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Phil
Phil, Mechanical Engineer
Category: HVAC
Satisfied Customers: 5489
Experience:  Retired HVAC/ Electrical & Boiler contractor. Industrial
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High ref pressure message. I had the freon filled to required

Resolved Question:

High ref pressure message. I had the freon filled to required 6lbs after repairing a leak in the system now it shuts off after a minute of running each time it recycles with the "high ref pressure" message. I made sure baskets, etc. clean. Thanks!
Submitted: 9 months ago.
Category: HVAC
Expert:  Phil replied 9 months ago.
Welcome to Just Answer!


You are basically on the right track, however there are some other issues we need to be sure of.
Did you use a vacuum pump after fixing the leak? what did the high side and low side gages read when it was evacuated.

What refrigerant is involved... did you liquid charge or vapor charge the system

Tell me if this is an AC unit, or water chiller. and the brand and model number of the unit.

We can go from there.

Phil
Customer: replied 9 months ago.

This is a Jandy pool heat pump. model EE-2500T


410a refrigerant. The HVAC guy after welding the leak holes did a vacuum test to ensure no leaks then filled to the required 6 lb pressure.

Expert:  Phil replied 9 months ago.
Hello again,

From here it sounds like the HVAC guy over charged the system. If he told you that the vacuum was for a leak test, then thats not how its done. He may have left air inside the system, if he did, that would run the head pressure up, and if not corrected will damage the system.

CLICK HERE
for the specification sheet that shows the refrigerant charge as 100 ounces. If the man put 6 pounds of refrigerant into the system he would be *undercharged very slightly.

Here is the URL address in case the link above doesn't work
http://www.zodiacpoolsystems.com/~/media/Zodiac/Global/Downloads/SA/SA6407.ashx

I suspect air in the system (called a non condensible) or that he put more than 6 pounds of refrigerant in the system, or made some other charging error.

I would try removing a few ounces of refrigerant until the system runs. You may want to locate a more competent service man. If you need help doing that, tell me which direction you are from the center of the nearest city and I will take a look for you.


Phil


Customer: replied 9 months ago.

Thanks. He did the vacuum test and watched the gauge for about 5 mins to see if it moved. When he was satisfied he filled it. He also weighed his tank to show he injected 6lbs. At $50 a lb it was pretty pricy.


 


I have the guy coming back on Monday and will do just that. The closest bigger cities are: Springfield (1.5 hrs) Tulsa (2hrs), Little Rock (3 hrs), Kansas City (4 hrs) Unfortunately there is no one in this town (zip 72712, Northwest Arkansas), that specializes in heat pumps. The pool companies technicians will not touch these units much less refrigerants, etc. and the HVAC guys only know to do what they do with home HVAC units.

Expert:  Phil replied 9 months ago.
Hello again, thank you *very much for that detailed account.

The refrigerant is worth less than $30 a pound retail... a person cannot do a valid leak check on a refrigeration system by pulling a vacuum on it and waiting for the pressure to rise (for many reasons)... a person cannot detect the usual small leak that way in 5 minutes, it would take months. Leaks are detected by pressurizing the system and applying soap bubble leak detector solution to the suspect areas.

The man was using a plumbing technique used to find different sorts of leaks... he was out of his league... from that I am assuming he made other mistakes, such as using a bathroom type scale to weigh the refrigerant in (not at all accurate enough)... and not doing a proper evacuation, that left air in the system.

I will stay with you on this as long as needed...

Tell me if this man was running his own operation or came from a larger company from that I can help you determine what to do.

Phil
Customer: replied 9 months ago.

Thanks, XXXXX XXXXX removed a few ounces of ref. yesterday morning and it apparently worked. The unit is running uninterrupted even now, for now. The man is from a larger, but small company. He does have many years of large commercial experience.


 


So what is the best way to measure refrigerant going in? He did use a scale. And how should he have done a proper evacuation? ( I understand about the soap bubble test).


 


I found a local large pool company that services Jandy heat pumps. However they can't handle the refrigerant side of it. No way to win here! what's a person to do in my situation where I'll always need two experts?

Expert:  Phil replied 9 months ago.
Hello again, the best way to measure the refrigerant charge is by the refrigeration service gage readings...IN CONJUCTION WITH the indoor and out door air temperatures to within 1 degreeF... in other words it is very precise way of doing things. That will get you to within 2% of a workable refrigerant charge on 85 or 90% of systems on the market. The other 10% of systems require what we call 'super heat and sub cooling" temperature measurements... those are made using a saturated temperature and pressure chart, a a very accurate electronic thermometer.

Its both an art and a skill.

___________

Over charging a system by just a few ounces can almost double the cost of running the unit... but it will still cool.

If you wish to rate my work positively so far, so that i get paid by the company, I will go beyond your original question and coach you how your system should be charged.

I need the rating... then i need the brand name and model number of the outside unit, and what refrigerant it uses... that is stated on the units name plate.

If it is a Chinese made unit with multiple wall units attached, its more difficult.. if its on of the more standard type ducted systems I can get you good information no how to charge it properly.

Let me know, we can go from there.

Phil
Phil, Mechanical Engineer
Category: HVAC
Satisfied Customers: 5489
Experience: Retired HVAC/ Electrical & Boiler contractor. Industrial
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