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Need help waiving spousal support in a California divorce of over 10 year marriage. Have docs from legal zoom & they are unable to continue this due to specific language the court needs.
Optional Information: State/Country relating to question: California Already Tried: Legal Zoom
Hello,Welcome to JustAnswer and thank you for the opportunity to assist you. Please remember that there might be a delay between your follow up questions and my answers because I may be helping other clients or taking a break.What exactly do you need to know - how to phrase this in the final decree?
Need the correct phrasing , at least in the Marital settlement agreement.Maybe another form needs to be generated. I am in touch with my ex & she will sign off as I will. We have been seperated for over 10 years. If you like I can fax or email what I have now that seems to be incorrect . And the Superior court requirement page I was sent. If that would help with this.
Hello,The only way I can review this is if you attached it to the response.What form number(s) are you using? What are you filling out at the moment?
LA-020,FL-100,FL-110,FL-115,FL-117,FL-130,FL-140 X2 ,FL-141 X2 ,FL-142 X2 , FL-144, FL-150 X2 , FL-170, FL,180, FL-190, & THE MARITAL SETTLEMENT AGREEMENT (8 PAGES) How do I attach to the response ? I beleive the Spousal statement is what need to be modified.
Thank you for the information.I am not sure how to attach something, since you and I have different screens.Let me ask this - have you actually filed the suit yet, or not yet?
Yes . These , again , are legal zoom prepared forme. It was rejected once for reasons that were corrected , then re filed & rejected a second time with more corections to be made. This will be the third filing. Legal zoon can not figure out the specific language needed to get through what the court wants in referance to Waiving of the spousal support. On the page sent to me from the Superior Court , item #5 Termination of Jurisdiction over Spousal Support. If the marriage through seperation has lated longer than 10 years , the Court will not terminate jurisdiction over spousal support absent some language in the judgment which supports the conclusion that both parties are aware that they are giving up the right to any court order spousal support at any time in the future no matter what may happen.Obviously , the Respondent will not have given such a statement in a regular default proceeding (although the respondent may do soin a stipulated judgement or marital settlement agreement). Many attorneys make referance to IRMO Vomacka. Termination of jurisdiction over spousal support requires more than a mere request. IRMO Vomacka was underlined & highlighted by the clerk. Here is the wording that is in the Spousal Support section presantly.
Spousal Support. The Court terminates jurisdiction over the issue of spousal support. The parties terminate their right to receive spousal support now or at any time in the future. This termination shall not be modifiable by the parties or the court for any reason whatsoever. By executing this agreement, the parties agree and acknowledge that they understand that by terminating their ability to receive spousal support, they will be forever barred from seeking spousal support at any time in the future regardless of the circumstances.
This has been midified since the last rejection.
Do you have experiance with this kind of Document in a divorce proceeding for an over 10 year Settlement?
May I ask if both you and the other party are showing up for Court to prove this up, or just you?Also, did the other party sign the decree when you went to prove it up?
No this is uncontested & filed at the court. My ex now lives in Fla. She & I will sign off.
You say will sign off, but did she before in previous attempts, and if so, was it notarized?
yes to both.
Will be away from the desk for a while.
"omacka stands for the principle that any waiver of SS in a longer marriage must be with clear and convincing evidence that the supported party's needs will be satisfactorily met at the time of termination. The supporting party has the obligation to make it clear at the time of judgment that the waiver of SS is a permanent and binding obligation."See here:http://www.irvinelaw.com/SPOUSALS.HTM"(T)o find from an agreement that there is a termination of spousal support, the Court must find explicit language of such termination” in the agreement."Ergo, the language has to be clear in that both parties are giving up said rights, in the decree. Something akin to: "Both parties acknowledge and waive their rights to spousal support per Family Code §4320 et seq, doing so knowingly, not under duress, and with understanding of their rights and duties under the California Family Code and other relate statutes, as well as per In re Marriage of Vomacka (1984) 36 Cal.3d 459, 204 Cal.Rptr. 568, 683 P.2d 248). I hope you found my answer helpful, and if so please click on the ACCEPT button. This is the only way for me to get credit for my work; I receive no credit for my time with you until you actually press ACCEPT. If you still need to clarify something or seek more information, just use the REPLY button and I’d be more than happy to follow up to your satisfaction! There is no fee for follow up questions before or after accepting, should you wish to continue in the thread, and I encourage you to do so should you desire clarification.If you feel that I went an extra step to help, a bonus is always appreciated! While the legal system tries to be inclusive of every possibility, sometimes, people are morally wronged but have limited legal avenues to seek relief. If so, please understand that this is not the expert’s fault, but the way of circumstance (in other words, I prefer to tell you the truth rather than tell you what you want to hear, so if the news is not good – please – do not shoot the messenger).You can always request me for a future advice through my profile at http://www.justanswer.com/profile.aspx?PF=7286322&FID=7 If you do this, make sure to begin the question with “This Question is for Eli…”
"omacka stands for the principle that any waiver of SS in a longer marriage must be with clear and convincing evidence that the supported party's needs will be satisfactorily met at the time of termination. The supporting party has the obligation to make it clear at the time of judgment that the waiver of SS is a permanent and binding obligation."See here:http://www.irvinelaw.com/SPOUSALS.HTM"(T)o find from an agreement that there is a termination of spousal support, the Court must find explicit language of such termination” in the agreement."Ergo, the language has to be clear in that both parties are giving up said rights, in the decree. Something akin to: "Both parties acknowledge and waive their rights to spousal support per Family Code §4320 et seq, doing so knowingly, not under duress, and with understanding of their rights and duties under the California Family Code and other relate statutes, as well as per In re Marriage of Vomacka (1984) 36 Cal.3d 459, 204 Cal.Rptr. 568, 683 P.2d 248)."I hope you found my answer helpful, and if so please click on the ACCEPT button. This is the only way for me to get credit for my work; I receive no credit for my time with you until you actually press ACCEPT. If you still need to clarify something or seek more information, just use the REPLY button and I’d be more than happy to follow up to your satisfaction! There is no fee for follow up questions before or after accepting, should you wish to continue in the thread, and I encourage you to do so should you desire clarification.If you feel that I went an extra step to help, a bonus is always appreciated! While the legal system tries to be inclusive of every possibility, sometimes, people are morally wronged but have limited legal avenues to seek relief. If so, please understand that this is not the expert’s fault, but the way of circumstance (in other words, I prefer to tell you the truth rather than tell you what you want to hear, so if the news is not good – please – do not shoot the messenger).You can always request me for a future advice through my profile at http://www.justanswer.com/profile.aspx?PF=7286322&FID=7 If you do this, make sure to begin the question with “This Question is for Eli…”
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Just curious. Should I include this statement starting from "both parties etc"as part of the Spousal Agreement or instead of what is there now?T
Sorry, I do not understand what you mean?
In your answer , the paragraph beginning with Ergo ,you "Both parties acknowledge and waive their rights to spousal support per Family Code §4320 et seq, doing so knowingly, not under duress, and with understanding of their rights and duties under the California Family Code and other relate statutes, as well as per In re Marriage of Vomacka (1984) 36 Cal.3d 459, 204 Cal.Rptr. 568, 683 P.2d 248)." That statement. Does it go after what I sent you - Spousal Support. The Court terminates jurisdiction over the issue of spousal support. The parties terminate their right to receive spousal support now or at any time in the future. This termination shall not be modifiable by the parties or the court for any reason whatsoever. By executing this agreement, the parties agree and acknowledge that they understand that by terminating their ability to receive spousal support, they will be forever barred from seeking spousal support at any time in the future regardless of the circumstances. Or instead of it? Or , should it be incorporated somehow? I have a clerk working with me to be sure I have the correct info for the next filing of these papers.By the way.
Oh, I see. I meant instead.However, please note that without actually talking to the clerk, it is hard to determine what was lacking. This was an educated guess. I do suggest calling the clerk to verify, and can give you the number if you tell me what court you are in.In the end, it is best to have an attorney run through the decree (offer them $150 or so) and make sure it is in fine shape, just to avoid any more returns...
Once I have heard back from the clerk & had the docs re- done , I might do that. Would you be interested in helping with that?T
T,I cannot. JustAnswer prohibits its experts from taking customers on as clients; but I thank you for your vote of confidence.
Can you recommend an atty. to go over my docs? Or , where would I find 1?Thanks.T
T,Sure. First, try the California Bar Referral Services:http://www.calbar.ca.gov/Public/LawyerReferralServicesLRS.aspxThe attorneys are vetted and qualified, and the service is free.Second, cross-reference with www.avvo.com, where you can see counsel listed by professional experience, areas of practice, and client reviews.I believe that between these two resources, you should find someone that can help you.
Thanks again.T
You are very welcome.