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AssuredElectrical
AssuredElectrical, Master Electrician
Category: Electrical
Satisfied Customers: 3303
Experience:  Contractor-40 Years in the ElectricalTrade
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i need more help....

Resolved Question:

i need more help....
Submitted: 1 year ago.
Category: Electrical
Expert:  AssuredElectrical replied 1 year ago.

AssuredElectrical :

Welcome. My name is XXXXX XXXXX would be glad to assist.

Customer:

were you the one who helped me earlier?

AssuredElectrical :

On the dimmer? 3 way?

Customer:

yea

AssuredElectrical :

run into something?

Customer:

the question i have now is not totally related to the 3-way/4-way dimmer issue.....

AssuredElectrical :

ok, what is it you need assistance on?


 

Customer:

Full Size Image

Customer:

so let me know if you see this image

AssuredElectrical :

I can see it, let me look for a min, anything in particular?


 

Customer:

well, the number 1 seems to be the hot and black wire when touched with the tester it beeps

Customer:

is it safe to say that the number 1 wire is providing power to 2 and 3?

Customer:

it seems weird that whoever wired this hooked the whites to the black. do you think so?

AssuredElectrical :

trying to understand the wires and colors


is the #1 black connected to to 2 whites?

Customer:

yes

Customer:

is that weird?

AssuredElectrical :

what does the #1 white do in the box?


 

Customer:

im not sure i think it is providing power to the 2 and the 3 which was a fan light and fan low med high

AssuredElectrical :

but is it connected to anything? or just loose in the box?


 

Customer:

on the wall there is that 4 way for all the ceiling lamps then an on off switch for the fan lamp then the low med high dial. I have uninstalled the ceiling fan and am adding a new dimmable new lamp 2 feet from there, and adding a new dimmable lamp 6 feet from there and adding an outlet in the attic.

Customer:

it was connected like in the picture

AssuredElectrical :

there are 3 cables in that box , correct? each one with black and white wire? Is that what I am looking at?

Customer:

yes

AssuredElectrical :

and the 2 blacks and the single white showing loose were connected to an old switch you removed?


 

Customer:

on the right in the picture it should say fan switch wires

Customer:

no this picture is in the ceiling where the ceiling fan was hanging

AssuredElectrical :

Oh, hang on, thought it was a switch box

Customer:

ok, and the wires from the ceiling fan were connected to the black and whites in the picture

AssuredElectrical :

trying to determine why you show one set as fan wires?

Customer:

the bottom wires lead to the wall switches as far as i could figure

AssuredElectrical :

this box is where the fan was mounted, correct?

AssuredElectrical :

wait a sec

AssuredElectrical :

you had separate switches for the fan and light?

Customer:

yes this pic is the ceiling box where the fan was mounted, yes separate

AssuredElectrical :

ok, and are the switches still in their boxes or removed?

Customer:

removed

AssuredElectrical :

and each switch was connected to ta black and white wire, correct?

Customer:

yes

AssuredElectrical :

ok, got it

Customer:

one was a switch the other was a dial type of switch

Customer:

so was it weird that they had the black hooked up to the whites?

AssuredElectrical :

apparently, they did not have any 3 wire cable. so, they wired it like you do with many lights when the power is in the light box. So, what you do: take the HOT black wire coming into the box, connect it to the whites that go to the switches. Then return power from the switch on the black wires.

AssuredElectrical :

if they had 3 wire cable, they would have used only 1 white for power and returned on the black and red

AssuredElectrical :

It was very standard for 50 years or longer, when power is in the lighht box, to send power down to the switch on white and back on the black when using a 2 wire cable.

Customer:

hmm.... im trying to process this. i guess ive got it.

AssuredElectrical :

the #1 black is HOT 120 volts.

AssuredElectrical :

the 2 whites connect to it and send 120 to each switch for power

AssuredElectrical :

then the switch returns the 120 to the light or fan on the black wire

AssuredElectrical :

with only 2 wires in the cable, there are no other options

AssuredElectrical :

now we use 3 wire cables, so you dont have to do the odd connections like that one.

Customer:

so i disconnected all of it and im hooking up two new ceiling lamps to be switched and dimmed separately plus a power outlet in the attic.

Customer:

is this possible?

AssuredElectrical :

Ok

Customer:

i already ran the wires 12-2 to each new hole in the ceiling on a 15amp breaker

AssuredElectrical :

you have power now, dont need another circuit

AssuredElectrical :

are you going to use the switch locations now?

Customer:

ok, i didnt add a circuit

AssuredElectrical :

ok

Customer:

yes i want to use the wall switches for the 2 separate ceiling lamps

AssuredElectrical :

ok

AssuredElectrical :

give me 1 sec

Customer:

so what i did is installed the two new dimmer switches, and hooked all the whites together in the ceiling and all the blacks together in the ceiling outlet and flipped the breaker. It seemed fine until I threw the dimmer that used to control the fan lowmedhigh and it popped and sparked. it did not trip the breaker though.

AssuredElectrical :

yea, you need to change the wiring, have a diagram now

AssuredElectrical :

Full Size Image

AssuredElectrical :

put the original wiring back the way it was found. Then add your new items to the locations shown

AssuredElectrical :

dimmers can be very finicky when wired incorrectly, so hopefully they are allright

AssuredElectrical :

just a heads up for you in case

Customer:

looking at it now..... please hold

AssuredElectrical :

no problem

Customer:

so im throwing out the popped dimmer switch and replacing it. for starters......

AssuredElectrical :

ok, probably shorted it out


 

Customer:

now in your picture, where is my #1 wire (in the top of my picture)

AssuredElectrical :

the #1 is on the left

AssuredElectrical :

it is like you had in yours

Customer:

so the grey is the white wires right?

AssuredElectrical :

yes, it is as close as my program gets with white background


 

Customer:

i just cant understand the pic. now i have to go to work for an hour.... ill look at it later. thanks

AssuredElectrical :

getting another one easier to see

AssuredElectrical :

Full Size Image

AssuredElectrical :

used your original picture

AssuredElectrical :

hopefully that diagram helps better, just let me know when you return, no problem.

AssuredElectrical :

Is the second diagram a little easier to follow?

Customer:

yes, it was much easier to follow

AssuredElectrical :

Ok, wanted to be sure, did not hear back and was concerned that it may not have shown up properly

Customer:

I followed your diagram and everything works perfect!! Thanks so much! Other dude on Just Answer Electrical named Sparky could not figure it out.

AssuredElectrical :

Excellent, glad to assist on the issue. Keep me in mind on the next adventure.


 

Customer:

Have a great wknd :)

AssuredElectrical, Master Electrician
Category: Electrical
Satisfied Customers: 3303
Experience: Contractor-40 Years in the ElectricalTrade
AssuredElectrical and 3 other Electrical Specialists are ready to help you

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