only found out when I applied for a visa last Feb.Thanks.Kind regards.
I agree. I wanted to appeal last Feb, however my rights of appeal were limited due to it being a general visit entry clearance. This time round, however, it's a settlement entry clearance with a full right of appeal.The home office did inform me about the reasons I was refused entry, albeit not so clearly. But they never told me that I was being refused under paragraph 320 (7b) for 12 months. I only found out when I applied for entry clearance as a visitor to visit my fiance last Feb, that I was subsequently refused for 12 months. I was shocked to say the least.Thanks.Kind regards.
I asked the immigration officer who interviewed me, 'Would this have any affect on any future applications?', he smiled and said 'No and that I could apply for entry clearance the very next day, if I wanted'. Obviously it's a deliberate deception on the immigration officer's behalf. I'm annoyed with what they did to me.
All that I was told was that I have a right of appeal and frankly after being detained for over 14 hrs. I just couldn't take any more of it.It was a blessing in a way that I wasn't permitted, as I had a warrant out for an ongoing matter with my partner and had I been allowed in, the case would have dragged on and my partner would not be able to drop charges. As the main reason why he was allowed to do so, was primarily for the fact that I was not in the country.To this day I have no idea, why the home office brought up this arrest at the interview and failed to mention it on the refusal notice? I think they were trying to intimidate me. Because if the arrest was so important, they would have definitely mentioned it, right? It's another blessing that they didn't mention anything about the interview. As I wasn't forthcoming as I should have been. The UKBA pick on the wrong people at times. Especially those who are doing it by the book etc like myself. Unfortunately, there's not much I can do, but wait this appeal out.Many thanks and kind regards.
I know. But I wasn't told any of this. All they were keen about was to put me on that next flight back. I felt like I was being treated like a criminal. Is there any way of complaining about the ill treatment I received at the port last year? Perhaps at the hearing?I think if the matter does not proceed to court and the original decision gets overturned, I would just be glad of the outcome and I won't bother complaining.Kind regards.
Is it appropriate for my representative or sponsor or both of them to mention details of what happened on that day, in front of the immigration judge (if and when a hearing takes place)?The two people that escorted me were rude. One of them was particularly rude and heavy handed in his tactics. He verbally insulted me and called me a term, I don't remember what it was, but it refers to those who try and 'jump' the border, i.e. illegals. He was intimidating towards me and slammed doors in my face, leaving me to open them myself. I don't remember their names though. Is it necessary to know their names?But as for the interviewing officer who deceived me, his initials are on the papers which were given to me at port, last Dec. Can I present those to the judge? However, I didn't complain about this ill treatment in the grounds of appeal. Are we allowed to do so at the hearing? As I think we're not allowed to introduce new evidence at the hearing? Can you kindly confirm this. I didn't tell my barrister to mention this in the grounds of appeal. But he did mention that the immigration officer deceived me, in the legal submissions, that was supplied along with my last application in July.I hope so too, that this matter doesn't escalate to a hearing. Thank you so much for your insight and supporting words.Kind regards.
I would prefer not to amend the grounds of appeal at this stage, as the appeal is at the ECM review stage as it stands and it would delay matters further. If the matter proceeds to court (which I hope not), then I will make sure to complain about the UKBA's ill treatment. But if the decision gets overturned beforehand, then I will be glad with that and won't proceed the matter any further.Thank you for your help and advice though. Much appreciated.Kind regards.
Dear UK Lawyer,I would like to ask, in the settlement cases which you've handled, has it always been the appellant's fault i.e. missing documents etc or have there been cases where the ECO was completely at fault i.e. an error of law?Any success stories re settlement appeals so far, if I may ask? Does the tribunal send the my grounds of appeal to the post via diplomatic post? Or normal post? And does the post then send the appeal bundle to the tribunal via diplomatic post or normal post?Thanks.Kind regards.
Thank you for clarifying the matter.What do you mean by a letter of reconsideration please? I thought that administrative reviews are only for points based applications and that there is no admin review available for settlement applications and so they have to go through the appeals process in order to get a decision overturned, can you kindly clarify this? ThanksIs the embassy's special courier service the same as diplomatic post?Do you think the embassy over here would have received my documents from the tribunal by now? They were sent during the second week of Oct. There is no way of knowing that the embassy has received it, unless I email them? ThanksKind regards.
Dear UK Lawyer,Thank you for your response.I think it's sensible to go down the appeal route, just in case the home office choose to ignore the letter.By a letter do you mean an e-mail or via post to the embassy?My representative is a barrister, he says it's not his duty to chase the matter up (by e-mailing the ECM etc) and that all he can do in the meantime is await the response from the embassy, if they do respond and if not, then he will represent me at a hearing. Should I look for a solicitor to help me draft a letter instead? I mean, I don't see much point at the moment, since the ECM would have received the docs.Also, I've read in some cases, that if you pester the ECM, they might get annoyed and take longer or they might ignore the e-mail altogether.I would like to e-mail the embassy after the 14th of next month. How can I word it in a way that doesn't backfire? 'Can I say, could you kindly get back to me with an update on my matter?' For example?Also, is the ECM allowed to use previous refusals to challenge my grounds of appeal, like the refusal on entry last year?ThanksKind regards.
It's been more than 3 months since the refusal. Therefore, I think it's best to sit and wait, like you said.What's their usual means of contact, letter, phone or email? I received a phone call about my last interview, so I would guess it would be a phone call.Is the ECM allowed to use previous refusals to challenge my grounds of appeal, like the refusal on entry last year?Is it appropriate to email the embassy after the ban expires, asking them to confirm whether they've received my docs and also to request an update on my matter? ThanksThank you.Kind regards.
It's been more than 3 months since the refusal. Therefore, I think it's best to sit and wait, like you said.What's their usual means of contact, letter, phone or email? I received a phone call about my last interview, so I would guess it would be a phone call.Is the ECM allowed to use previous refusals to challenge my grounds of appeal, like the refusal on entry last year?Is it appropriate to email the embassy after the ban expires, asking them to confirm whether they've received my docs and also to request an update on my matter? ThanksI have a gut feeling, that I would not hear anything till after the expiry of the ban. The holidays are coming up, they might not want this matter to burden them into the new year. So hopefully they would see sense and overturn it. Thank you.Kind regards.
Dear UK Lawyer,Thank you for your inputs. Just to clarify a few points, please.What do you mean by your previous statement:2. The ECM can only use your previous refusals if they attracted a ban, ie 1 year or 5 year ban. Do you mean the ECM can challenge my grounds of appeal by mentioning that the re-entry ban was active at the time of the application? Although it didn't apply in the case of a settlement application. Anything the ECM would challenge has to be backed up by evidence, is that correct?Also, in cases where the ECM overturns their original decision, does it usually happen on the day of the deadline or a few weeks before?Thank you, XXXXX XXXXXKind regards.
If the ECM was to say that the ban was active at the time of the application and provide the dates, could the matter still proceed to a hearing?Can you kindly clarify the following point, please:3. The overturning of a decision can happen at anytime, unless they have stated that they wish to proceed to court, then only on very rare basis do they overturn the decision. You mean, once they decide to take it to court, they rarely overturn it before a hearing?Thanks.Kind regards.
Can you kindly clarify this point:1. Yes the case can proceed to a hearing because the ECM should have over looked the ban because you applied for a fiancee visa. This is the basis of the appeal.How can it proceed to a hearing if the ECM overlooked the ban?ThanksKind regards.
That is understood. But in order for the ukba to challenge my appeal, they have to provide evidence along with the reasons for upholding their decision (if that was the case). I don't see where and how they will provide evidence to challenge any of the grounds of appeal, as that would mean that they would be contradicting their own rules and guidelines?I think they would struggle to come up with evidence to support their claims.Thanks.
May I ask whether a letter of consideration is a hand-written or typed up letter to the embassy and it's send through post, or is it an e-mail to the visa section to the embassy? If you could kindly clarify this.Many thanks.
Thank you for all your help and advice.Kind regards.
Dear UK Lawyer,I would like to know how long is it currently taking to get a hearing date, are they issued after the 19 weeks ECM review period, or before that? Depending on how quick the ECM responds?Thanks
Thank you for your reply.How long is it currently taking to receive a hearing date, after the 19 weeks have expired, please?And do both the applicant and sponsor need to supply bank statements in support of a fiance visa? Or is the sponsor only required to provide bank statements.Finally, what does 'In refusing the application no determination has been made as to whether the applicant meets the minimum income requirement. However, we have assessed that, regardless of whether the minimum income requirement is met, the application falls for refusal under the rules'?The above was quoted on my last refusal notice. If you could kindly clarify what they mean by that? Thanks.
Thank you for your reply.With regards XXXXX XXXXX 3, why haven't they taken into consideration my sponsor's income? Have they not treated it as a fiance visa?Also, I am not in employment as I'm a student, so is it necessary to show my savings etc, which I haven't got much, despite my sponsor earning well in excess of the minimum requirement, per annum?I mean, is the financial situation in question or it's just the re-entry ban, according to the refusal notice, please?Thanks
Thank you for your reply.That in itself is a bad decision. I mean the fact that, they most likely just glanced over my application, and refused me, without looking into it any further, is very poor indeed.Thanks anyway.
It hasn't reached a hearing yet, still got to wait another 12 weeks for the ECM to decide.Is a barrister allowed to chase up the ECM through sending an e-mail, as per the Bar rules?Thanks for your insight.
Thank you for your reply.In case my barrister cannot send e-mails, can someone else from the same firm do so? As long as it is from the same firm? Because I don't think I'm allowed to consult another solicitor from another firm, is that correct?
Dear UK Lawyer,I have called up the BHC this morning to enquire about the progress of my appeal and the person I spoke to said that the documents were sent back to the UK on 2nd Dec 2013, a couple of days ago. She couldn't tell me whether the ECM has upheld the original decision or not, as the person in charge of appeals isn't in today. All she knows is that it was received on 29th Oct 2013, so approximately 2 weeks after the appeals tribunal sent the docs out, and that it has been sent back on 2nd Dec 2013.My questions are as follows:Should I presume that the ECM has upheld the decision? Since they would have informed me first if they have overturned it? Or that depends on the Embassy? Has an Embassy ever informed the appeals tribunal first before the appellant, if the decision has been overturned?Is an ECM allowed to disclose whether they have upheld it and the reasons, on the phone? Or I have to wait for the tribunal to inform me in writing?Also, how long does it take for the docs to reach the tribunal, from the BHC, please? And then how long does it take the tribunal to generate an letter confirming the reasons and hearing date, please?Is the ECM allowed to bring up reasons other than the ones stated on the refusal notice, e.g. a previous arrest, the interview etc even though they make no reference to the interview or the interview details in the refusal notice? And in fact, they say that it wasn't necessary to interview me, so for them to turn around and say that they did, would contradict the refusal notice, right? I am really anxious, as they made a decision in less than 5 weeks and no one has sent me a letter, e-mail or phoned me from the BHC.Finally, will the appeals tribunal issue a hearing date after the 19 weeks have expired? Even though they will receive the papers well before the end of the 19 weeks.Thank you, XXXXX XXXXXKind regards.
Thank you so much for your reply.So just to reiterate please, the ECM cannot invent or bring up reasons other than the only reason which was stated in the refusal notice? Which was only due to the fact that the paragraph 320 (7b) was still active?I wasn't expecting that from the BHC. I thought the worst scenario would be that they wouldn't overturn it till the end of the 19 weeks.Have you known of any cases where the BHC informs the tribunal first in writing that the decision has indeed been overturned, after which the tribunal sends out a letter in writing, confirming that the decision has been overturned? Or is it mainly the other way round, please? Ie the applicant is informed before the tribunal, if the decision had been overturned?
Thank you for your inputs and quick response. Much appreciated.Just to clarify in point 2, do you mean in cases where a decision is overturned, the ECM's letter would reach the applicant first? What about if the decision was upheld? Would the applicant receive a letter first, or the tribunal has to inform, once they've received the bundle from the ECM, please? Thanks
Sorry, do you mean the ECM would send out a letter to me, if the decision was upheld or the tribunal would in case it was upheld, please? Thanks
Thank you.Could you kindly provide the link(s) from the UKBA website where it states that Paragraph 320 (7b) doesn't apply to a fiance visa, please? Thanks
Sorry, do you mean RFL5.4, instead? Thanks
Dear UK Lawyer,I would like to know what would happen if the Home Office decide to withdraw on the day of the hearing? Would that mean that we would essentially win the case? Or does it mean that we would be left in limbo and at their mercy, not knowing whether I'd get issued a visa or not?How often have the Home Office been known to do this? (i.e.Withdraw on the date of the hearing) Is it frequent? And have applicants been issued with an entry clearance after the Home Office withdraw? Or does the HO come up with new reasons to refuse the applicant once again?
Also, is it a good thing that the Embassy have already sent back the papers and not waited until the end of the 19 weeks, as that means that as soon as the tribunal receives the papers, they can list my case for a hearing and give me a hearing date?Is it possible to get an earlier hearing date, if we inform the tribunal that we're not bothered about what tribunal location they appoint us, as long as it's an earlier hearing date? Or can we state compassionate grounds, like the decision made was unlawful and that me and my partner have been separated for over a year now?Finally, do ECMs usually stick by their original refusal reasons or generate new reasons, when the matter is upheld? My matter has been upheld, by the way. The BHC confirmed it to me on the phone today, but couldn't disclose the reasons.Many thanks.Kind regards.
Dear UK Lawyer,Thank you for your inputs. Much appreciated.Although I agree theoretically that if the HO do withdraw on the day of the hearing, or the day before the hearing, that automatically means that we have won the case, but I would like to know what happens next?I mean, since the Judge would not have the chance to decide and no determination would be sent out, do I then start ringing up the Embassy and chasing the matter up with them?Why does the HO withdraw, it seems really unfair on the appellant, who would have waited at least 4-6 months for a court hearing and would have invested in a lot of money so far. I think it's only fair for the appellant to gain closure.Are the HO likely to withdraw with regards XXXXX XXXXX matter, as the ban would have been well done and dusted by the time it reaches a hearing, and since they've contested this reason since last Dec 2012? Although I don't know the reasons yet, my suspicion is the ban.Finally, why do the HO only get the chance to view the bundle a day before the hearing? Is that to prevent them to come up with new reasons, which would delay the matter even further?Thank you.Kind regards.
Thank you for your reply.After reading the article below, I am worried as to whether the Embassy would issue entry clearance or not, if they were to withdraw on the day of the hearing?Does the BHC have a specific time frame in which to issue entry clearance, after the HO withdraws the case?Have there been cases when they withdraw and NOT issue entry clearance and come up with other reasons?http://www.freemovement.org.uk/2013/04/10/withdrawn-decisions/Can you kindly have a look at the link and clarify what the issues are? As I am confused by all this.Also, if the HO withdraw before the hearing or on the day, will the adjudicator and HO write to me stating that the matter has been withdrawn and that I won the case? Or will they only state that the matter has been withdrawn, please?Thanks.Kind regards.
Dear UK lawyer,Thank you so much, for looking into the article and clarifying the issues raised in it. As it was misleading.So just to clarify, please. If the HOPO decides to withdraw on the day of the hearing, will the BHC get notified and hence is entry clearance guaranteed? How long does that usually take?Does it take longer for the BHC to contact the appellant if the decision was withdrawn? As oppose to an appeal that was won?Thanks.Kind regards.
Thank you for your inputs.Would the reason that the ban was still active at the time of application be a reason for the Home Office to withdraw before the hearing? As it would have been well expired by the time it reaches a hearing.Also, why does the HO or ECO withdraw before a hearing? Due to the reasons being weak, for e.g.?You said the ECO can withdraw prior to a hearing, can they still do that given the fact that the papers have been sent back to the tribunal?Thanks.
Thank you for your inputs. Much appreciated.I have no idea what the reasons are this time, but my suspicions are, it's still to do with the ban.Kind regards.
Dear UK Lawyer,I would like to ask with regards XXXXX XXXXX Tier 4 application, please?1) What are the requirements?2) Do I have to show the maintenance fees in my account or in my legal guardian's account? Since I don't work, would they question where I got the money from, if I was to print out bank statements from my account?3)Do I need to provide a letter from my guardian, stating that they've provided the money to me and that they're responsible for my costs whilst I'm studying in the UK?4)Does my last fiance visa refusal and last ban due to expire very shortly, have any affect on any future applications, such a Tier 4?What I'm worried about is credibility, would they think that it's strange applying for a student visa, after I've been refused a fiance one?5) When would I need to apply for a student visa, for a course starting next academic year, please? After I've received an offer etc.6)Finally, do you recommend any barristers or solicitors with regards XXXXX XXXXX a Tier 4 application?Am I correct in saying that barristers mainly shine in court, whilst solicitors are suffice for preparing entry clearance applications? Plus, solicitors can do a lot of work which barristers can't do, right? Such as following matters up etcThank you for your help.Kind regards.
Dear UK lawyer,1)Would I need to pass an English language test, if I've already obtained a degree from the uk?2)What changes has there been from the old style tier 4 (before 2011), compared to the new one, please?3)I can appreciate that you cannot recommend any solicitors on the website, but what I meant is would you be able to provide a link to OISC accredited firms, please? Thanks4)Finally, with regards XXXXX XXXXX home office questioning my motive, isn't each application judged on its own merits? I mean I am still awaiting the reasons put forward by the ECM, if the reasons are ambiguous, for e.g., can I say that I wish to pursue my studies, as I've managed to get an offer from a good uni etc? Thanks
Dear UK Lawyer,1) What would constitute a valid reason to switch from a fiance visa appeal to a Tier 4? The lengthy process due to the backlogs perhaps?2) I can appreciate that you don't know the ins and outs of my matter, but would you suggest that I continue with the appeal, if the reasons forwarded by the ECM are in my favour and I have a strong case? Or should I withdraw and apply for a Tier 4? 3) I was on a Tier 4 before, it expired over a year ago, would that count in my favour? Thanks.
Dear UK Lawyer,Marrying in my home country is not an option, due to statelessness; no human rights here whatsoever. I cannot work, study or get married. Plus, my fiance would have to be working in my home country for him to be able to get married to me. He cannot leave his job.Moving to Europe isn't an option either. Again he has a good job with a good pay. Only option is the UK.I have no idea when the hearing date is going to be. I'm guessing sometime in May or June, as it's taking 6 months to get a hearing date at the moment.I'm not keen on re-applying for a fiance visa, due to the complexity of the application and the enormous fees involved. I'm more keen on applying a Tier 4 application. But my worry is that would they question my motive, especially as I would be living with my fiance?Would breaking up constitute as a good reason for wanting to go for a Tier 4 application? As our relationship is struggling.Thanks
Sorry with regards XXXXX XXXXX previous statement:In respect of applying for a tier 4 visa i do think this would be an issue, as you have already undertaken studies in the UK and have returned to your country.Do you mean, 'you do NOT think it would be an issue'?Can I state that my relationship has broken down, hence it wouldn't be appropriate to pursue a fiance visa appeal? As mentioned, our relationship hasn't been great recently, ever since the appeal. It has been a challenge to say the least.Thanks
Thank you for your quick response.But can a solicitor help me prepare a tier 4 application, whilst I'm abroad?Or does someone (e.g. a friend) have to be in the UK to assist me with it?Also, with regards XXXXX XXXXX I will no longer be planning on living with my fiance, if we decide to go our separate ways. Do I have to secure an accommodation before applying for a Tier 4? It would be difficult to look for a flat, whilst I'm abroad.Many thanks.
Dear UK Lawyer,I would like to know that, can a future Tier 4 application be refused under 320(11) or general grounds of refusal, even though that the ban has expired now?I've read cases, not on official sites, where another 1 year ban was enforced to an application, even after the previous 1 year ban has expired, is that possible?Have you dealt with cases where the applicant was previously refused under 320(7b) for 12 months and was later granted leave to enter the uk?I don't know whether to pursue the appeal or to apply for a Tier 4, I'm really worried, that if my Tier 4 application was refused under 320(11), then I'd be in a bad situation. Can you please advise, what would be the best course of action, please? Thanks
Not a problem.1) I'm just worried, that since in their eyes, I used deception in a previous entry clearance application, i.e. stating I would stay a month, but then stayed 4 months and not mentioning I had a partner in the UK, isn't it a serious offence? (deception in an application)2) Unless I contest this ban in an appeal, providing that was the only reason as to why the ECM upheld the decision, that is, and if I then get the appeal approved by the judge, would the ban get 'erased' off my file? Or it stays on there regardless3) I'm just worried that a previous deception in an application would haunt me forever, as long as I don't contest it. May I ask whether the cases you have dealt with involving a ban, were for one year? Refusal on entry?4) I'm not sure about this person's situation, as I just read it on an immigration forum. I will quote what it says:
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