All work to be done by licensed professional. WE KEEP GOING UNTIL YOU ARE HAPPY . . . I come and go, be patient.
is this the furnace you have? are you operating in heating or cooling mode?
we can go from there
no thats not my furnace, cooling mode
I have model number: C33-36B-2F-4
That pdf appeared to be for some G model
plus it crashed my browser
In cooling mode water leaks are always with no exceptions from the cooling coil drain pan sitting on top of the furnace
they clog with slime and mold.
yeah I figured that
its $250 or so have it cleaned
Let me know if you want to clean it yourself.
nothing I can do then?
I would love to
Find there the white plastic drain line attaches above the furnace. the 2 copper tubes for cooling attach just above it.
thats the cooling coil cabinet
remove the insulation.
remove the 14 screws that hold the 20 x 20" cover in place
remove the cover
observe the drain pan, and drain... clean it up
pour a few cups of warm water down the drain to blow any debris out of the trap
Sounds like this would require some insulation/heat tape to fix what I am undoing
Yes, a bit of duct insulation wrap and duct tape you can by at a big box home repair type store... or just the duct tape to put the existing insulation back on
if that trap is clogged then how is water getting down to the black box on the right side of the furnace under the exhaust vents (the hole labeled drain with a rubber cap on it)
seems like if it got that far, then it would just drain through the pipe that runs into the concrete slab
Hello again... that is a very good question... the exhaust vent with the rubber cap only has water in it when the furnace is in heating mode. Since the furnace is in cooling mode the only way water can get into the exhaust vent is by leaking into the burner box or through the power vent fan etc...
which you are suggesting is happening because of the trap being clogged?
those are sealed components. water from above should have no pathway to the inside of the vent as you are reporting except though a cracked heat exchanger or some such.
and that is a dangerous situation, carbon monoxide leaking is an issue and that needs to be tested by a licensed and qualified Lennox furnace specialist.
I'm not running the furnace though
the clogged trap, allowed the evaporator coil drain pan to over flow
onto the furnace heat exchanger. and other furnace parts
You are running the cooling only of course, but that drain pan leaks onto the furnace heating element, heat exchanger
that is apparently cracked, or with some other defect... allowing water inside
and into the vent trap
This definitely needs an onsite inspection.. odds are in the 70% range that a dangerous condition exists that can put carbon monoxide into the home'
I opened the cabinet
tray looks pretty clean
I poured water into the tray, it drains as expected
Coils look very clean no slime or build up
drain pipe is not clogged
Inside the A coil, is the inlet face of the coil, it collects dirt and hair etc over time and can create a water drip bridge around the drain pan, so that water drips past the drain pan onot the top of the furnace heat exchanger.
to access that area. remove a 6" square panel that is screwed into place where the cross bar is on a capitol A.
update: I removed the black cap from the drain box
use a flash light you will see the inlet side of the coil. and can clean it using a coil cleaning kit, that includes a 'green fin comb'... big hardware stores carry the kit
I poured water in the drip tray
the water flowed right back out of the drain box
sounds to me like the drain pipe that runs into my concrete slab might be blocked up near where it enters the slab
I cant see it from here of course, but it sounds like the 'drain box' is actually a box with a pump in it. that pumps the condensate from the boiler and the condensate from the cooling coil outside.
is there any way i can upload a pic
You should see upload instructions on the dialog box you are in
the black box i shown here
in this pic the plastic cap is on
you can also see how the drain pipe turns before entering the slab
the clear u trap is also clean
see what i mean?
Thanks, great pic
Thats a totally unusual condensate trap arrangement... its functional though.
See what i mean about the drain pipe and the slab
I think the clog is there at the bend before the floor
logically if I pour water in the tray, and the clog is at the bend near the floor, then the water would back up into the black box
I have absolutely no idea what the black box is. .. and the condensate going into a hole in the slab is not legal, it could be a problem for your foundation/ slab if the soil under the slab doesnt drain well
not legal in a specific state or nationally?
I ask because I had a home inspector look at this house before I bought it
you can but a 3/4" pvc 'repair coupling' cut the pipe, clean the clog and then fit the coupling
if the soil doesnt drain well you could have water backed up as a result of that as well
so what i was saying probably makes more sense to you now
because of the picture
Its not legal according to the US building codes, some rural unincorporated areas do not have code enforcement. Some inspectors could miss that as well
Yes the picture helps, but I have no idea what the black box is
it would not need to have a pump in it, I dont see a pump either, and I cant see what function the black box might have from here
there are two rubber tubes that come away from the area
near the blower motor
that run into the black box
not shown in the picture
can you access the inside of the box and tell me what you see... the entire job is quite unusual. the condensate trap and the pipe into the slab. that black box makes no sense either
the box appears to be one unit, no hardware to remove to see the inside
we are looking at a home built system by someone who has done that type of work before and just dreamed it up,
let me grab another picture quick
home is less than 3 yrs old
built by a building company
its a townhouse
its a loopy condensate design the drain into the slab is illegal
but an easy fix. just run the condensate outside. if you can find a gravity flow route
if not cut the pipe and put a condensate sump and pump assembly in
then you can pump it to a drain/ it cannot be hard connected at the drain. there has to be an air gap.
two more pics of rubber hoses running to black box
you can see the black box at the right in the second pic
blower motor is by my thumb
rubber hoses probably go to the furnace condensate trap, its a high efficiency condensing furnace. the black box is probably not necessary. the furnace condensate can be piped to any drain
My floor has a drain in it
white pvc drain cap with holes in it
can it drain through there, dont know what else the drain is for
floor slopes somewhat towards the drain
If there is a floor drain there, the condensate pipe has to terminate one inch above the drain so that there is an air gap, that is to preclude sucking sewer gasses onto the ac system.
System should work but it was not installed by anyone with training, these need to be properly set up, I recommend you call a Lennox dealer to do a service call on it..
notice the pipe dope on the gas pipe union?
unfortunately it was installed by a lennox dealer
there is suppose to be none on the piece in the middle of the union
no pipe dope on the middle of the union
pipe dope only goes on the pipe threads on each end.... not in the middle. that gets into the gas flow and can cause problems with your gas valve... its the sign of a person with no clue about the trade
the picture showed what appeared to be pipe dope
which pic? 1, 2, or 3
2 I think
yeah i see what you mean
the black box came with that model furnace.
I also think that there was no need to bend the drain pipe right before the floor other than the fact that the installer did not line it up correctly
however, apparently is shouldnt be done that way at all
its a bad install
but easily fixed
I can't easily run the drain pipe outside, but I could run it to the drain in the floor
find out which lennox dealer installed it, and call a different one
any idea why the black box came with the furnace?
just to collect the condensate and equalize the pressure between the condensate trap and the condensing chamber, its not common with other condensing furnaces, Lennox is known for its unique approaches
I looked at my home inspection report and the report merely says that the condensate line is installed
here is the pic he took during the walkthrough
you can see the drain in the floor
you can see that the trap is different too
gasp..... give me a moment to recover...
somebody came when it was under warranty and fixed a freon leak, noticed that the trap couldn't be cleaned and installed one that could be cleaned
the second photo lists the inspectors remarks... the term ludicrously incompetent comes to mind
what makes you think that, obviously I wouldn't know
the top photo seems to show a floor drain about 12 inches away from there the 3/4 plastic appears to be going into the floor... are you sure it goes into the floor? maybe its just sitting there
tell me what business you are in and i will give you a parady
I thought that too and I checked
it definitely is concreted into the floor
can't be moved at all
I'm in electrical engineering
ok here is a parody of a bogus electrical inspection
" wires are red and some green, with a black one... be sure you check these once a year to be sure they are not faded, or that the wire is still in the metal casing tube."
hahah, okay I see what you mean
"once a year wipe off the wires with an oily rag to prevent rust"
I feel like a dumbass
for hiring this guy
The inspector advised oiling the electric motors with engine oil... wrong stuff.. you need electric motor oil or turbine oil
you are not the man with the problem
you have no way of knowing ahead of time
true, but utimately I am left to deal with incompetence of these men
you find these things out later
its getting worse by the micro second
lucky for you this is all an easy fix
what is the fix?
but have a good lennox dealer to a proper start up on it
just to run to that drain in the floor
run the condensate to the drain, with a one inch air gap
have a good lennox dealer fo a proper start up on it.. it takes special instruments
flue gas analysis etc
I don't want to have the lennox dealer do everything I just did, and end up with the same solution for $$$ reasons
so its a safety thing
you can do the condensate drain fix yourself
yes, for sure
to be doubly safe I would put a trap at the end of the condensate as well just before the drain
to catch anything that might clog my floor drain?
trap is so air cannot be sucked back into the system, and to prevent any combustion gasses from escaping past the black box. its over kill but I cant be sure the black box was installed correctly and do not want to take the chance... another reason for the Lennox dealer inspection
You could wait until the lennox dealer arrives on the added trap.. I tend to be over cautious, and am probably being over cautious here.
I'm going to schedule an appointment tomorrow morning and see when they can come out
I have no way of knowing which dealer installed the unit
I bought the house after it was built
stay in touch as you need to, Phil