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Ely
Ely, Counselor at Law
Category: Estate Law
Satisfied Customers: 101049
Experience:  Fully licensed attorney in Texas in private practice.
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Im reading one of your passed questions someone had on-line.

Customer Question

Im reading one of your passed questions someone had on-line. Its has the same things as what i went through.estaqte issue and it says it was posted three years ago.
Submitted: 1 year ago.
Category: Estate Law
Expert:  Ely replied 1 year ago.
Hello and welcome to JustAnswer. Please note:
(A) This is general information and is not legal advice. No specific course of action is proposed herein. No attorney-client relationship or privilege is formed by speaking to an expert on this site. This is repeated in numerous disclaimers throughout the site. By continuing, you confirm that you understand and agree to these terms; and (B) there may be a slight delay between your follow ups and my reply while I am typing out my answer.
1) Can you please link me to the thread that you are referencing in your question?
2) What state is your situation in?
3) What exactly are you asking here, i.e. what is your question?
This is not an answer, but an Information Request. I need this information to answer your question. Please reply, so I can answer your question. Thank you in advance.
Customer: replied 1 year ago.
my brother sign over his car befor he died and i now have title
Customer Question
my brother sign over his car befor he died and i now have title but his son wants the car and says it should be his. Is this correct ?
Submitted: 3 years ago.
Category: Estate Law
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Dimitry Esquire
Expert: Dimitry Esquire replied 3 years ago.
Thank you for your question.That is not correct, if the title transfer took place prior to passing, and the transfer was not made under duress or under undue influence, the vehicle is legally yours. It is no longer part of the estate, and you as the receiver of the vehicle are the lawful owner of the car.Good luck.
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Customer: replied 3 years ago.
not sure but let me see if i can be a little more clear my brother sign and dated it before he died but I did not file it till after he was dead
Expert: Dimitry Esquire replied 3 years ago.
Thank you for your follow-up.That does make a difference. To transfer title you would need the owner to sign off and then file the form. If there was anywhere on the form that your brother had to sign but couldn't due to his passing, the transfer would not be deemed valid and teh vehicle would remain in the estate. However if the title was fully filled out, and all you had to do was file it for recording, then it is still a valid transfer and you are the owner of the vehicle.Good luck.
Dimitry Esquire
Dimitry Esquire, Attorney
Category: Estate Law
Satisfied Customers: 39063
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Customer: replied 3 years ago.
not sure but let me see if i can be a little more clear my brother sign and dated it before he died but I did not file it till after he was dead can you please answer this as I am sick over this matter
Dimitry Esquire
Expert: Dimitry Esquire replied 3 years ago.
I am trying to be as clear as I can.1. If he signed everything over to you, and you did not need to do anything beyond filing the title with the DMV, the vehicle is yours.2. If he signed the title but when you filed the paperwork there was additional information that had to filled out where your brother did not sign but had to, the transfer is improper and incomplete, and remains with the estate. You in that instance do not possess the vehicle.Good luck.
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Customer: replied 3 years ago.not sure but let me see if i can be a little more clear my brother sign and dated it before he died but I did not file it till after he was dead can you please answer this as I am sick over this matterstill not sure one more time the title is already in my name and my brother did not have to sign anything eles.
Dimitry Esquire
Expert: Dimitry Esquire replied 3 years ago.
In that case the vehicle is yours since the act of signing over the title transferred ownership. My answer will not change at this point.Good luck.
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Customer: replied 3 years ago.not sure but let me see if i can be a little more clear my brother sign and dated it before he died but I did not file it till after he was dead can you please answer this as I am sick over this matterstill not sure one more time the title is already in my name and my brother did not have to sign anything eles.do you mean if I sign his name because I did notthank you for your help Iam not trying to be a pain just trying to be clear.
Expert: Dimitry Esquire replied 3 years ago.
Thank you for your follow-up.I do not think you are trying to be a pain at all, I realize that this can at times be fairly difficult and I am not trying to give you the impression that this is somehow not a valid question.Sometimes for a title transfer there is additional information required that both have to sign together, that is what I was referring to solely. If that did not to take place and title was signed over to you by him, it is valid and the vehicle is yours.Good luck.Read more: http://www.justanswer.com/estate-law/67auo-brother-sign-car-befor-died-title.html#ixzz3ZwNmJhxZ
My state is Indiana
#3) Some type of law providing other court hearing or such the provide a law to back up are owning the truck.
info: my brother signed a title of his new truck over in oct. so i have the title and the keys. he stored at his girlfriends garage. So weather protected. He told me to go to DMV and get it transferred to my name. I told him i work til 5 pm and it closes at 4 that ill try to get it done. ( not understanding really why.) just that he said i want my truck in your name. When he got taken to the jail he throw keys and said here you always wanted a new truck it's yours. officers were around because they had to take cuff off to let him get keys out of his pocket. while he was in jail he requested i bring his title in and he would sign it. i did. >
Customer: replied 1 year ago.
in December he took his life. all areas on title were filled out except the date. He never filled out to whom. He left blank and told me to put my info on it. In his eyes he eighter thought i did or that Him signing over was enough to say he wanted me to have it. The estate is fighting saying it belongs to the kids. Im his sister. Everyone knew his relationship with kids was bad. for about 4 years plus. My brother words were " those little basters wont get a dime of my monies or belongings". Everyone knew he hated them. Which is very sad, but they were mean.
Expert:  Ely replied 1 year ago.
I am sorry, I am having trouble "reconstituting" the situation based on another question that you used as an example.
Can you please tell me in your own words as to:
1) What has happened, and
2) What exactly you are asking here?
Thank you in advance for your patience.
Customer: replied 1 year ago.
Some type of law providing other court hearing or such the provide a law to back up are owning the truck.
info: my brother signed a title of his new truck over in oct. so i have the title and the keys. he stored at his girlfriends garage. So weather protected. He told me to go to DMV and get it transferred to my name. I told him i work til 5 pm and it closes at 4 that ill try to get it done. ( not understanding really why.) just that he said i want my truck in your name. When he got taken to the jail he throw keys and said here you always wanted a new truck it's yours. officers were around because they had to take cuff off to let him get keys out of his pocket. while he was in jail he requested i bring his title in and he would sign it. i did. >
Customer: replied 1 year ago.
in December he took his life. all areas on title were filled out except the date. He never filled out to whom. He left blank and told me to put my info on it. In his eyes he eighter thought i did or that Him signing over was enough to say he wanted me to have it. The estate is fighting saying it belongs to the kids. Im his sister. Everyone knew his relationship with kids was bad. for about 4 years plus. My brother words were " those little basters wont get a dime of my monies or belongings". Everyone knew he hated them. Which is very sad, but they were mean.
Customer: replied 1 year ago.
in other question he said the title belong to the guy. needding to know here if its the same. and any "LAW", saying this is so?
Expert:  Ely replied 1 year ago.
Thank you.
To clarify, did he sign the title over to you? Is the title in YOUR name now?
Customer: replied 1 year ago.
when he was in jail he signed the title. and said it was mine.
no its not in my name because i didnt get to BMV. he died before i got to the BMV.
Customer: replied 1 year ago.
we are going to trial in a few weeks and he is going only on "showing my bothers intent", im hoping someone else has more law information to help. In the other reading they posted it belongs to the the ones they signed over to.
Expert:  Ely replied 1 year ago.
Ah, I see.
Then, this may be useful:
"Certificate of title is not of itself proof of ownership or legal title to the vehicle." PEKIN INS. v. Charlie Rowe Chevrolet, 556 NE 2d 1367 - Ind: Court of Appeals, 3rd Dist. 1990 (internal citation omitted). This is echoed in Estudillo v. Estudillo, 956 NE 2d 1084 - Ind: Court of Appeals 2011: "Vehicles are treated differently than real property in that we have held that certificate of title is not itself proof of ownership or legal title to a vehicle. [Brackin.] Standing alone, certificate of title raises a presumption of legal title in the holder, which is subject to challenge by other evidence. Id."
The Courts seem to have determined that the certificate of title in itself is not ownership, but it depends on the FACTS surrounding it. The closest I could find to your situation is below:
"A valid inter vivos gift occurs when each of the following is present: (1) the donor is competent to make the gift; (2) the donor intends to make a gift; (3) the gift is completed with nothing left undone; (4) the property is delivered by the donor and is accepted by the donee; and (5) the gift is immediate and absolute. Fowler v. Perry, 830 N.E.2d 97, 105 (Ind. Ct.App.2005). Once delivery and acceptance of an inter vivos gift occurs, the gift is irrevocable and a present title vests in the donee. Id." Brackin v. Brackin, 894 NE 2d 206 - Ind: Court of Appeals 2008.
Inter vivos (Latin, between the living) is a legal term referring to a transfer or gift made during one's lifetime, as opposed to a testamentary transfer (a gift that takes effect on death). In other words, the above readily fits into your situation, arguably.
There are more cases that discuss the facts surrounding each situation and it remains subjective, but it seems that if one can prove that this was intended to be a gift by him (and the certificate of title is good PROOF of this), it will be seen as a gift.
I hope this helps and clarifies. Gentle Reminder: Use the SEND or REPLY button to keep chatting, or please rate when finished. You may always ask follow ups at no charge after rating. Kindly rate my answer as one of the top three faces/stars and then SUBMIT, as this is how I get credit for my time with you. Rating my answer the bottom two faces/stars or failing to submit the rating does not give me credit and reflects poorly on me, even if my answer is correct. I work very hard to formulate an informative and honest answer for you; please reciprocate my good faith.
Customer: replied 1 year ago.
you quoted a few that support that a title is not proof of transfer of ownership. Do you have any that won saying it was a gift. and intent
Expert:  Ely replied 1 year ago.
I think you missed the main part:
"A valid inter vivos gift occurs when each of the following is present: (1) the donor is competent to make the gift; (2) the donor intends to make a gift; (3) the gift is completed with nothing left undone; (4) the property is delivered by the donor and is accepted by the donee; and (5) the gift is immediate and absolute. Fowler v. Perry, 830 N.E.2d 97, 105 (Ind. Ct.App.2005). Once delivery and acceptance of an inter vivos gift occurs, the gift is irrevocable and a present title vests in the donee. Id." Brackin v. Brackin, 894 NE 2d 206 - Ind: Court of Appeals 2008.
Here is the breakdown:
1) The non-filed certificate of title is not itself proof of ownership; however
2) If one can prove that this was indeed a gift, then one can claim ownership; and
3) While the certificate of title does not itself automatically give ownership if never filed, it can be very persuasive proof that yes this was indeed a gift, and thus, the vehicle would be considered yours.
In other words, the non-filed certificate does not translate to automatic ownership, but it can still be used as proof that this was a GIFT and if so, the gift is recognized.
Gentle Reminder: Please, use the REPLY or SEND button to keep chatting, or rate positively and SUBMIT your rating when we are finished. You may always ask follow ups at no charge after rating.