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Jane Lefler
Jane Lefler, Animal Behaviorist
Category: Dog Training
Satisfied Customers: 19540
Experience:  Behaviorist /Trainer and Dog breeder 18+ years
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My puppy potty again on the pad. But when I found out, it's

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Hi Jane. My puppy potty again on the pad. But when I found out, it's already there. Maybe she poop it half hour ago? In that case, do I let her out and praise her ? Maybe she doesn't know why I praise her since I didn't see her do it?

I'd go ahead and let her out but only for a short while. She will associate you finding it on the pad with the reward so it is still good. Only punishment would be wrong as it would cause a dog to HIDE the feces the next time. You might leave this one open for a little while for follow up purposes.

Customer: replied 5 months ago.
i put her back and she cried so hard again. She climb out once and I put her back. Do you think she will be very confused and don't know why I put her in that enclosure area ?

No. As long as you don't make too much of an issue of it, she will settle down. She did real quick the last time. She will adjust and learn. I think she is doing pretty good for her first day.

Customer: replied 5 months ago.
If I need to go out for few hours. Should I put her in that enclosure place? Since I am not home, she might climb out. And the elder dog will help her . Is there any suggestion that what I can do when I am not home ?

When not at home, crate her. Remember to give her a tiny treat when you do so she is encouraged to like going into the crate.

Customer: replied 5 months ago.
Ok! Thank you so much. Btw, when the puppy crying and trying to climb out, should I say No to her ?

If she isn't getting out, I'd ignore her if possible. If you show her attention, even negative attention, she may try harder the next time. I'm trying to think of a way to stop her climbing over. Perhaps a board across the top of the gate portion so if she tried to climb she runs into that board. On a fence we angle in a small portion of fencing or put a spinning pipe along the top but a board should serve the same purpose. Maybe an old shelf from a book case might work if you have on or a long piece of cardboard anchored on both ends with a box. Just something to make like an upside down L with the short end of the L pointed in to create a barrier.

Customer: replied 5 months ago.
Yuui is a very good girl. She pee on the pad again during my shower time. I heard she cried so hard, and when I come out of shower, I see her pee on the pad. So I let her out. Wish I could see her potty and let her out right away, but I always miss it and found out later

She will get the message. I'm glad she is using the pad consistently. You might be able to increase the area to a room size after a short while. Just don't move too fast.

Customer: replied 5 months ago.
Yeah, she is very smart. Hopefully she will learn to use the pad in 2 or 3 days. Then I don't need to limit her freedom anymore

That certainly would be great.

Customer: replied 5 months ago.
Hi Jane. I let my puppy out to play for a while since she potty in the right spot. But then she pee again randomly on the floor when I didn't notice . Is this means she still don't know where to potty ?or is it possible that she is just stubborn ?

She likely still doesn't quite get where to go or the pad is too far for her to get to. She hasn't learned to hold it. this is where crate training works well. The crate is so small if they urinate in it, they have to sit in it. More work for the owner since they have to clean it up and the dog, but the dog learns quickly that they have to hold it until they are out of the crate. This teaches them to hold their urine for longer and longer periods of time.

So she still doesn't quite know that she should go on the pad or the pad was further away than she was willing to go in order to urinate. Now that is assuming you have cleaned all old spots up with a good enzymatic cleaner as old smells will encourage them to go in the wrong spot.

Some owners will go ahead and put pads in each room so a dog doesn't have to hold it for long and can get to a pad quickly. That sometimes works but I"m not sure if you would want to try that or not.

Customer: replied 5 months ago.
I live in a studio. So I only have one room, and it's 400 square feet. But I notice that my puppy never wanna hold it.
Customer: replied 5 months ago.
At this moment, when should I do the crate training, and when should I put her into the enclosure area ? Also, I did use the pet odor cleaning cleanser, do u have any good brand to suggest ?
Customer: replied 5 months ago.
This is how big my home is.

I see. Ok lets do a little change up to help teach her to hold it. She may be more vocal for a little while. Crate her the majority of the time. After you feed her or water her, take her to the enclosure. If she doesn't go after 15 minutes, put her back in the crate and repeat in an hour. If she goes, let her run around but only for 15 minutes before putting her back in the crate. Initially take her to the enclosure every 2 hours. This gives her plenty of opportunity to eliminate. After a few days change to every 2.5 hours gradually extending the time to 3-4 hours in the crate. This will help her learn to hold her bladder.

In addition, start feeding and watering her on a strict schedule. Keep a log of when you feed her and give her water. also keep a log of when she defecates or urinates. Soon you will see a pattern develop as to how long after eating or drinking she eliminates. This will allow you to either be sure she is in the enclosure when she needs to eliminate or move her meal times so the time she would need to eliminate is more convenient for you.

It will take a few days for you to see a pattern. The only other suggestion would be to leash her to you all the time she is out of the enclosure so you can run her back to the enclosure if she starts to squat. It also allows you to do the firm NO when she squats anywhere but in the enclosure.

It is the first day so one accident when she succeeded so many times isn't that bad. You might give this a few days before deciding to try something different. Each dog is different so it does take being flexible in training methods to find the right one to work for each dog.

She should be able to go 20 feet to get to a pad, so it is likely she still doesn't quite get that the pad is where you want her to go, so I'd give her a few more days in the enclosure.

Customer: replied 5 months ago.
Ok! I think I will keep her the the enclosure for few more days. I feel bad to crate her in the kennel , especially I notice that she actually like the kennel and willing to go into it . So I am not sure if I should use it to crate her for most of the day beside I go out or sleep ?

I agree but you may need to if she resists learning that the pad is where she needs to go. Don't leave her out longer than say 15 minutes from the enclosure and if you stop playing with her during that time, put her back. Pups will urinate right after playing so you want her on the pad at that point. You can combine the log idea though now so you can see what pattern she might have.

Customer: replied 5 months ago.
thank you so much! I will do that.
Customer: replied 5 months ago.
Is it possible that there are some puppy simply just impossible to learn to potty on pad?
Customer: replied 5 months ago.
I am quite confused with Yuui's situation. Because before I do the enclosure training , she pee on pad if I put her on the pad , but never go there by herself . And today, when I enclosure her, she potty on the pad, but didn't go to the pad by herself when she is out. So I wonder is it possible that she just doesn't wanna use it? If so, is the training still gonna help?

I haven't met one yet though some are more stubborn than others. Ones that spend their early months in cages all the time or outside all the time practically from birth never have to learn to hold it until they are on a pad. So she needs to be taught. Right now when she is in the enclosure it is either go on the pad or basically in her bed since they are so close to one another. It is trying to teach her to go on the pad. That is why I suggested a shorter period of time out of the enclosure so she will succeed more often.

As you give her a little more room in the enclosure where there is no pads or bed then you will see if she is learning, but for now keep it close so she gets used to going on the pad. Also when you first let her out of the crate put her immediately in the enclosure and when she goes on the pad, be sure and give a small treat when she starts to go. That is pretty much the only time you know positively that she will have to eliminate so you can hang out and wait for that one. The treat will help her learn as well.

Dogs are eager to please. They want to please you, she just has always just squatted when ever the urge hit her so she has to learn. It can take weeks for her to learn, but you have to start somewhere and be consistent.

Customer: replied 5 months ago.
yeah, I will be consistent this time. It's just so heart breaking when I hear she cry.
Customer: replied 5 months ago.
also, what make me feel sad is she will grow up very soon, and I really love to play with puppy. Now she is in that enclosure area, so I can't play or cuddle her for most of time . :(

You can play with her all you want but the minute you stop playing with her even if it is just for a few minutes, she has to go back because that is when she will urinate. You can cuddle her as well, she just can't run loose until she learns. When she cries though you have to ignore it. If you want to cuddle, wait for her to be quiet and then go to her. She will learn that being quiet often will get her held and cuddled where crying accomplishes nothing.

Customer: replied 5 months ago.
even when she hasn't potty in that enclosure area, if I wanna play with her, I can take her out ? And put her back when I finish play with her ? Will she get confused ?

She will not get confused. You only need to keep her contained when you can not have your eye on her so that if she does go to squat you can give the verbal reprimand "NO", scoop her up and get her to the pad. She might not go immediately after being stopped but it shouldn't take her long and then you can praise her for going on the pad.

Customer: replied 5 months ago.
Thank you ! So basically , the shoe training is : I keep her contained when I can't play with her or cuddle her . And put her to crate when I need to go out and sleep. If I noticed she potty on the right place , I let her out and play for a while, and put her back. And when I want to play with her , I can take her out from the contained area even she hasn't potty , right ?

You got it.

Customer: replied 5 months ago.
thank you so much ! I feel much better after knowing these . I thought I won't be able to play with her unless she potty . The only thing is she would cry so hard everytime I put her back to the contained area . But I guess she would be better after few days

She will be. Keep this question open for now in case you still have follow up questions or just need some encouragement.

Customer: replied 5 months ago.
Thank you so much! I am really appreciate it

No problem at all.

Customer: replied 5 months ago.
Hi Jane. If I am watching TV, and the puppy wanna sleep on my lap, or sleep near me, should I allow that ? Or I should put her back to the contained area?

You can have her sleep with you if you want but if she wakes immediately put her back in the containment area because she will likely have to urinate when she wakes up.

Customer: replied 5 months ago.
Ok! So I will start to track her potty time . And the time she drink water and eat. After I find out the pattern, I would know better when to put her into the contained area. Thank you so much

You're welcome.

Customer: replied 5 months ago.
Hi Jane. My puppy Yuui is a very good girl . She went into her crate directly when she tired of playing with her elder sister . So in that case. I don't need to take her out anymore , right ? I just need to bring her to the crate area when she wake up ?

That is correct. I'm probably going to bed in the next few minutes so I'll check in first thing in the morning. It looks like she may be down for the night.

Customer: replied 5 months ago.
Thank you so much for help me . You really gave me a lot of encourage . Good night

You have a good night as well.

Customer: replied 5 months ago.
Morning Jane. Yuui sleep in the crate yesterday night. I brought her out around 4:00 am to let her potty. And she did it right away on the pad, and this morning, when we wake up. I brought her to the container area for potty again. And feed them breakfast. After that, I put her back to the container area. And she start to cry and trying to come out. Do you think I might put her in too soon ?
Customer: replied 5 months ago.
Hi Jane. I think to put Yuui in that enclosure area and hear her crying is truly make me very sad. I am thinking about another method: everyday after she wake up , either from the nap or in the morning , I will put her in that container area . And when she take nap, I will put her in her crate. And after she play with me or another dog , she always laying down next to me. So I won't pick her up and put her back to the container area, because she would cry so hard, and which make me very sad
Customer: replied 5 months ago.
Do you think the way I do will be helpful with her potty training ?

I t might be helpful, but a better way would be to just leash her to you when she isn't in her crate of the containment area. That way she will be where you can see her and catch her in the act. Catching her and telling her NO will help her realize what you don't want and rewarding her with tiny treats when she goes on the pad will help her realize what you do want.

Customer: replied 5 months ago.
Ok! I would do that!

Great.

Customer: replied 5 months ago.
Hi Jane. I got the fence for Yuui, so that she could have more space . And she pee on the right place again. Hopefully she can keep doing good . I went out for a while today and put her in the crate . She cried so hard , and non stopping

She will adjust. The more you ignore the crying the faster she will stop it the next time.

Customer: replied 5 months ago.
There is one thing I worry about her potty. Every time I put her into the container area, she would go potty pretty quick. But I wonder if she really know that's the place she need to use for potty or she simply think I want her to potty ? Because before this training , everytime I bring her to the pad, she would pee. But she never realize that's the place she need to potty by herself

She wouldn't realize it. That is why if you catch her in the act somewhere else it will help her learn that is NOT the place to eliminate.

Customer: replied 5 months ago.
Hi Jane. If the puppy pee on the floor while she play with me , should I put her right back to the enclosure area? Will that make her think the enclosure area is a punishment ?

When she urinated on the floor, you were supposed to try and stop her and tell her NO in a low toned voice and put her in the enclosure. She needs to know that urinating anywhere but the enclosure is unacceptable. It is the NO that is the punishment. However, you do not continue to give her attention and affection and play which are good things when she does something unacceptable, thus back to the enclosure. House training typically takes months but with older dogs it frequently is only weeks. Give her some time and be consistent and she will learn.

Customer: replied 5 months ago.
but if I see her pee right after she did it, like 1 or 2 minutes later . Is NO still works ?

Oh. I thought you said you were playing with her when she urinated. Remember I told you that if you stop playing with them only for a minute or two she may urinate. If you are not actively playing with her she has to be in the enclosure.

Customer: replied 5 months ago.
Yeah, yesterday I was playing with her. And when I reply my friend's msg , she already pee:(

Yes. They take that few minutes. You have to be on your toes.

Customer: replied 5 months ago.
I will be more caution next time. But now, Yuui start to know that if I put her in the enclosure area, she need to do potty .
Customer: replied 5 months ago.
everytime I put her into the enclosure area, she do the potty probably in 10 minute .
Customer: replied 5 months ago.
But is this good ?

That is a start. Very good for just a couple of days.

Customer: replied 5 months ago.
in this case, do I need to adjust any training strategy ? What I worried is if everytime I put her in, she know I want her to potty, then how long she would know if she need to potty, she have to go to the training pad ?
Customer: replied 5 months ago.
Also, yesterday when I am not home, I leave her in the enclosure area, and finally she jumped out. But she didn't potty randomly , she went to my another dog's training pad to potty
Customer: replied 5 months ago.
But then when I arrive home, she was way too excited and she dump onto my lap and pee :(

Don't worry so much about that. Her trying to urinate on the pad is good too. The more she goes on the training pad the more likely she will go go to it in the future. You are establishing a habit for her. Yesterday was very good if she went on the other pad.

As for her getting excited and urinating, that is a different problem called excitement urination. There are medications which have been found to be effective for this problem and you should ask your Vet about Proin for dogs over 6 months and Imipramine for those younger. I've found that obedience training gives dogs self confidence and helps cure this problem as well.

Proin may also help with house training as it helps strengthen the bladder sphincter muscles which help them hold their urine better.

Customer: replied 5 months ago.
I talked to the vet before, she said Yuui is not submissive urine , she just too excited that forgot she need to pee . But yeah, I will bring her for obedience training class. I heard it will be helpful for her to understand potty training

If she gets so excited she pees on you, that is excitement urination much like submissive urination but a little different. That is a separate issue from the house training but definitely do obedience training.

You can do it yourself if you want. The following site is helpful in helping owners train their dog. Be sure and click on the link to the page on obedience at the bottom. and links on subsequent pages leading to detailed instructions.

http://www.schutzhund-training.com/training_theory.html

Customer: replied 5 months ago.
hi Jane. I got an fence for Yuui :)
Customer: replied 5 months ago.
Before I use your method to train her , she always poop behind my Christmas tree . And today I went out and leave her in that fence , and she climb out , and went back to the Christmas tree area to poop again. This really annoyed me. I have cleaned that area for many many times , with the odor eliminator , but she still keep going back
Customer: replied 5 months ago.
Is there anything I can do with that ?

I have that same fence. The problem with it is that it provides lots of toe holes for them to climb over. This type is better at providing not allowing them to climb out. The fewer vertical bars the harder for them to climb out.

https://www.chewy.com/frisco-dog-exercise-pen-step-through/dp/125048?utm_source=google-product&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=hg&utm_content=Frisco&utm_term=&gclid=CjwKEAiA48fDBRDJ24_imejhwUkSJAAr0M5kgfGqdVFfl5qNTG9miZQ_nSRf-2xmodFSMzlEq0C_7RoC9ujw_wcB&gclsrc=aw.ds

She may be drawn to the tree area because it is like being outside and dogs instinctively like going on grass and soil. A lot of my apartment dwellers and elderly customers use a sod pad. I'm not sure if I mentioned that to you or not.

You take a large pan like a kitty litter pan or even a baby swimming pool. You create a platform frame with wire on top. Place newspaper or other absorbent material such as wood shavings under the platform and place sod on top of the wire frame. Since it is grass, your dog will go on it. You can remove solids and can spray the urine so it moves through and down into the absorbent material underneath. This lets you use the same piece of sod for a while before needing to replace it. You do need to replace the material under the platform.

If not a real tree, then it may just be that she is trying to hide her defecation there especially if you got upset with er when you found it there. In a small area I imagine it is evident pretty quickly if she defecates when you are there. You might take some of that feces matter and put a small amount on the pad so she understands that you want it on the pad.

Now you might take a tarp or old sheet or blanket and secure the edges along the top of the fence to stop her climbing out. You might also use some chicken wire across the top or bird netting to enclose the top. Anything to prevent her climbing out.

Customer: replied 5 months ago.
Hi Jane , it's not a real tree. Just decoration with Lego train around . Is there anyway I can stop her from defecate there ?

Since it isnt' real, she likely thinks it is a great place to "hide" her feces from your view. I know you have cleaned it well and I'm sure you let it soak in the last time you cleaned but if she is in the habit of defecating in that are, she'll still try to go there. You might block her access to that are but keeping her contained when you can not have eyes on her is the best way of stopping it. As I mentioned, you can fasten a sheet over the top of the pen to help keep her from climbing out which should help. Be sure it is an old one as you will likely have to secure it in multiple places. I've used the small zip ties to fasten covers on fences like this placing small holes along the edge of the sheet to secure it.

Customer: replied 5 months ago.
Morning Jane. I have problem again �� Yuui behaved good before . But now , I think she knows that if I put her into the fence and if she doesn't potty, she can't go out. So she just poop randomly with that fence and tried to get out. She always went to the pad to potty before , but this morning when we wake up, I put her back to the fence, and poop so quickly and on the floor and so excited to wait to get out. What can I do?

Either decrease the area she has so she has no choice but to go on the pad or increase the number of pads in the enclosure. If she went that quickly, I hope you were able to do the low toned NO so she understands it is not acceptable. I'd also put that sheet, or blanket over the top to keep her contained.

Customer: replied 5 months ago.
hi Jane. Thank you so much. I will use the cover to avoid her climb out. Btw, if I see Yuui trying to climb out of the fence, can I say No to stop her ?

Of course you can say NO to stop her. That will help her learn too. I'm ill and just checking in today which is why my responses are delayed.

Customer: replied 5 months ago.
oh , are you ok??

Just the flu. I'll be ok, just need to sleep. Thank you for asking.

Customer: replied 5 months ago.
Sleep tight. Take care ! Drink more hot water would be helpful

Thanks. Medication is kicking in. You have a good night.

Customer: replied 5 months ago.
Hi Jane, do you feel better ?

Not a lot. I've been off all morning but if you need anything, I'm probably going to be on for an hour or so.

Customer: replied 5 months ago.
I have a small door on the fence, and usually I locked it , I only open it when Yuui is out to play. And today, she went through that door by herself and went to the pad to potty. I am so happy with it
Customer: replied 5 months ago.
Even though it's just the beginning

That is fantastic news. I'm glad that it might be sinking in what you want her to do.

Customer: replied 5 months ago.
Yeah, hopefully she will gradually understand where to potty :)
Customer: replied 5 months ago.
Have a good rest , hopefully u can feel better soon

Thank you. I appreciate it.

Customer: replied 5 months ago.
Hi Jane. So far , Yuui's potty accuracy is around 70: 30. 70% of time she can potty on the pad, and the rest are accident. But I always caught her doing the " bad" thing , so I yelled "
No" and put her on the pad.
Customer: replied 5 months ago.
Do u think it's normal progress or she learned too slow ?

Actually I think she is doing very well. We are only on about a week of training and there wasn't a lot of consistency to start with and now that you are catching her, you can show her what is unacceptable. Thee is progress so it is moving in the right direction.

Customer: replied 5 months ago.
Ok! Now I feel better. I am so frustrated that she still can't go to the right place everytime

For a week she is doing great. Older dogs learn faster than pups but still take at a minimum a few weeks.

Customer: replied 5 months ago.
Hi Jane. May I ask that do u have any method that can stop puppy from eating my elder dog's stool?

Number one thing to do is to get the temptation out of the picture by removing feces as soon as possible and keep it cleaned up. You can also put hot sauce or other pepper product on them so the dog finds then terrible tasting. There are over the counter products that you can give your dog daily to prevent this condition. They work in some cases and if it works for you, then it’s an easy solution. You can buy them at most pet stores. One is called ForBId. Now since it is the older dog's feces, she would need to take it.

You can read more about Coprophagia here.

http://www.peteducation.com/article.cfm?c=21+1276&aid=155

Teach your girl the "leave it" command so that you can try and stop it if you notice her before she does it. This site teaches how to train fhe leave it command.

Customer: replied 5 months ago.
Thank you so much !

Anytime.

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