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Jared D
Jared D, ASE Certified Technician
Category: Nissan
Satisfied Customers: 1739
Experience:  Shop Supervisor at County Fleet
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I have a 2009 nissan versa. It would not start one day. It

Customer Question

I have a 2009 nissan versa. It would not start one day. It cranks over fine but will not run. Has new plugs in it. Have taken intake off and cranked engine over. Has fuel spraying from injectors. Has 170 psi of compression. Has no codes. Has 55 psi fuel pressure at pump. Put plugs in coil packs and cranked. Have spark firing at all cylinders. Really need help getting it running.
Submitted: 8 months ago.
Category: Nissan
Expert:  Jared D replied 8 months ago.

Hi,

Do you have a scan tool to check for communication with the computer?

Customer: replied 8 months ago.
but there is no codes stored. It's a snap on solus edge
Expert:  Jared D replied 8 months ago.

No codes, that's good, but it does seem to be communicating correctly?

Expert:  Jared D replied 8 months ago.

Can you see RPM data while the engine is cranking?

Customer: replied 8 months ago.
Expert:  Jared D replied 8 months ago.

Does the RPM signal seem steady or jumpy?

Customer: replied 8 months ago.
It is twitchy when it does move
Expert:  Jared D replied 8 months ago.

Might not be a bad idea to replace the cam position sensor. It's not a definite cause, but if the RPM signal isn't just right it won't provide a good injector pulse.

If you spray supplemental fuel in the intake will the engine start and run for a few seconds?

Customer: replied 8 months ago.
No. Just tried. I pulled intake though and injectors are spraying fuel in the head. I posted this too.
Expert:  Jared D replied 8 months ago.

Fuel, compression and spark and it doesn't run? That doesn't make a lot of sense.

Customer: replied 8 months ago.
That's why I'm here.
Expert:  Jared D replied 8 months ago.

I'm sorting through the Nissan tech database to see if anyone else has experienced something like this.

Expert:  Jared D replied 8 months ago.

It seems like you are getting good communication with the ECM right?

Here is what the tech line says to do to make sure the ECM isn't dropping out when cranking:

1. Backprobe and check for good battery voltage to the ECM on the Orange wire in terminal 93 with the key on. Key on battery voltage on terminal 93 tells the ECM to ground the ECM relay on the Pink wire in terminal 32.

2. Backprobe and check the ground for the ECM relay on the Pink wire in terminal 32 - look for 12 volts with the key off and look for less than 1.0 volts (usually about 0.8 volts) with the key on.

3. Backprobe and check the ECM grounds on the Black wires in terminals 10, 11, 108 - look for 0.05 volts or less

Customer: replied 8 months ago.
Wiring checks out ok.
Expert:  Jared D replied 8 months ago.

Let's try resetting everything. Maybe it's a PATS key issue and it's actually cutting the spark or injector pulse but doesn't seem like it.

Pull both battery cables and then touch them together for about 1 minute. This will draw down all of the power in the modules.

Then hook the battery back up and put the key in and turn it to on for 5 seconds, then off for 10 seconds then run for 5 seconds then off for 10 and then try to start it.

Customer: replied 8 months ago.
Still no go. It seems to almost catch if I floor the gas pedal but then just drops off and cranks.
Expert:  Jared D replied 8 months ago.

If it floor it, the computer shuts off the fuel injectors. It's a test mode that all newer vehicles have.

After cranking it a bit are you getting any codes?

Customer: replied 8 months ago.
Nope
Expert:  Jared D replied 8 months ago.

Does the pressure drop below 200 kPa (29 psi) 30 minutes after engine shutoff?

Customer: replied 8 months ago.
No it dropped a little bit but not much at all.
Expert:  Jared D replied 8 months ago.

Was it lower than 29psi?

Customer: replied 8 months ago.
No
Expert:  Jared D replied 8 months ago.

Ok. I don't know what is left to check. I can send your question back out to the group and see if anyone else has any insights, but it just doesn't make sense to have injector pulse, spark, compression, PCM communication, and crank and it still won't run. It has all it needs.

Customer: replied 8 months ago.
Is the cam sensor a common problem on these cars? What is happening when I floor the pedal vs not touching pedal at all?
Expert:  Jared D replied 8 months ago.

It's not really all that common for them to go bad. If they do they give the same symptoms you describe, but typically you can see the bad signal on your RPM data. I suppose it's possible that the scan tool could be not sensitive enough to pick up a fault.

Expert:  Jared D replied 8 months ago.

Please let me know if you need additional help. Don't forget to rate.

Customer: replied 8 months ago.
Any more ideas? Haven't tried a cam sensor yet. Any way to test it? Didn't really want to throw parts at it. Kinda why I came here.
Expert:  Jared D replied 8 months ago.

If you have a lab scope you can look for a good solid square wave signal from the sensor while cranking. If not, you can look for a steady RPM signal on your scan tool graphing function when cranking.

Other than these two methods there is really no other way to test it.

Customer: replied 8 months ago.
Scanner shows about 230 rpm when cranking. It sputters the first time you try and start it but then just cranks. Need a firm answer on this before I rate it. Dealer said it needed plugs and clean the throttle body. Waste of money there.
Expert:  Jared D replied 8 months ago.

Try pulling the fuel pump relay and then starting it on supplemental fuel sprayed down the intake. It's possible that the fuel pressure regulator is faulty and is dumping too much fuel, flooding the car. This would normally set trouble codes, but maybe the computer doesn't have a chance to pick it up since it won't actually start.

Also, when you have tried starting it with the pedal to the floor, while cranking, let off the pedal. Does it stumble and almost start?

Customer: replied 8 months ago.
Ok, I took the plugs out and they were wet. The top of the valves were also wet. Seems it is flooding out. I cleaned the plugs and put them back in and pulled the fuel pump fuse out and tried starting it with spraying starting fluid in it and it still would not start up. I put the fuse back in and checked fuel pressure. No pressure with key on but when you crank it it goes to 50 psi. I am letting sit again to see what it drops to. Please help me with this one.
Expert:  Jared D replied 8 months ago.

It's either flooding out or not getting any spark if the plugs are wet. I would say not getting spark since pulling the fuel pump fuse would stop it from flooding and likely start for at least a few seconds.

I think you might need to throw a cam sensor at it.