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Chris (aka-Moose)
Chris (aka-Moose), Auto Technician
Category: Toyota
Satisfied Customers: 338
Experience:  16 years of experience
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Toyota Pickup: HELLOO!!!! 22re starts then dies

Customer Question

my 85 4x4 22re was running fine then suddenly stopped running. It fires, turns over, even runs for a moment or two then dies. Seems like it is not getting gas. It has gas in it and ran fine up until now...

*It is very similar to what it did when I started one time while the air sensor wasnt plugged in. I know If the air sensor is not working properly it wont pump fuel. Do you know what each of the i think 7 wires are supposed to read ?


Please... I'm ready to figure this out right now !  The thing said you were online and ready to answer???  I wanna get this going. I will gladly accept an answer if it helps the slightest bit... 

the only thing I can think of that has changed between running and not running is the fact that I didnt drive it for a day while it rained hard. then next day It started up fine, drove it down the hill, stopped at a stop sign where iit died and would start right back up, run for a moment then die again...

its been more than 2 hours now....  the truck was running perfectly until now, it shouldn't be too hard of a fix. I'm running out of time.... please help

Submitted: 2 years ago.
Category: Toyota
Expert:  Toyota Service replied 2 years ago.

Toyota Service :

Hello. Welcome to Just Answer. Please allow me to assist you by discussing your concern.

Toyota Service :

Hi.

Toyota Service :

Question: The vehicle was running fine until you encountered a rainstorm. Is this correct?

Customer :

This is true, but upon starting it the next day it ran fine for about 5 minutes then died while sitting at a stop sign

Customer :

from then on it would start right up just fine but then die only moments later

Toyota Service :

Is the vehicle available?

Customer :

yes

Toyota Service :

Please go out to the vehicle, and pull the passenger side kick panel. In that area, there will be a relay with 6 pins on it. This is the Circuit Opening Relay. Check to see if the box is corroded, or the wiring connector has corrosion in it. This is the most common culprit. Let me know if there is corrosion/oxidization, etc on or in the box.

Customer :

sure. give me a moment

Toyota Service :

OK

Customer :

the only thing I see behind the passenger side kick panel is the ecu, and it looks fine... drivers side?

Toyota Service :

It is higher up on the passenger side. Behind the front of the dash panel

Customer :

sorry, i hope im not missing something here, but i dont see a six pin relay, just the ecu, the wiper control behind the kick panel

Toyota Service :

No worries, we will back track

Toyota Service :

DO you happen to have a 12 volt DC testlight, or a DC voltmeter?

Customer :

voltmeter yes

Toyota Service :

OK

Toyota Service :

Open the hood, and locate the diagnostic connector. Under the lid of the connector there should be a label. Look for the Fp cavity.

Toyota Service :

Ground your black lead on the voltmeter, and insert the red lead into the Fp terminal, ensure you make good contact.

Toyota Service :

Crank the engine

Toyota Service :

Observe the voltmeter.

Toyota Service :

Advise if the voltage drops to zero when it dies

Toyota Service :

Or right before it dies.

Toyota Service :

Another thing...you mentioned the white with a black tracer on the air sensor. Did you have power in that wire or not when you checked it, and, how did you perform the check?

Customer :

im at a loss as far as the data link connector... i cannot seem to locate it. there is no diagram anywhere either that indicates what terminal would be Fp.. .

Toyota Service :

That presents a problem.

Toyota Service :

Let me ask you this

Toyota Service :

Did you have power in the green wire on the air flow meter?

Customer :

the white with black tracer read 0.00 . i had the key in the on position , black lead grounded, red on on the terminal in the boot

Toyota Service :

Please test the green wire for voltage, and see if the voltage there drops out and causes the engine to stall.

Toyota Service :

Air flow meter = air sensor

Customer :

12 volts on green

Toyota Service :

Start the vehicle and see if the voltage drops

Customer :

voltage climbs when started

Customer :

does not drop below 12

Toyota Service :

The diagnostic connector should be on the passenger side, near the fusebox, on the windshield side of the fusebox.

Customer :

no dice. it is either not where it should be or there is something wrong with me

Toyota Service :

Ok

Toyota Service :

Let's do this. On the injectors...

Toyota Service :

You have a blue or a yellow wire going to them, and, a white and a white with a red tracer

Toyota Service :

See if you have voltage in the yellow and blue wires when the engine is started. If so, see if it drops out when it stalls.

Customer :

ok

Customer :

full voltage, doesnt drop... what's weird though, is that it ran much longer with one of the injector plug off

Toyota Service :

OK

Toyota Service :

Resistance checks:

Toyota Service :

on the air flow meter, the green wire is terminal 1

Toyota Service :

no

Toyota Service :

on the air flow meter

Toyota Service :

The white with a black is terminal 1

Toyota Service :

the green is terminal 2

Customer :

yes

Toyota Service :

the brown black is terminal 3

Customer :

yes

Toyota Service :

the black is terminal 4

Toyota Service :

the blue with a red trace is terminal 5

Toyota Service :

the yellow with a blue is terminal 6

Toyota Service :

the yellow is terminal 7

Toyota Service :

on the airflow meter, with the wire connector disconnected:

Toyota Service :

open circuit with the air flow meter door closed

Toyota Service :

between terminals 1 and 2

Toyota Service :

with the door open, the resistance should be direct continunity with the door open

Toyota Service :

Move the door open until the resistance changes, and continue moving the door, see if the resistance drops out

Toyota Service :

terminals 6 and 3: 20-400 ohms with the door closed

Toyota Service :

terminals 6 and 3: 20-1000 ohms with the door fully open

Toyota Service :

terminals 5 and 3: 100-300 ohms

Toyota Service :

terminals 4 and 3: 200-400 ohms

Toyota Service :

terminals 7 and 3: 2-3 K ohms at 68 degrees.

Customer :

all resistances check out within the parameters you supplied

Toyota Service :

Does the vehicle start right back up when it stalls out?

Customer :

yes

Toyota Service :

How long does it run, from start to stall, in minutes?

Customer :

it has been running for about 3-6 seconds then cuts out fast. it actually just ran for about 5 minutes which hasnt happend since it first died. i was able to put in gear and move it forward and back then it died again.

Toyota Service :

This vehicle has all the earmarks of a circuit opening relay that is dropping out.

Toyota Service :

It would be most helpful in our diagnosis to locate this relay.

Toyota Service :

According to my book, it is on the passenger side of the dash, perhaps above the glove box.

Toyota Service :

Lets do this:

Toyota Service :

Remove a plug wire

Toyota Service :

Start the vehicle, and hold the plug wire close to the engine, to allow spark to jump. See if the sparks stop jumping right before the engine stalls.

Toyota Service :

Use insulated pliers

Customer :

just the wire? leave the plug in...

Toyota Service :

yes. Leave the plug in. Disconnect the wire, hold the boot about 1/2" from the metal of the engine. You should see the spark jump. it should be blue-white, and not orange

Customer :

it sparks. but now it will barely run at all, just enough to see a spark maybe 2

Customer :

btw, my truck is down 40 stairs around a corner plus 100 yards away... im about ready to trow in the towel...

Toyota Service :

Based on your statements, You either have a bad circuit opening relay, or the distributor/igniter has an issue. Without checking Fp on the check connector, we cannot verify if the fuel pump is dropping out or not. The air flow meter appears to be ok. Voltage at the injectors is good. That leaves us with eithe the circuit opening relay, the distributor/igniter, or the computer. More diagnosis is needed to sort that out.

Toyota Service :

voltage on the green wire indicates that the EFI relay is good.

Customer :

is it possible the previous owner removed the data connector or that my 85 never had one...?

Toyota Service :

Sorry, I was not aware of the distance involved. :-( apologies

Toyota Service :

Perhaps

Customer :

not your fault no worries

Toyota Service :

I wish I had better information on this. All I have been able to do is tell you what is not wrong...

Customer :

well at least i can save the mechanic a little bit of time tomorrow . thanks for your time though. appreciated

Toyota Service :

You are welcome.

Toyota Service :

Thanks for choosing Just Answer.

Customer :

FYI.. i figured it out.. I assumed you knew that an 85 toyota pickup was different from a 95, apparently you didnt because you sent me on a wild goose chase for parts that did not exist on my truck!!! I thought you were an expert....? The relay IS NOT, i repeat IS NOT on the passenger side, it is on the drivers side, just like i suggested but you said No...you insisted it was somewhere on the passenger side. After talking to a REAL mechanic I was not happy at all the time I wasted chasing down things that were not on my truck ie, there is not Data link connector on the passenger side...its 2 plugs and they are on the drivers side.... WTF? Did you do that on purpose? Or are you really that ignorant...? It's not like you didnt know it was an 85...i told you this multiple times....

Customer :

What a joke.... running up and down stairs looking for things you insisted were there making me feel crazy.... I'd give you negative feedback but i'm not that mean, although you deserve it... hopefully this and the letter to just answer will be enough to prevent so called "experts" from making others feel like they are losing their minds... Have you ever even worked on a toyota truck pre 1990???? didnt think so....

Customer :

i appreciate that you gave me some of your time...too bad it was a complete waste of mine

Toyota Service :

Young man, I do not normally reply to false accusations and negative responses like this, but, this time, I am compelled to tell you that I was reading information to you from the official Toyota factory wiring book. Besides....1995 trucks do not have air flow meters, they have mass air flow sensors.

Toyota Service :

In any case, I am glad to see you got it sorted out.

Toyota Service :

have a great day.

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