Pet Questions? Ask a Vet and Get Answers ASAP
Hello, I am Dr. B, a licensed veterinarian and I would like to help you with your wee one today.
To aid me in helping you with Turboberry:
Can you outline what these 'multiple symptoms/illnesses' that you are seeing specifically?
Have you checked the water parameters (ie ammonia, nitrites, nitrates, pH)?
When did you last check? What were your findings?
When you say he has facial swelling, do you mean that his eyes are poking out (pop-eye)?
I do not have a test kit. I can get one but not until the fifteenth. I am flat broke at this point. I do daily water changes but not the 100% after a couple of days ago because he is so stressed out that I think any more extreme things like that and he won't make it.
So I change part of his water every day. I had been using Maracyn 2 for the popeye but it wasn't working. I just discovered that the store sold it three months past expiration date. I don't know if that could be a factor.
Since stopping the Maracyn 2, and changing to lifeguard, he has now also developed little white spots, I believe to be ich.
In addition, as of last night, the sides of his face are a little swollen, with the right side more pronounced. I don't know if it's from wedging himself between his new heater and side of aquarium? It's like he's got a puffy face.
The stomach area turned a light grey a couple of weeks ago. It's a little swollen now. He's pooping fine though and eating.
He hasn't been getting around much, fins clamped, not happy.
I've read so much about bettas for months now with conflicting advice on every single website which is why I'm finally asking for professional advice. For example there is advice to use salt for swelling, and then from other people that say don't use salt because it will dehydrate them; use Maracyn 2 without the light because it will break down in light, and don't turn off the light because it won't matter; do daily water changes if there's ich, and don't do daily water changes if the fish is too stressed; use a heater for some conditions, and turn off the heater for others; lifeguard has helped some people with ich etc. and some people say it won't because the ich life cycle is three weeks, etc.
I need to know if I should continue the Lifeguard and if I can add Maracyn 2. I read in a lot of places not to use two medications at once then in some places they say to begin treatment with two medications at once if the illness is bad enough. Because of the multiple symptoms I am thinking I need to use both. There are also ones called QuickCure, and antibiotics, etc., but I need professional advice because I don't want to overmedicate him or undermedicate him, and I don't want to make his water toxic with two medications if he can't take it. I don't even know which medication to give him. So at this point I'm changing his water partly each day and using his heater and giving quarter doses of the lifeguard none of which is helping. As I said he's getting worse. Oh, and fin rot. Most of this all happened after I got some live plants from Petco. I didn't know until after the fact that I should have quarantined the plants for two weeks first. I had got a live plant before that which didn't cause any problems but it was individually wrapped, not from a plant aquarium.
So do I need an antifungal? Antibacterial? Both? Use Maracyn and Maracyn 2 at the same time? Turn off the light? Leave on the light? Raise his temperature? Lower his temperature? Do partial water changes? Do full water changes? Use epsom salt? Don't use epsom salt? Use aquarium salt? Don't use aquarium salt? Use one medication at a time? Use two? Try conservative approach since medications aren't working? I'm going insane and heartbroken that I am so completely inept at caring for this little guy whom I love.
Oh and finding local fish store that sells medications is hard. Even Petco which is where I got the plants that I believe started this has said they don't have medicine for popeye etc. (hence us going to pet barn here in san antonio)
I hope this information is helpful.
If you need any additional information, do not hesitate to ask!
Thank you. I am attaching pictures.
The white spots are back. I don't see how I couldn't see them this morning. His popeye is worse tonight and he still has the swelling in his face. White skin around his eye sockets are showing. And there are very pale yellow spots on his fin, which you can kind of see in the above photo. He is now swimming in a weird jerky way. =( (He has no signs of columnaris or cotton or threads coming off of him by the way. That might be what's at the bottom of the tank, though...?)
I did a couple of partial water changes today, put in a second teaspoon tonight of aquarium salt, had put half of a packet of the expired Maracyn-2 earlier today, and put in the regular Maracyn tonight, and added Lifeguard. I will redo the new Maracyn 2 tomorrow so that I don't overmedicate on that.
The only place that I can find the MediGold is some goldfish aquarium online store. I can order it tomorrow but wanted to see if the Maracyn medications are the same thing?
I got Melafix and something called "QuICK Cure" (clever) but am not going to use the Quick Cure; just wanted to have it on hand if he gets better and you think he can handle it for the ich. I will wait to hear from you whether I should add Melafix (I think you were going to see if he needed it too right now, based on the pictures... or maybe I was going to wait a few days and then add it if he doesn't get better with fin rot.)
I didn't make it in time for the water testing part. I will get you the numbers tomorrow.
Maracyn pamphlet recommends concurrent use of CopperSafe. Is this a good idea? I've also heard before to use a garlic juice on his medicine to increase his immune system, which is obviously shot at this point. I think he needs a vitamin at least. Can you tell me if I need to put a vitamin solution into the tank? Does that affect medication at all? And if so can I give him a medicated pellet? I think I've read that Jungle has something like that. I think that would help a lot.
Hi,In regards XXXXX XXXXX potential of sugar in the medication, this is something that you will need to double check for in the ingredient list of the drugs you are using. It may be a possible issue but more commonly its an issue secondary to nitrogenous wastes. In any case, it sounds like you are approaching this properly and it may just be a side effect to manage while getting his infections under control.In regards XXXXX XXXXX salt, I am sorry you got confused. I appreciate this has been a stressful time for you and we are having to address so much with him. As I am sure you can understand, when I first outlined salt treatment I couldn't tailor the dose any further then I had since I hadn't known the size of tank you were housing him in. Anyway, what I said before was to aim for a total salt treatment of 0.3% with any tank. This means a total of 3tsp per gallon but done gradually. That means the 1tsp per gallon (0.1%) in 3 separate doses spaced those 12hrs to gain a total of 0.3%. If you have a 2.5 gallon tank that isn't totally full --perhaps we may assume its 2 gallons then-- then he will need 2tsps per 12 hours (a total of 6 tsp to get to the full dose) for his tank size. So, from what you have noted, it sounds like you have just reached a 0.15% salt level. So, not to worry, but you can consider slowly increasing this since he does still have some pop-eye and belly distension (if he hadn't, then we might stay at that lower dose) at this stage.Dr. B.
Hi, I am surprised that its not listed on the preparation you have. Kanamycin, oxolinic acid, Ormetoprim, and Sulfadimethoxine are the usual ingredients for both the Medi-gold (for smaller fish) and Medi-koi (for larger fish). In this situation, I would suggest giving the company a ring to confirm the situation. If there isn't a kanamycin component (if they've changed their product), then it can be used but we'd want to consider continuing the Maracyns as our alternative therapy if Kanamycin is not present. In regards to the eating, we do have to consider that if he is weak with his being poorly or if the dropsy is putting pressure on his guts, then we can see the appetite decline. In these cases, we do have to keep tempting them to eat (while making sure not to let food waste fester). And if he isn't eating much, then we do have to appreciate that he won't have much to pass as feces. And if there is progressing abdominal distension, we can see fecal frequency decrease as they need to work the feces through the fluid compressed gut. So, if he is struggling to eat (appreciably he is a small species of fish for the even the smaller gold pellets), then perhaps trying to half the pellets. And if he refuses them, then the water treatments need to be maintained as our alternative treatment approach. Overall, as you know, this is serious situation for him and it means an uphill battle for us. His signs are quite multi-factorial and advanced, but you are treating as much as you can as best as you can. The frayed fins are a step back, and the skin on his face sounds concerning (perhaps if you could photograph this so I can see what you are seeing there) but under the circumstances you are doing all that we can to try and fight all these issues plaguing him. Dr. B.
Hi, again. I haven't written because there is nothing new to report. The maracyn and aquarium salt and Lifeguard treatments are not working that I can tell. I am going to see if I can open a new ticket. I hope you can respond since you've already worked with me on him. I will send a picture with that question; it is a picture of his face. You can kind of see the holes in it, on the top right side of his face/head. I purchased Kanaplex and Focus and need your help with dosing it. =)