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Wayne Crawford
Wayne Crawford, Shop Owner
Category: Mitsubishi
Satisfied Customers: 1681
Experience:  General Repair Shop Owner
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I have a 2002 Mitsubishi Eclipse 3.0L automatic transmission. Transmission stuck in "

Customer Question

I have a 2002 Mitsubishi Eclipse 3.0L automatic transmission. Transmission stuck in "limp mode" (won't shift out of second), speedo doesn't work and gear position lights on the instrument cluster don't come on. OBD scanner shows a P0705 code which from what I've read online is a neutral safety switch.
Submitted: 2 years ago.
Category: Mitsubishi
Expert:  Wayne Crawford replied 2 years ago.
Let me get you some testing instructions. Give me a few minutes here. Thanks for your patience.
Customer: replied 2 years ago.
Thanks, XXXXX XXXXX waiting.
Expert:  Wayne Crawford replied 2 years ago.
Sorry I had three customers in a row come in and distract me. Anyway the first thing to do is check for power into the range sensor.

This is pretty simple testing here so I am not gonna post a diagram. If you need diagrams let me know and I will post them.
Wire Color ------------- Position
Black/Orange---------- Battery Voltage With Key On
Black/Blue --------------Park
Red/Blue ----------------Reverse
Brown---------------------Neutral
Yellow --------------------Drive
White ---------------------Third
Yellow/Blue -------------Second
Grey ----------------------Low

So check for power in on the black/orange wire. If you got it there check the other wires in the right position. Let me know the results of that and we can either come to a conclusion or do more testing to the pcm.
Customer: replied 2 years ago.
Ok, I can see where you are going with this. I will test the wires tomorrow and get back with you. Thanks.
Expert:  Wayne Crawford replied 2 years ago.
Yeah we need to start fresh as though you haven't changed anything. Just because a part is new does not mean it is good. Once we test the sensor if it tests good we will test the inputs at the PCM and if we find no problems with the wires then we will condemn the PCM. Let me know what you find out. Thanks
Customer: replied 2 years ago.
I checked the power wire (black/orange but looks more like red) for power and I'm getting voltage (12v). should I be getting 12v on the other wires once I place the shifter in the right position?
Expert:  Wayne Crawford replied 2 years ago.
Yes. In park you should have battery voltage on black/blue etc etc.
Expert:  Wayne Crawford replied 2 years ago.
HI, I am going through my questions for the month getting everything close out and noticed you have not rated my response yet and wanted to see if there was anything else I can help out with. Please let me know.
Thanks
Customer: replied 2 years ago.
Not so fast! I can't seem to get any voltages out of the other wires, even after I readjusted the switch several times. I used an allen wrench to align the transmission with the switch so I'm positive that the switch is adjusted right. Does this mean it's a bad switch?
Expert:  Wayne Crawford replied 2 years ago.
Yes. If you have power IN to the switch on the black/orange wire you should have power out of the switch as follows

Black/Blue --------------Park
Red/Blue ----------------Reverse
Brown---------------------Neutral
Yellow --------------------Drive
White ---------------------Third
Yellow/Blue -------------Second
Grey ----------------------Low

If you do not you got a bad switch.
Customer: replied 2 years ago.

I tested the old switch and I think they are doing the same thing. first I tested the power orange/black wire with the connector disconnected. I get 12v. Then I reconnected the switch. As soon as I did that, the 12v in the orange/black wire disappears and I don't get voltage in brown wire (which was in neutral when I tested it) If I readjust the switch so that it's out of adjustment, the voltage comes back in the power wire. However, the car won't start. Both switches seem to be doing something because if it's too far out of alignment, the car won't start.

I will return the old switch to AutoZone and hopefully they will replace it with a new one. I tried ohming out the switch and it does appear to be shorted.
Expert:  Wayne Crawford replied 2 years ago.
Ahh.. now thats a different story. You DON'T have power on the orange/black wire with it hooked up.

Check the continuity from each wire to ground and report back with it if you could. Thanks
Customer: replied 2 years ago.
Ok, ohmed out the wires...black/blue wire has 15ohms, red/blue 1.3ohms, brown appears to be good, yellow 1.3 ohms. I'm assuming there's some kind of short in the 3 wires.
Customer: replied 2 years ago.
Oh and that was with the connector connected to the switch. Should I test it with it disconnected?
Expert:  Wayne Crawford replied 2 years ago.
You only gave me four wires.. there should be 7.
And yes try them without it plugged in too.
Customer: replied 2 years ago.
There's no other wires except an small orange/black wire which doesn't have voltage. The "power" wire - now that I've had a good look at it - does appear to be black and red, not black and orange. it's thicker than the rest of the wires. I checked all the wires again, this time with the connector removed with the same results. Are you sure you have the right wiring diagram? None of the other wires match the colors you mentioned and it doesn't look like any one has done any modifications to it.
Customer: replied 2 years ago.
Do you have diagram of this connector? That way I can be sure I'm testing the right wires.
Expert:  Wayne Crawford replied 2 years ago.
Yeah let me look at diagrams and see if I got the right one. Ill be back in a few.
Customer: replied 2 years ago.
Just to verify - It's a Mitsubishi Eclipse Spyder GT 3.0L 24V automatic transmission
Customer: replied 2 years ago.
I can send you some pictures if it will help you find the right diagrams
Expert:  Wayne Crawford replied 2 years ago.
I don't even see this as a valid code for your car. Now I am wondering where I got the diagram the first time. I'm looking through stuff right now. I will get back to you when I figure out what is going on here
Nevermind I got it. I went in through manufacturer specific codes.
Yeah please send me a picture. I am showing a different connector than you have obviously.
Expert:  Wayne Crawford replied 2 years ago.
OK I got it. Sorry. You have the sport mode.. I was looking at the one without the sport mode. I dont need a picture anymore.
Expert:  Wayne Crawford replied 2 years ago.

We are gonna have to start over to avoid any confusion.
Here is your testing. Still the same basic concept
Set your meter to 200 Ohms Let me know what you get between the Black/Orange and the other pins with the shifter at the correct spot.
Do this both plugged in AND unplugged for each wire.
Black/Blue - Park
Red/Blue - Reverse
Brown - Neutral
Yellow - Drive

Get back to me with these both ways.
Customer: replied 2 years ago.
Before we get started, I've got some questions first. I did send you some pictures of the connector. Besides the wires you mentioned, there's 2 red/black wires - a little thicker than the others along with a orange and black wire. power seems to be going thru one of the red/black wires (have it circled in the picture) What should I do with these wires? Do you know what they are for?
Customer: replied 2 years ago.
I checked the wires again, THIS time I used the orange/black wire AS the power wire. It seems to make sense now. First, I ohmed out the switch itself and every thing seemed to be working fine. Then I tested the connector while it was disconnected - nothing - no obvious shorts. Next, I ohmed out the wires while it was connected and then things started getting interesting - When I selected each drive, the wire for that drive only had 0-1 ohms while the other wires had 18-20, exception being the yellow wire which was good. Still would be nice to know what the two red/black wires are. One of them is supplying power to something.
Customer: replied 2 years ago.
Ok, I have 3 pictures of the connector and one of the safety switch. After
looking at the wires, I have one yellow, one blue/black, one brown, one
red/blue, one red/orange, and 2 red/black which seem to be slightly larger
than the rest of the wires. The red/black wire that seems to be providing
power - I circled it in one of the pictures.
Expert:  Wayne Crawford replied 2 years ago.
Does your transmission have the sport mode or no?
Customer: replied 2 years ago.
I'm not sure. You can shift it manually when you are in drive by moving the shifter over to the right. There's lights in the dash that tell you what gear you are in. None of this works of course, it won't come out of second. I did manage to get the part number off the ECU which is MR578377. I also tested the wires with the ECU disconnected and got the ground so I'm assuming at this point that the wires are shorted somewhere from the connector to the ECU. Do these wires go directly to the ECU? If so, even if I can't find the short it may be possible to hook up some bypass wires.
Expert:  Wayne Crawford replied 2 years ago.
Well our next step was to test the ECU. Yes it can be grounded between the ECU and the connector OR it can be grounded INSIDE the ECU. This next test will tell us and at that point you could just bypass it if you dont want to trace it if its a wire. If its the ECU then you will need a new ECU.

OK here is a diagram of the ECU connector C61

Unhook the connector and check the red wires for continuity to ground. If they are shorted to ground you have a wiring issue. If not you have an ECU shorted internally.
Customer: replied 2 years ago.
Ok, that's the answer I wanted to hear. I did check the wires with the ECU and the switch disconnected so I know the ground is coming from somewhere other than the ECU. There are 4 different connectors to the ECU, which one is c61? Are the wires color coded the same as on the switch? If not, do you know what the color codes are?
Expert:  Wayne Crawford replied 2 years ago.
The colors are the same. You also have whats called a combination meter that could be causing the short. That is part of the sport shifting (where you "manually" shift it). You may want to unhook that too before you jump the gun and just start running wires. Its up to you. Right now I am shooting blind as you are convinced it isn't the ecu and wont test. Let me know what you want/need and I will provide it.
Here is the plug on the ECU. The wires I circled in red before are the ones in question and should match the wires at the neutral switch.
Customer: replied 2 years ago.
I'm not going to bypass anything unless I have no other choice. I will disconnect the shifter and shoot the wires again. Is there any other connectors/problem areas I should be checking for that might cause the shorts? I won't be able to check anything today but tomorrow I should have time
Expert:  Wayne Crawford replied 2 years ago.
With all three unhooked you need to retest the four bad ones at the neutral switch for a short to ground. If its still showing shorted to ground then check between all of the wires for continuity. Then try wiggling wires around and see if you can get it to change.
Customer: replied 1 year ago.
I've been busy working on the car and have a lot more information to tell you. I disconnected the reverse, neutral, and park wires (drive is good) but they still have a short somewhere to ground and it's not coming from the ECU or the switch. I also determined there wasn't any power going to the black and orange. I had another wire black and red wire that I was getting power from and had mistaken it for the orange and black. I also tried to bypass wires from the switch directly to the ECU and apply power to the orange and black wire. When I did this some interesting things happened. First, a motor inside the transmission started running. I'm assuming that this what was locking the transmission in second. When I drove the car, it actually started off in first and started shifting. I thought my problems were over but when I came up with a more permanent fix, the car decided not to start on me. After looking at my scanner, I came up with a p01610. My fix somehow activated the immobilizer. I went and reconnected all of the original wiring and thankfully it started up again. So I kind of know what the solution is but there has to be some kind of component between the switch and the ecu. I guess the first problem I be looking at is the orange and black power wire. Why is there no power getting to it? Then I need to figure out what other components are connected to the switch. I'm hoping the problem area will be this component and I won't have to check every inch of this wiring harness.
Expert:  Wayne Crawford replied 1 year ago.
Im gonna opt out and let another expert handle this one.
Customer: replied 1 year ago.
Ok well I've been waiting for the next expert but so far no one has responded. I think the key to this problem is finding out where the wires go from the switch because it's not the ECU. I need complete wiring diagrams so I can see the big picture
Expert:  Wayne Crawford replied 1 year ago.
Unfortunately for me the key to finding it is to have FULL and ACCURATE information. The only way I would be able to help is to completely start over and have you give me readings. I have been going this whole time thinking there was power on a wire there wasn't power on.

If you would like to start over and give me full and accurate information I will carry on. Just let me know. Thanks
Customer: replied 1 year ago.
Sometimes the wires are not always easy to identify because of poor lighting, grease, etc.But let's be honest, you were not looking at the right wiring diagram from the start, so how can I give you accurate information if the information you are sending me is wrong? I sent you pictures of the connector, told you that I already shot the wires and the readings I was getting from them. What else do you want me to do?

For your information, I checked the fuse box and found a missing fuse that keeping power from going to the switch. When I replaced it, the drive lights (PRND) started working in the instrument cluster, and it did appear to be shifting and the speedo is working as well. Now when it gets up to 3rd gear, it lock itself in 2nd (safe mode), the 'N' flashes and I get a p0715 code. From what I read it's a input speed sensor. That's were I am right now with this problem. The P0705 does not show up on the reader, so I'm assuming that the power issue was the cause of this fault.

I need someone that will help me with this problem. I've done all that I can do to provide you with the most accurate information. I am not a expert, I don't work in a garage full time, so perhaps my technical abilities are not up to your standards . Lately, I feel that I had to rely on my own experience to fix this car because you seemed to be getting hung up on the information I'm sending you. Maybe it's best to refer me to another expert.
Expert:  Wayne Crawford replied 1 year ago.
We would have had this solved before with the information that there was no power. When you check power and it is there there is no need to check fuses.

I dont want to argue with you I want to help you and I can help as long as you can do EXACTLY as I ask and if something isn't right ask instead of veering off track.
I gave you testing info and you told me you had power on the orange wire even though it looked red. I should have looked further in to it.

Anyway thats behind us.. now we are working on p0705.
Forget everything in this post and lets move on.

First turn your meter to 2 ohms or audible if you have it.
Test each and every fuse one the fuse panels. There should be two little holes in the top of the fuse that you can touch your test leads to. If any of them show a high resistance replace it. If not lets move on. I will be back with the testing information in a moment.
(this is only for the normal fuses. The bigger ones (fusible links) you should be able to see if they are blown.)
Sorry we are working on 715 now not 705.
Expert:  Wayne Crawford replied 1 year ago.
OK here is mistubishis code description so you have an idea of what is going on. I will be posting again in a few minutes with testing instructions (theirs is mostly done through a scan tool and lab scope. I will help you test it with a multimeter.)


P0715 input/turbine speed sensor CIRCUIT
A/T DTC No.22 (Input shaft speed sensor system: Short circuit/Open circuit)

CIRCUIT OPERATION

A coil built into the input shaft speed sensor generates 0-5 volts PULSE signal at both ends of this coil when the input shaft rotates. The pulse signal frequency increases with a rise in input shaft speed.

Both ends of the coil are connected to the PCM (terminals 16 and 103) via the input shaft speed sensor connector (terminals 1 and 2).

The PCM detects the input shaft speed by the signal input to terminal 103.

The input shaft speed sensor generates the pulse signal as the teeth of the underdrive clutch retainer pass the magentic tip of the sensor.

DTC SET CONDITIONS
If no output pulse is detected from the input shaft speed sensor for one second or more while driving in 3rd or 4th gear at a speed of 19MPH or more it is judged to be an open circuit or short circuit in the input shaft speed sensor circuit. If diagnostic code 22 is output 4 times the transaxle is locked into 3rd gear or 2nd gear as a fail safe measure and the N range light flashes once per second.

TROUBLESHOOTING HINTS (the most likely causes for this code to be set)
Malfunction of the Input speed sensor circuit.
Malfunction of the underdrive clutch retainer.
Damaged harness or connector
Malfunction of the PCM

DIAGNOSIS
Mostly stuff to be done with a scan tool and lab scope which we do not have.
Expert:  Wayne Crawford replied 1 year ago.
Just letting you know I have not forgot you. I am still working on it.. had a couple of customers and a parts guy come in and distract me for a while so I am running slow. I am getting it though.

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