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INC
INC, Solicitor-Advocate
Category: UK Immigration Law
Satisfied Customers: 11510
Experience:  LL.B, Pg.Dip, LL.M, M.B.A (Pending), Solicitor-Advocate. UK Practising Certificate issued by SRA., DIFC Courts Registered (Dubai)
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You have kindly answered questions before re a lady ( Cuban

Customer Question

You have kindly answered questions before re a lady ( Cuban ) who has lived in Panama for 2 years. She is aged 19 and a talented violinist, playing for the Panama Symphony Orchestra. I am sponsoring her to come to England, to study at the Royal Northern College of Music. The plan is for her to study there for 4 years ( degree course) to start in September 2013. But she first needs to learn English, and a course of 6 to 11 months is the current plan. Normally she would also need qualifications ( to join RNCM) equivalent to A levels, but I understand that her exceptional music talent will enable her to join RNCM without those additional qualifications ( this aspect is being looked into by a colleague - at present, the timing of those additional studies is unclear - she may have to take the relevant course of study for those additional qualifications at the same time as the English course or alternatively say 6 month later.
Thus far she has been refused a Prospective Student Visa ( April 2012) ( the barristers who dealt with the application were baffled by the refusal - lack of evidence was the claim). Then, when the barristers were slow in responding to me, I myself submitted the second application ( Student Visitor Visa), this being refused about 3 weeks ago ( an horrendous decision - I submitted various papers for the english course, the start date having been postponed due to the first visa application refusal - 137 pages of evidence were produced, including various evidence of her considerable musical talent - the decision was that as the start date of the original course had passed several weeks previously, she would miss a third of the course and therefore they believed she had no intention of attending the course - they overlooked the fact that the start date had been postponed so that she would indeed arrive to take the course - they thus were saying that as a talented musician who had set her heart on a music career at a high level she would completely jeopardise that career by not undertaking the course - a crass decision to say the least).
I submitted in good faith ( on 22 May 2012) an Administrative Review Request Notice, using an email address obtained from the Border Agency, in respect of that first application, and followed it up with 5 reminders ( they ignored all those emails, and my software shows that they did not even open them). I have however now been advised ( yesterday) by the Border Agency that Administrative Review Request Notices CANNOT BE SUBMITTED re Prospective Student visas and Student Visit visas - IS THIS CORRECT ?

I have now been advised that a Tier 4 General visa is the best option ( I had previously understood that this not available). I understand that the visa can be for a longer period than the 6 to 11 months for an English course. Ideally of course I would like a visa which covered "everything" ( ie the English course, the "other qualification" still to be determined and the 4 year course at RNCM. ) - IS THAT POSSIBLE IN PRINCIPLE ?


Generally, what is your advice as to the MOST APPROPRIATE VISA TO APPLY FOR ?

Thinking "outside the box", since the logic of a refusal is simply " we don't think you would leave the UK if your visa expired without a renewal, so it would cost us a bomb to find you to deport you", surely there should be a system under which ( similar to bail for criminals) one pays a limp sum as "bail money" so that if the thousand to one chance of someone disappearing turned up, the government would keep the money to fund finding and deporting the immigrant. I would willingly pay say £20000 for such a case to get my friend here ( it has cost me more than that already in time costs, as a practising accountant ) - IS THERE SUCH A SYSTEM AND, IF NOT, WHY NOT ?

So 4 questions on one please !
Submitted: 2 years ago.
Category: UK Immigration Law
Expert:  INC replied 2 years ago.

INC :

Please remember to RATE my answer by using the smiley faces OK SERVICE, GOOD SERVICE OR EXCELLENT SERVICE. If you seek clarification please ask.

INC :

Hi, it is correct that there is no appeal or administrative review for student visas. In the event an application is refused, the UKBA require that a fresh application be made.

INC :

Unfortunately, there is also no system whereby you could pay a surety to have someone granted a visa. There is a system in place, but this exists for the purpose of securing release from immigration detention.

INC :

In relation to the application for your friend, it would probably be faster to submit a fresh application instead of trying to judicially review the UKBA'S decision as this process could take several months whereas a new application should take up to 8 weeks to process.

INC :

If there is anything else you would like to know, please do let me know.

Customer:

The most important part of the query was my asking which of various types of visa application you recommend for the circumstances of this case, ie is the "Tier 4- General" visa the most appropriate : and, if so,can it be submitted on the basis of what might be considered to be a composite series of study, ie English ; other qualification ( undefined as explained in last email ) and then RNCM in reality just the one course of study as the first two components are largely to achieve the aim of joining RNCM, the Royal Northern College of Music).

INC :

Hi Victoria,

INC :

Based on the information you have provided, I would be of the opinion that a Tier 4 General Visa would be the most appropriate visa. However, I will look at the rules for another category later today and will revert back to you.

INC :

In particular, I would like to be sure that she does not meet the requirements of a Tier 1 exceptional talent visa.

INC :

With regards XXXXX XXXXX Tier 4, this would allow her to undertake a language course and then subsequently switch to a course at the RNCM, however, she will only be granted a visa for the length of her first language course and then apply for an extension once she has completed the language course and before starting a course at the RNCM.

INC :

With regards XXXXX XXXXX Tier 1 exceptional talent category, it seems she may be eligible if she can obtain the appropriate endorsements require from the appropriate bodies.

INC :

In her case, she would require an endorsement from either the arts council, the royal society or the British academy.

INC :

I hope this answers your question. If so, kindly click ACCEPT.

INC :

If you wish to discuss, please feel free to ask further questions. Kind regards

Customer:

In appreciating that the position is slightly complicated by the as yet undefined "second qualification" , please confirm that she would need to specify, and indeed provide evidence of, that course of study, if it were to run alongside the English course ( the preliminary view is that it would be a course described to me as ABRSM grade 6 - it could start a few months after the English course starts, or run alongside it for 11 months - this seems to create a difficulty inasmuch as I understand that only an English course can be sanctioned for the extended term of 11 months, other courses being a maximum of 6 months).

Customer:

I understand that you are to report back to me regarding the rules for a Tier 1 Exceptional talent application, and I look forward to receiving that information. Presumably RNCM will have received requests previously from other students for such endorsement letters. Are you saying that if they provide such "endorsement" then the Border Agency will automatically accept that she fits the "exceptional talent" category ? If so, what advantage is there in a Class 1 Exceptional Talent application over a Tier 4 General application ( obviously there must be differences as otherwise there would be no point in having a Tier 1 category ?

INC :

Hi, I confirm that she will need to specify and provide evidence of the course she wishes to undertake if it was to run alongside the English course.

INC :

Hi, the endorsement will have to come from the Royal Society or the British Academy.

INC :

There is a difference between the Tier 4 and tier 1 visa. The main difference is that students are not permitted to work unless they are undertaking a level 7 or above course. With tier 1 exceptional talent,employment is permitted.

INC :

I hope this helps. If so, kindly click ACCEPT.

INC :

If you wish to discuss, please feel free to ask further questions. Kind regards

Customer:

Thanks for your last answer.

INC :

Its a pleasure.

INC :

If I have answered your original question, kindly click ACCEPT. Your question will not close and I will be happy to answer any follow up questions.

INC :

Kind regards,

INC, Solicitor-Advocate
Satisfied Customers: 11510
Experience: LL.B, Pg.Dip, LL.M, M.B.A (Pending), Solicitor-Advocate. UK Practising Certificate issued by SRA., DIFC Courts Registered (Dubai)
INC and other UK Immigration Law Specialists are ready to help you
Customer: replied 2 years ago.



I have asked you a couple of follow-up questions re the Panama lady, but despite sending an email to you to point out that these follow-up questions remain unanswered; and then asking that your administration office look into the fact that the questions appear to have "disappeared within your system" , nothing has still been received from you. I must ask you to kindly investigate, and ensure that I receive your replies. If of course you advise me that the questions have been permanently lost within your system, please let me know, so that I can try to recall the questions and re-submit them.


 


Optional Information:
Province/Country relating to question : Panama

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Expert:  INC replied 2 years ago.
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