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March '05 Astravan 1.7 CDTi (Z17DTL) Loads of smoke through exhaust. As I disconnect various sensors (Air flow,then MAP,EGR solenoid, EGR throttle control valve), and leave them all off, the smoke reduces massively but not sufficiently to pass the VOSA MOT smoke test. When they're all connected, the smoke is thick & black. Any advice you can give would be of great help as I'm at my wits end!! Many thanks John D Horley Surrey

Submitted: 17 days and 3 hours ago.
Category: UK Car
Value: $47
Status: CLOSED
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Optional Information

Year: 2005
Year (other): first reg march 05
Make: Vauxhall
Make (other): Astravan
Model: 1.7CDTi Z17DTL
Engine: ISUZU poss?

Already Tried:
Fault codes read - non stored. Engine serviced - New Air,Fuel,Oil filters and Oil changed. Valve clearances checked. New Timing belt. Top breather pipe checked - clear. Removed inlet manifold and freed off, seized port flap rod. Injectors removed, sent to Marine Diesels in Brighton for testing- no fault found. Turbocharger replaced,£385, EGR valve replaced £250. Cat Converter removed to eliminate exhaust restriction

Posted by Mike 17 days and 2 hours ago.

Info Request

Hello John, Welcome to justanswer...

Youve done a lot already so thats good but there's been no mention of it being in on genuine Vauxhall diagnostic equipment...

I need to know a couple more things though..

Has it been in a Tech 2 machine do you know - or what type of equipment used ..?

IS there anything else - sensor wise especially , that you have not told me about that you have replaced..?

How high is the opacity reading do you know ?

What is the vans service history and mileage?

Rgds, MIKE.....................

17 days and 1 hours ago.

Reply

Hello Mike, sorry about the delay, I was waiting for Vauxhall service to phone back.

 

I purchased the vehicle privately in July 09 with this smoking problem, it still has 68000 mls. I know nothing about the first 3 years service history but the guy I bought it from in Deal, Kent, bought the van himself, the previous year around july 08, off the company he was leaving.

He only had the timing belt changed - although when I checked it, I found the pump timing slightly out of sync to the Crank & Cam therefore I changed the belt again and retimed it using the 8mm & 6mm locking bolts.

 

Yes, the Vauxhall Agent in Crawley West Sussex has just phoned me back and confirmed that Tech 2 diagnostics equipment was used although nothing was found a miss.

The advice was to remove the manifold and free off the inlet flap and secondly, check the engine timing.

I haven't changed any sensors only disconnected them.

Acting on advice from Auto Marine Diesels, I have also removed the cat, as in their opinion it doesn't do anything drastic to these emissions but it could be blocked or restricting the flow

As for the opacity when tested - the lowest value registered on the machine was 6 and unless I'm mistaken, the pass is much lower at 3.

With all the sensors reconnected, the smoke is horrendous and they refused to test for fear of clogging the machine.

I think that covers everything and hope my problem can be resolved without any more major expense.

 

JD

Posted by Mike 17 days and 1 hours ago.

Answer

Hello again, Thank you for your reply...

Ok ... timing , pump timing is something I would have suggested - and still would unless you are positive its ok -

The other common fault is the Egr valve - mentioned I know, but this brings me to another point. Vauxhall were disconnecting the Egr's on some models and re programming the Ecu to account for that to combat egr problems - so I would speak to them about that....see what they say on it... and I would suggest having that done - it can only be done with the Tech 2..

The other thing I have in mind is the ECT sensor - this is the engine coolant temp sensor - not the one for the gauge - but this one tells the ecu engine temp - and the ecu commands the fuel systems etc accordingly - so , rich if cold ...lean if hot etc and if its sending faulty info to the ecu , a common fault - you will get black smoke .... Too it should be noted that this sensor often does not show as faulty on the FCR ( code ) tests... So , renewal is the best move there straight away - as its cheap enough to do and you would know straightaway if thats the cause... Its worth doing..

IF you still struggle with it - speak to them about the Egr business as above - and then , assuming the injectors are definately ok - and there are no silly things like air restrictions in the breather system , then its coming down to the injector pump...

Some of these depending on exact type - have timing solenoids on them that can be replaced - and thats a common fault... Other types have to be done by specialists - again - mention this to Vauxhall -they will tell you if they stock the timing solenoids... Though - if they dont ... then it would be worth looking up a diesel specialist -- as often manufacturers will tell you you cant buy such parts when you can - from the likes of diesel specialists...

I have a company I will give to you that you can speak to if it comes to it - and they will take your pump and test it - and recondition it if needed too...... that company is < HERE > for you .....

So work through as above.... it could be any one of the things Ive mentioned - and will be ultimately .... but Ive given you the things in order of likely hood and cost effectiveness....

Work through as I say and you will get there with it ... Just one other point re the cat ... It was never going to be that causing the smoke - but you may find it needs to be refitted to help get the actual emissions down - so just bear that in mind..


I Sincerely hope I have helped you - Please ask me if you need more help...


Kind Rgds, MIKE

 


  • >>>>>>>>>Please don't forget ....Please press the ACCEPT button if you are happy with my answer/advice given - as that's how I get paid for my time, knowledge and expertise given. Thank you.

 

Feedback and any Bonuses are always appreciated too. Thank you.



Edited by Mike on 11/6/2009 at 12:13 PM

17 days and 1 hours ago.

Reply

 

I have set aside the money which you will definitely get but I'm new to this site. I'd like to go and try things and perhaps ask a few more questions, then of course I'll accept.

Is this agreeable?

Accepted Answer

Hello there John - Thank you for your reply...

Yes of course thats fine... Your money you have paid is held by justanswer on deposit - I don't get paid till you press accept...

You can do that now or later - either way, you can always get straight back to me whenever you wish - just by using the Reply button... I will get your reply/s in my pending box and will always get back to you - whether you have paid now or later...

Some problems require more than just one answer - so Im more than happy to work through it with you .. no problem at all... whichever way you do it...

Just one point - check that link works .. I forgot to create it properly for you - and then had to go back and do it ... ;)

Best Rgds... MIKE....

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Expert: Mike
Pos. Feedback: 99.7 %
Accepts: 
Answered: 11/6/2009

UK Car Mechanic

Hi, I am a Car/ vehicle mechanic of some 32 years. 25of -running my own repair/diagnostic business.

17 days ago.

Reply

 

Oh I see, well in that case I can pay now and you can let me know when my credit runs out! Many thanks so far Mike, I'll be in touch.

Posted by Mike 17 days ago.

Info Request

Hi again....

Thats fine thank you ... Im more than happy to help you as much as I can all the way - your credit wont run out as such ... but if turns into a marathon... there is the bonus option you can utilise if you feel you wish.... but lets see how it goes.. ;)

Just be sure to use the Reply button when you want to contact me - as , if you just list a new question - there are hundreds on the system and I may not ever see it...

Look forward to hearing from you if needs be - but let me know how it goes either way...

Best Rgds - MIKE ;)

16 days ago.

Reply

Hello again Mike, Changed ECT Sensor - £15 @ Vaux., ---- just the same symptoms though, all sensors reconnected, tons of smoke, disconnected, much much reduced but still too much to pass Mot.

However, I will continue with your other excellent suggestions.

ps. Correct me if I'm wrong - If the high pressure pump is used to fill and obviously pressurise, the common rail, prior to the ECU firing the injectors, why is the timing of the pump deemed so crucial to the operation?

Posted by Mike 15 days and 20 hours ago.

Answer

Hello again... Thank you for your reply..

Its a shame that the ECT sensor didn't help - I did have some hopes that it would as its not an uncommon problem...

As to the fuel pressure issue you mention... the pressure has to be built and maintained up to the engine ( fuel system ..) and then the diesel injector pump controls the injection in time - if you understand me.. ie, the fuel is injected in at timed intervals - per firing order.. ( just like ignition to a spark plug on a petrol car engine - in time ) .. but the pressure has to be there for the injectors to even operate / inject / open..

I have just re read this all through again ... Don't forget to speak to Vauxhall about the Egr business that I mentioned before... Plus too - ask them about re programming of the Ecu - often there are upgrades / software updates that can be done to combat problems...

Other than that - Im not too sure that the injectors are ok - it concerns me a bit that its a Marine.. diesel place you have used as opposed to "auto"...so thats something.... but if you really cannot come up with anything after that above...this problem would appear to come down to injectors -and / or injection pump problems...or timing....... !?!

Keep me in touch with me as to how you get on...

Best Rgds.. MIKE....

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