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Hello there Ujwal -
I apologize for the delay on answering this question -- many lawyers looked at it and at first glance it appears to be more of an international law question rather than a straightforward driving / DMV question. Keeping that in mind, let me answer your questions as you presented them:
a. What is the value of this unique number i.e. K3196 75300 02792? That is the number that you were assigned as an applicant for a permit and later a license and this is the number that the NJ DMV has linking you to your driving record -- that is why the police officer used it because your IndXXXXX XXXXXcense and IDP will not be and will never be in the NJ DMV system. Basically, at this point that number is XXXXX license number for record keeping purposes and if or when an actual NJ license is issued, all records associated with this number will be transferred over to your license number (it takes 6 years for minor traffic violations to be dropped off your record and more serious violations such as DUI or vehicular injury or homicide will never be taken off your record). A DMV clerk can enter the number and come up with all of your identifying information and any tickets or other violations entered against you. b. Once I pay the fine (i.e. around $87) will this violation be linked to this unique ID i.e. K3196 75300 02792? Yes it will be linked to that number at the DMV and because you received such a violation when you are just in the learner's permit stage, the ticket could delay your receipt of a full license for 6 months if the NJ DMV examiner believes that the infraction was serious enough to warrant it. c. For how long can I drive in NJ based on my India license and the International Driving Permit issued in India? Please note that I re-entered US on Jan 24th '13 and my work ends in first week of May'13. As per my telephonic conversation with a representative (Sharon) from NJ DMV in 2011, I was told that I do not need a NJ license if I my stay in NJ is less than a year. Is this provision still active? The answer is not quite that clear. You see, the clerk was correct regarding the one year period -- however, the statute specifically requires that in order to be permitted to drive using the IDP, you are here on a visitor's visa as a tourist and you are not permitted to work in the US. Here is a link to the NJ DMV webpage outlining these requirements - http://www.state.nj.us/mvc/Licenses/Visitors.htm
So, you are wondering what all of this means. It means that you were lucky that you had applied for a permit to drive here in the US and that you were able to provide this to the police officer -- because if the police officer took your IDP and inquired more closely into your situation, you could have been issued a ticket and your car impounded for driving without a license (because you are working in the US, that excludes you from qualifying to use the IDP in the US and it is my belief that the police officer you were dealing with is not familiar with these rules. Because you had the NJ permit to give him so that he could write a ticket with an identifying number, you saved yourself from the police officer looking at the matter a little more closely and getting any other officers involved and then you may have ended up facing higher charges). Because of the way that this all happened, it is my suggestion that you pay the ticket and not appeal it to court -- because the District Attorney and the judge are more likely to know about the tourist requirement on the IDP and you would be forced to admit under oath that you are working in the US -- and the district attorney does have the power to increase the charges to driving without a valid license if he chooses to do so.
If you are going to continue to make trips back and forth between India and the US for work, then I do suggest that you follow through and get the full NJ license (even if delayed by a few months because of a traffic ticket received while you were in the learner's permit stage).
I hope that information helps. Please let me know if you have any follow up questions. If not, can you please press the 4rd, 4th or 5th smile face below so I will be paid for my time. I am paid NOTHING unless you press a positive rating below and this is not a hobby for me (it is how I earn a living in a bad economy). Pressing a positive rating will not cost you any additional money or interfere with any trial plan or subscription plan that you have with Just Answer --- it just acts as a trigger to Just Answer to pay me for my time in assisting you tonight. THANK YOU VERY MUCH
Your valuable answers leads to the following questions:-
a. I never shared the permit (hard copy) with this unique number i.e. K3196 75300 02792 with the Police Officer during the halt, he took my IndXXXXX XXXXXcense and the IDP and retrieved this permit number from his system
b. The examination permit with this unique number i.e. K3196 75300 02792 states that "NOT VALID FOR PRACTICE DRIVING UNTIL OFFICIALLY STAMPED ON REVERSE SIDE" - and on top right side corner it mentions that 'CERTIFICATE NOT ISSUED' - what are the implications of these? There's no stamp on the back of
c. Am worried that once I 'plead guilty' and pay the penalty online and the details of these convictions are shared with the DMV; the DMV might not be able to incorporate the points to this exam permit since I guess its not a valid permit to practice driving in NJ. Not sure if this results in an arrest warrent being issued on a complaint from the DMV to the Police Department that my exam permit is not
valid to practice driving in NJ?
d. If I am not considered a 'tourist' in NJ; then how much time does a temporary working immigrant who have re-entered NJ with his valid native license and the IDP has with him to secure a local NJ driving license? In other words, can I at all drive in NJ on the basis of my India driving license and the IDP for a defined tenure as per some stipulation for a working temporary immigrant? I re-entered US
on Jan 24th '13 e.
Last but not the least, as per your recommendations, I should not appeal in the court for a 'not guilty' plea or hire a traffic attorney to fight my case? Is that correct? To be very honest, the speed limit on RT 202 is 40 Miles per hour and I was driving at somewhere between
43 to 48 miles per hour due to the following:-
a. It was a deserted road with no traffic
b. The route had very few street lights
c. A white car was tailgaiting my car and I got scared with the thoughts of carjacking since I was driving with my Wife and 21.5 months old daughter at 9:25 PM EST. Was returning from the Ridgedale Avenue Walmart store post buying
some grocery yesterday
Even the officer has ticked a cross next to the 'traffic' and the 'visibility' factors in the 'Conditions' section in the ticket number (147698). The 'Court apperence required' checkbox is not checked.
Would highly appreciate a prompt reply from your end to devise the future course of action.
Hello again Ujwal --
It is always good to consult with a local attorney if you can afford to do so because there are times when the local attorneys have familiarity with the courts and the judges that we do not have and where there is a lot here that comes down to the discretion of what a district attorney or a judge will want to know and what they will accept for the IDP, it may no be a bad idea to consult with a traffic law specialist in the county where the ticket was issued (you can find one by searching online with the name of your county and state and the search term "Traffic law attorneys" or you can seek a referral from the local county bar association (they will give you several names if you ask them for a referral) - and you can also find the bar association online by searching your county and state name and the search term "bar association attorney referral" and it should come up for you).
Regarding your additional questions: (a) it does not really matter whether he got the information from your documents or from the computer. The number that you were issued will be the number that is on your eventual permit to drive in NJ and all or a portion of it will end up being your drivers license number if you pursue getting a full license in NJ, The fact that he got the number from the system shows that he did look at your IDP and that is the license he relied on to determine that you were properly licensed in NJ to drive. (b) the permit is not valid to drive in NJ. As I said, the officer relied upon the IDP as your license to drive and only used the permit number because he found something in the NJ DMV system to connect you to - otherwise he would have issued you a ticket under the IDP number and it most likely would have been a court summons because it is the responsibility of the court to report driving infractions to the DMV for IDP holders. (c) they will not incorporate points until you are issued a NJ license -- the ticket will carry through until you have an actual license to drive in NJ and that is when you will be hit with points and an insurance surcharge and that is why the number you start with on your permit carries through right until you have a NJ license -- it is all linked to one person (you). (d) While the DMV might issue you a summons to appear on this ticket at a later date because they may want to see your IDP or make inquiries of you regarding the IDP, they will not issue a warrant for your arrest immediately if they find that the officer should not have just used the permit number on the ticket. You have the legal right to a hearing and the opportunity to be heard before any further actions are taken against you and if the DMV has further issues or problems with the ticket and the manner in which it was issued they will summons you and possibly the officer to appear and explain what happened. At this point if you pay the ticket, that may be the end of it. However, the DMV does have the right to inquire further and they may do just that (it is completely within their discretion). (e) if you are not considered a tourist and the DMV finds that you should have held a regular license then they could charge you with driving without a valid license. In that case you would be held to the same standard as a US citizen who moves to NJ from another state and you are expected to obtain a NJ license within 30 days of moving to the state from another state -- in many instances the DMV in NJ and most states will let a person stretch that a bit, but if it goes beyond 90 days then the DMV or the police are less inclined to give the driver a break (if the driver is pulled over and admits that he moved there from another state more than a few months before that date).
Unfortunately, this is not a situation where I can tell you with 100% certainty what might happen. The officer who stopped you was not aware of the tourist requirement on the IDP or he simply was not inclined to ask because he did not want additional paperwork or court appearances for himself. Even people who work at the DMV are not aware of that requirement (as you have already learned by telephoning them and not getting the full information that you need) - so even if someone at the DMV looks at this case, they may not make the inquiry regarding whether you are working in NJ and they may very well assume that your IDP is perfectly valid (and connecting the ticket to the NJ permit number is XXXXX convenient way for the DMV to keep your record in one place in their computers). So, you may want to consult with a local traffic attorney to see if there may be any other outcome on a local county level with the local officials that I would not really know anything about because I am not close enough to the situation, and then go from there. I do suggest that you speak with a few attorneys in that county regarding this matter because there are lawyers out there who will take the case to court just to get the legal fees from you so you need to be careful in that regard also.
Can you please press the 4rd, 4th or 5th smile face below so I will be paid for my time. I am paid NOTHING unless you press a positive rating below and this is not a hobby for me (it is how I earn a living in a bad economy). Pressing a positive rating will not cost you any additional money or interfere with any trial plan or subscription plan that you have with Just Answer --- it just acts as a trigger to Just Answer to pay me for my time in assisting you tonight. THANK YOU VERY MUCH
Hello again Ujwal -
I note that you reviewed the last answer a while ago and have not yet pressed the 3rd, 4th or 5th smile face underneath the answer box so I will be paid for my time. Do you have any further questions for me? If not, I would appreciate it if you would press a positive rating below so I will be paid for my time. I truly earn NOTHING for answering your questions unless you press a positive rating and this is how I earn a living. I am certain that when you perform work you want to be compensated for it and I am the same, particularly after answering a number of questions (some experts and lawyers on this site will answer with 2 or 3 lines because of the risk that a customer will forget to press a positive rating and I do not believe in that -- I believe in giving full and complete answers and I then can only hope that the customer will be fair and remember to make sure I am paid for the time by pressing a positive rating below). Pressing the 3rd, 4th or 5th smile face below will NOT cost you any additional money -- it simply acts as the trigger to Just Answer to pay me for my time in assisting you tonight. I will be happy to answer additional follow up questions on this matter even after you press a positive rating below.
THANK YOU '
Thanks once again for your valuable inputs. Yes, I do have additional questions:-
a. I'll surely pay the ticket on or before Mar 11th '13 (ticket reflects the court date as Mar 12th '13 and the Court Apperance Required is unchecked)
b. I spoke with 3 reprsentatives from the NJ DMV today and following is what they had to share:-
1. Rep # XXXXX (Frank): Shared that the old exam permit is void and I can
drive in NJ with my IndXXXXX XXXXXcense and IDP since I am here for less than 12 months
2. Rep # XXXXX (Peggy): Started that I need to apply for an NJ license since my stay in NJ is more than 6 months
3. Rep # XXXXX (Maxine): Consulted her supervisor and shared that I should bring all my documents (Visa, Legal documents, SSN, Address proof...primarily the 6 points ID documents) to a local NJ DMV agency and let them decide if they want to issue a permit (with conditions) or a driving license. She further added that I can drive with my IDP for the first 60 days and should file for the license within this 60 days tenure
The aforesaid information depicts the 'variation' of knowledge within the NJ DMV representatives.
I plan to visit a DMV agency today to have a face-to-face meeting to seek more clarity.
Based on your inputs, do you think it will be wise to consult and hire a traffic violation attorney ONLY if there's a summon issued by the Court in case DMV plans to seek additional information? Or should I hire an attorney right away?
As I told you, even the DMV doesn't know their own laws here -- that is why the police officer did not either. Earlier, you did not share with me that there was a court date on the ticket -- you simply stated that the court appearance required box was not checked._Under these circumstances, I suggest that you seek out the assistance of a NJ traffic law attorney before you make any further contact with the DMV and before the stated court date. I do think you should pay the ticket also and let the lawyer examine everything and determine which way you should proceed. I cannot do that for you because this website does not permit me to review individual customer documents (I have actually given you more information and suggestions than I probably should have given the terms of service here at just answer that our answers are supposed to be for educational purposes only).
I really would appreciate it if you could press a positive rating to pay me for my time (you would not believe the number of customers who forget to do so, leaving me without payment for the assistance provided). THANKS !
I visited the NJ DMV Agency i.e. "Wayne 46" at Route 46 today and was able to get 6 points ID documents (i.e. SSN, I-94, ATM Card) verified and the representative considered the application as a 'renewal' application and did incorporate the "K3196 75300 02792" on the 'Application for Driver License' and the 'Basic Driver Examination Permit Application' forms.
However, when I was asked to visit the 'Immigration Check' counter the Lady at the counter was not able to verify my Immigration status in some system called as 'SAVE'?! She scanned a copy of my SSN ID and the I-94 and the L1A Visa and gave me a handout (viz. Didn't verify in SAVE?) with a case number. She advised me that an investigator from their end will reach out to the USCIS to figure out the error. Also shared that I should call the Wayne 46 DMV agency after 7 working days in case the agency does not get back to me within this stipulated time frame.
Not quite sure what I can do to expedite the closure of this 'SAVE status' validation process?
The good news was that the lady at the immagration counter and the one who verified my 6 point ID documents confirmed that I can drive a car in NJ since I have a credit card style driving license which is in English and am also carrying an IDP.
Request you to please share if there are some actionable which needs to be completed from my end to exepdite closure of the 'SAVE' status check proceedings?
Also I reviewed both front and back page of the 'Complaint Summons' and the back page depicts that "You may plead guilty and pay the penalty, if the check box 'Court Apperance Required' has not been checked on the reverse side and the offence is payable without the necessity of a court appearance". Additionally, it says that "if you wish to pay the penalty, bring or mail this ticket, together with the payment in the amount of the penalty, to the court at the address indicated below 'prior to the court date' displayed on the front of this ticket".
Furthermore, when I spoke to a representative from the Muncipal Court today, she took the ticket number and confirmed that its a 'payable ticket' and can be also paid online via njmcdirect.com. She said, if I opt for the 'plea of not guilty' then I would have to appear in the court and might also need someone to represent my Legal battle. Once again, the 'Court Appearance Required' checkbox is not checked but the Court Date has 03/12/13 keyed-in as the date. The 'Time Hour' (AM/PM) data fields are blank.
Based on the aforesaid do you still feel I have to visit the Court and should hire an attroney ASAP?
Last but not the least, I'm not one of those Customer's who will 'forget' to provide my feedback for your valuable services :-)
You have gone from traffic questions to an immigration law question and at this point I have to ask you to start posting questions separately. I have already answered 3 hours of follow up questions and I only receive a tiny small amount of the amount you offered to Just Answer for this question and only if a positive rating is pressed, which has not yet happened, so I will not be paid even that tiny amount. As noted, this is not a hobby for me and it is how I earn a living and I have answered and been paid for 15 questions by other customers in the same time frame as I have been working on these questions with you. Once it gets to a point where the questions are veering way off of what the original question is, we are required to ask you to post separate questions to be fair to the expert asked to answer this question (and its progeny) and the other experts who are qualified to answer other questions (we have an immigration law section). You can get a subscription plan from Just Answer where you can ask as many questions as you want for a short period of time and you are charged one price so you may want to inquire to customer service about those plans.
Got it Mary. I'll end this trail with zillions of Thanks to you for your valuable time. I don't see the 'rating' section with this 'Need more information' box? Where can I click to rate the service?
You can press a positive rating below and I do thank you for your business. It is just that when the questions go on for a while and then start to branch off into hybrid questions, I end up getting a not so nice note from management that I am supposed to tell you to open new questions and/or purchase a subscription. And in this economy, I simply cannot afford to lose my position here even if I don't get paid for every question all the time.
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