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jazzmaster
jazzmaster, ASE Certified Tech
Category: Ford
Satisfied Customers: 2951
Experience:  ase certified--32 yrs experience
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1987 f150 300inline6: no engine start

Customer Question

1987 f150 300inline 4x4 with no fuel pump sound at ignition on, engine turns but does not start. ECC changed.

Submitted: 1 year ago.
Category: Ford
Expert:  jazzmaster replied 1 year ago.
hi, did you check at the connector at the fuel tank to see if you have voltage going to the fuel pump ?
also, try tapping lightly on the tank while someone tries to start it .
this is a quick test .
this will tell you if the fuel pump is bad ,as it may start once more time ..
Customer: replied 1 year ago.
I can put 12volts on the fuel pump relay, and I here a whine until power removed. I have 12 volts one side of the fuel pump contact and 9.3 volts of the other.(EEC side)
Expert:  jazzmaster replied 1 year ago.
you have a power relay as well, this supplies voltage to the coil /injectors .check to see if the connector and connections are clean .also you should hear that eec relay click when you first turn on the key to run .
it the meantime I will look at the wiring schematics ,so I have them to further help you ..jazzmaster ..
have you checked for injector pulse with a noid light ?
Customer: replied 1 year ago.
ECC relay closes upon key on. ECC relay shows .03 ohms across contacts with 12v to ground on both contact points
Expert:  jazzmaster replied 1 year ago.
ok, what we are going to check is voltages rather than ohms .
have you checked for spark as well as injector pulse ?
Customer: replied 1 year ago.
Where is the spark pulse checked?
Expert:  jazzmaster replied 1 year ago.
you check for spark from the coil to the dist cap .then if that shows good you check for spark to the spark plugs -either at the dist cap or at the spark plugs.
at the fuel pump relay the red wire should show hot with the key on
the yellow wire will show hot at all times
the tan/lt green is the ground from the ecc ,that will show ground while cranking and in the run position for 2-3 seconds each time you turn the key to run from off.
the brown wire go for the fuel pump via the inertia switch.
Customer: replied 1 year ago.
The tan/green wire shoes 9.3 volts , the brown shows 12 volts. Both conditions show upon key start. The tan/green wire never goes to zero volts
Expert:  jazzmaster replied 1 year ago.
does that show ground on the tan/lt gr wire when you first turn the key on for 2-3 seconds and then while cranking the motor over ?
Customer: replied 1 year ago.
The tan/ green wire never goes to zero volts
Expert:  jazzmaster replied 1 year ago.
if you put a ground to that wire the pump should run then see if the truck starts .
that ground comes from the ecc .
have you checked for spark and injector pulse yet ?
Customer: replied 1 year ago.
Since this hole is getting on my end... I'll start form the beginning. The alternator only had a 10.5 volt output. I had it verified at autozone and picked up a new alternator. While changing the alternator, I put a charger on the battery. I did not remove the battery cables, doh!, once the alternator was installed I tried to start the truck. No go. Only starter cranking no turnover except for the very first try. The engine caught once and never again. After much groaning and nashing of teeth, I changed the ECC. That situation is where I am now.....sorry for the delay the boss said to come to dinner.
Where do I check for spark, pull a plug and crank it?
Expert:  jazzmaster replied 1 year ago.
ok,
did you short the hot from the hot to the motor ?
you check for spark from the coil to the dist cap .then if that shows good you check for spark to the spark plugs -either at the dist cap or at the spark plugs
The wire can be pulled of a spark plug and use a plastic handled screw driver place the metal end into the spark plug wire and then place the handle of the screw driver on the motor and position the screw driver so none of the metal part touches and other metal thing .then crank the motor .
did you check the distributor rotor to see if it is turning ?
Customer: replied 1 year ago.
I pulled the number 2 spark plug, darkened the garage grounded the there ads of the spark plug, and could see a spark. The engine tried to hit like it had just enough fuel to fire once. I have manually started the fuel pump during my troubleshooting today.
Expert:  jazzmaster replied 1 year ago.
so you are not getting a ground signal on that tan/lt green wire at the fuel pump when you turn the key to run for 2-3 seconds ..
also, I need to know if you have injector pulse/pulsating ground when cranking the motor over .
or you can use a mechanics stethoscope to listen to an injector .
it should click when you turn the key on .
I need to know if there are other things besides that ground signal to the fuel pump relay that are . missing...jazzmaster ..
Customer: replied 1 year ago.
Just a question, with the engine trying to turn over after manually starting the fuel pump, does that reaction let you know the injectors are firing?
Expert:  jazzmaster replied 1 year ago.
it could tell me something else is wrong .
we still need to see that about the injectors for two reasons .
first,to see if that is another problem
second" to rule out the injectors being a problem and if they are there are different paths to take to help you ..jazzmaster ..
Customer: replied 1 year ago.
I'll check that tomorrow, it is getting late, how do we continue this tomorrow or at a later time?
Expert:  jazzmaster replied 1 year ago.
tomorrow is fine .
just keep this post/e-mail and we can continue on with this ,,thank you ..jazzmaster ..
Customer: replied 1 year ago.
Good afternoon, please tell me how to check for injector pluse
Customer: replied 1 year ago.
Good afternoon, how do I check the injector pulses
Expert:  jazzmaster replied 1 year ago.
hello,
to check the injector pulse you can use a noid light (this is a tool for checking injector pulse) it plugs into the connector at the injector.
when you first turn the key on it should blink once and while cranking the motor the light should blink on and off .
You can also use a test light -
the red wire at each injector will show bat hot when you turn the key on.
the other wire at each injector connector is a ground .this should show a ground pulse when you crank the motor over .
Since you are not getting that ground signal from the ecm ,I suspect a few things here but we need to see if the injector pulse is there .
Customer: replied 1 year ago.
I put an oscope on the number 6 injector plug, unplugged from the injector, upon key on there is 12 v on the red wire, upon cranking the striped wire does one pulse negative and the it appears to be noise. Maybe the timing for the scope is to slow.
Expert:  jazzmaster replied 1 year ago.

what kind of scope

Customer: replied 1 year ago.
Fluke 199 digital storage oscilloscope
Expert:  jazzmaster replied 1 year ago.
can you get the ignition control module checked at an auto parts store ,I need to know if it is good ..jazzmaster ..
Expert:  jazzmaster replied 1 year ago.
also, check at the ecm with the key on there should be bat voltage at # ***** # ***** and 57
#1-yellow wire
#37 and 57 -red wires
Expert:  jazzmaster replied 1 year ago.
hi, did I help you .if I did please rate me positive .
If you still need help ,please , dont rate me and we can get back to the issue at hand thank you ...jazzmaster ..
Expert:  jazzmaster replied 1 year ago.
if I helped you please rate me positive ,if you need more help dont rate and please get back to me ...jazzmaster ..

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