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FORDFXR
FORDFXR, Ford Mechanic
Category: Ford
Satisfied Customers: 257
Experience:  FORD MASTER TECHNICIAN ALBERTA JOURNEYMAN INTERPROVICIAL STANDARD
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1997 Ford Explorer XLT 5L, auto headlights do not come ...

Customer Reply

Customer: replied 6 years ago.
1997 Ford Explorer XLT 5L, auto headlights do not come on anymore,green led in mirror to indicate auto headlights does work as well as headlight off delay control in terms of how long until the mirror green led stays on. Also, when locking vehicle with remote or pressing panic button, headlidghts do not flash. Headlights do work manually with dash switch. Is there a relay or something somewhere I can check?
Expert:  FORDFXR replied 6 years ago.

hi

check the following fuses,

power distribution box #4, #8

interior fuse panel #3, #4, #8, #9, #11, #23

let me know if this helped and if yo need more info

please send feedback so we can serve you better

Louis

 

Customer: replied 6 years ago.
I will try this afternoon. But I have check all the fuses in the past.
Expert:  FORDFXR replied 6 years ago.

ok

 

Customer: replied 6 years ago.
Reply to FORDFXR's Post: All the fuses are good. As I previously posted, I had checked those, both visually and then again today with an ohm meter. All are good.

The Headlights work with the dash control, the auto system appears to be working, but wht headlights will not go on.

The commonality with this failure is headlights do not come on with auto feature and that they no longer flash when the remote is used to lock the doors or the panic is pushed. Horn actuates, but the headlights no longer come on with the horn.

I am thinking there is a relay that is in parallel with the headlight swtich that has failed, but I have swapped every relay, both under the dash as well as in the under hood distribution box.
Expert:  FORDFXR replied 6 years ago.

hi

the connector to the mirror has 6 cavities and only 5 wires, unplug it and test for the following

- pin 2 cir 218 w/p - this is the ground signal to the headlamps, if you ground this wire the headlamps should come on

-pin 3 cir 140 bk/pk this goes to your automatic day/night mirrors

-pin 4 cir 57 bk this is ground, use a test light and go from here to power to check for good ground

-pin 5 cir 54 lg/y this is fed by fuse 9 and should have power all the time

pin 6 cir 640 r/y this is fed by fuse 11 and should have power when the key is in the run position

if all these check out, you will need to replace the sensor

let me know if this helped and if you need more info

please send feedback so we can serve you better

Louis

Customer: replied 6 years ago.
OK, will check this on Monday. My wife is waiting for me as we are late to her sister's B-day party.

By sensor, do you mean the electronics in the mirror? Or do you mean the the photo sensor?

I actually think I ran the routine you are suggesting from a web post 1.5 years ago as the failure happend about 2 years ago and I spent some time then checking it out.

Also, this does not account for the headlights also no longer coming on when the remote is used to lock the doors or panic is pressed. This all happened at the same time which is why I think there is an issue somewhere other than where you suggest. But I will check

More to come on Monday.
Expert:  FORDFXR replied 6 years ago.
ok
Customer: replied 6 years ago.
Grounding pin 2 does not turn the headlights on.

The others all check out per your email.
Expert:  FORDFXR replied 6 years ago.

hi

how was the party or should is say "wasn't that a party?!?!?"

did the park lamps come on when you grounded pin 2?

double check fuse 3 at interior fuse panel, fuse 8 at power distribution box

check for battery v at pin 2 at mirror/autolamp sensor

test the headlamp relay in the relay module

let me know if this helped and if you need more info

please send feedback so we can serve you better,positive feedback is always appreciated

Louis

 

 

Customer: replied 6 years ago.
Will do later today.

Where is the headlight relay? I do not believe it is in the power dist box, right. I recall there are three or so under the dash, is one of those the headlight relay?
Expert:  FORDFXR replied 6 years ago.

hi

the headlamp relay is in the relay module which is behind the center of the dash

graphic

i could not fine a pic of the relay module, all i can do is tell you that the wires going to the headlamp relay are bk/wh, w/p, db/o and r/y - the drawing above may help you to find the relay

 

let me know if this helped and if you need more info

please send feedback so we can serve you better,positive feedback is always appreciated

Louis

 

 

 

Customer: replied 6 years ago.
I cannot see the wires. There are 6 small relays that I swapped with each other and it made no difference. There is a single larger relay. Is that it? If so, I wil pul it ant pwer it up to see if it works on Thursday. It is 5 degrees outside and getting dark.
Customer: replied 6 years ago.
I just pulled and tested the large relay. It is good. Let's go back to square one, only have 1 vdc at pin 2 of the mirror, what should be there? Grounding does not turn anything on. Fuses are good.

Locking with remote, lights no longer flash. somewhere that is in common with the auto lamp function, or at least I think so.
Expert:  FORDFXR replied 6 years ago.

hi

the connector to the mirror has 6 cavities and only 5 wires, unplug it and test for the following

- pin 2 cir 218 w/p - this is the ground signal to the headlamps, if you ground this wire the headlamps should come on, if you test this pin with a voltmeter you should see battery voltage if voltage is low, check fuses 3 interior fuse panel, fuse 8 power distribution box,

graphic

-pin 3 cir 140 bk/pk this goes to your automatic day/night mirrors

-pin 4 cir 57 bk this is ground, use a test light and go from here to power to check for good ground

-pin 5 cir 54 lg/y this is fed by fuse 9 and should have power all the time

pin 6 cir 640 r/y this is fed by fuse 11 and should have power when the key is in the run position

if all these check out, you will need to replace the sensor

Customer: replied 6 years ago.
There is low volatge at pin 2 of the connector, about 1 VDC

Fuse 3 of the interiro fusebox is good.

Fuse 8 in the power dist box under the hood is good.

Any other ideas or are we at a dead end?
Expert:  FORDFXR replied 6 years ago.

hi

check the voltage at the fuses - use a test light to load the circuit, is there battery voltage when the test light is used?

at the headlamp and parklamp relay, test pin 1, is there battery voltage? - remember to load the circuit with a test light when checking

measure resistance between pin 2 at the mirror connector and pin 2 at the park lamp relay, - should be less than 5 ohms

let me know what you find

Louis

Customer: replied 6 years ago.
Did not get a chance to check this out on Friday. Will do so on Sat or Sun. Snowed over 8 inches here in northern IL and work and kids totally got in the way.
Customer: replied 6 years ago.
I need a helper to do this. My son is at a winter retreat camp until Sunday pm. WE will try then. I dare not ask the wife.

My relay layout is different than the picture. I will need to figure out which one is actually the headlight relay.

I did put a test light and voltmeter on the inside fuse 3 and I heard a relay click and it turned on the headlamps. So I will have my son connect and disconnect the test light while my head is unde the dash so I can figure out which relay it is and then continue.

Unless the test light thing provides any insights. I also grounded the non-hot side of the fuse three slot and it also turned on the head lights. Any new ideas or do we wait until he gets back and I have a helper?
Expert:  FORDFXR replied 6 years ago.

hi

i hope he gets to know who matters at the retreat

i will double check that i sent you the right diagram

did you have power to both sides of fuse 3 -- check this with the fuse removed??

let me know if this helped, and if you need any more info

please send feedback so we can serve you better, positive feedback is always appreciated

Louis

Customer: replied 6 years ago.
He is blessed to know who and what really matters. They had several small group sessions each day. It was cool to see over a 100 kids from church at a weekend retreat.

There is power to both sides of fuse 3. But if I ground the left side (facing the fuse panel), the headlight relay kicks clicks and the lights come on.

I do not think we will get to the vehicle today. Too many chores and lucky me, I have to give a training presentation Monday 8 am sharp. It may be freezing rain on Monday, so this may get put off to Tuesday, but I will try to figure out which relay is the HL one. But as there is both a parking light and HL relay, sounds like another common failure point may be the wire that feeds them both. What do you think?
Expert:  FORDFXR replied 6 years ago.

hi

this is a diagram of c212, the white/purple wire from the mirror sensor goes through this connector to the relay module, when you had fuse 3 pulled, if you grounded one pin and it turned on the headlamps and park lamps, the park lamp relay and headlamp relay have been proved, if you look at the first diagram i sent to you, the w/p wire (cir 218) runs from pin 2 to the relay module, i believe you will find an open circuit here

check c267 and c212 for poor connections, on the relay side, they should show power with and ohmmeter, if you ground the circuit it should turn on the lights

these diagrams are from Ford Motor Co

graphic

graphic

 

 

let me know if this helped, and if you need any more info

please send feedback so we can serve you better, positive feedback is always appreciated

Louis

 

Customer: replied 6 years ago.
That all makes sense. Where would I find C267? And C212, is that where all the wires come into the relay box? Not sure what I can do there except wiggle wires.

I think I identifed which relay was the HL one, but grounding pin 2 did not turn the lights on. Unless it was the wrong relay. We ran out of light and it is so foggy here in Chicago, Midway Airport is closed. And we are supposed to get 8 inches of snow beginning Tuesday pm, so this may take longer than I'd like. What are the odds of this failure, very very low. Just my luck...
Expert:  FORDFXR replied 6 years ago.

hi

you said you grounded pin 2(? w/p wire at the realy??)

go to the interior fuse panel, remove fuse 3 and check for power at both sides of the fuse

if you have power at both sides, remove fuse 8 from the power distribution box, - now ou should only have power at one side of fuse 3 (interior fuse panel)

this would prove cir 195 from interior fuse panel to relay module, cir 88 from power distribution bos to relay module, and cir 218 from park lamp relay to dimer realy and headlamp relay

if you follow the w/p wire from the mirror i beleive you will find an open or a high resistance between there and the park lamp relay

connector 267 is black 14 terminal the manual says l/s of instrument panel, mounted in left "A" pillar

connector 212 is 84 terminals, book does not give me a color, lh corner of instrument panel, near cowl panel grommet

also check splice 267 book says it is near tape out to g204- ground 204 is behind l/s kick panel

these would be the three most likely spots for a failure,

Customer: replied 6 years ago.
Sorry have not gotten back to you yet. We got 16 inches of heavy, rain ladden heart attack snow here in Wauconda, IL. And now a cold front blew in, it is -7 with wind chill about -30 degrees.

When we get a little warmer, I will try the electrical isolation you suggested to clear/prove what you suggest. I appreciate all the time and effort. Trick will be getting to all these connectors if the last electrical provide out.

Whatever the outcome is, I will ultimatly accept, regardless of outcome or if I pry apart the plastic over the A pillar. Yikes, how does one fo that and get it back together?

That splice sounds like a good target, but first things first, the temperature has to get above 20 degrees or so.

Again, thanks, XXXXX XXXXX a little time and we'll get this together. I am concerened if I accept now or before I can get back to it, the system will break the link betweeen us and I am then sitting solo once again.

Gary
Customer: replied 6 years ago.
Just wanted to touch base, sore throat and sick here and then lost radiator hose on 2001 vehicle, had to wait for a tow. Supposed to snow another 6 inches, so still need some time until I can get to this.

What a bad winter
Customer: replied 6 years ago.
Reply to FORDFXR's Post: I never was able to finish this as things got so busy. Are you arpund? The only right thing to do is make sure you get paid.

It is prob the splice, but I doubt if I will have or have the time to finish this.

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FORD MASTER TECHNICIAN ALBERTA JOURNEYMAN INTERPROVICIAL STANDARD