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Ask -Brad- Your Own Question
-Brad-
-Brad-, Dodge Dealership Tech
Category: Dodge
Satisfied Customers: 6958
Experience:  16 Yrs Chrysler/Dodge Technician. ASE Master Certified(L-1)
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This is sher again, if you answer, will you answer through

Customer Question

this is heysher again, if you answer, will you answer through email???
Submitted: 1 year ago.
Category: Dodge
Customer: replied 1 year ago.
Its a Dodge Durango 2002
Customer: replied 1 year ago.
I sent two messages but didnt follow through on first mess would like to send more info: Dodge Durango 2002...stalling cutting out leaving me in the road; replaced fuel pump, next buying new battery cables & "Sea Foam" adding with 3/4 full of premium gas...did briefly see (no bus) on dash, but EVERYONE THAT HAS REPLACED THE PCM, it has not made a difference, i am on disability and on a very LOW fixed income, please have pity on me today, i have a feeling THIS IS WHERE THE ANSWER IS but really cant afford this....this problem seems to be A MYSTERY, i have been researching for 4 hrs now & it seems like hunders of people have this problem, everhone follows all the suggested steps (i have read thrm all) but NONE OF ALL THE SUGGESTED STEPS WORK!!! Even the mechanics are baffled!!! I just keep reading the same thing, truck has power everything work, but not getting fuel. PLEASE HELP ME?????? Thank you in advance for your time...Thank you, ***** ***** husband has cancer & his surgery date is Oct 7th..& all of a sudden i have this problem...i havd tk get this truck running its our only vehicle, the other truck was repossessed because we could not afford two payments, please help me...your my last chance for an answer
Customer: replied 1 year ago.
Please please please don g charge me full price, i ne e d what i have i need for the cables, sea foam & gas
Expert:  -Brad- replied 1 year ago.

Good afternoon and welcome to JustAnswer!!

I see that your Durango is stalling and it's loosing fuel... Can I get the last 8 digits of your VIN so I can grab a wiring diagram? Also when it doesn't have fuel, do you have 12v and ground to the fuel pump? And is the check engine light on, if so what codes are active?

Talk soon,

Brad

Customer: replied 1 year ago.
Vin: 1b4hr38n1zf128433 sorry sir, not sure if the 1' or I' ....there are NO CODES showing when starting, not even check engine. I briefly seen the (no bus) flash once....not sure about ground wire does it need one???
Customer: replied 1 year ago.
Sir its not loosing gas, its not getting gas, gas tank has been dropped & new fuel pump installed...still stalling, dieing , or just not starting
Expert:  -Brad- replied 1 year ago.

I ran the VIN and it says Invalid.. Can you double check and just give me the last 8 digits.. Is ZF128433 correct?

Customer: replied 1 year ago.
Last 8 #2F128433 sorry
Customer: replied 1 year ago.
sir there is a 12v and ground to fuel pump
Expert:  -Brad- replied 1 year ago.

Thanks for the VIN!!

It comes back on a 2002 Forrest Green Durango with a 4.7 engine.. I attached the fuel pump wiring diagram.. If it doesn't have fuel then check for 12v on the Dark Green/Black wire at the pump and verify good ground on the Black wire.. If both are good pump should run and the pressure should be around 48 lbs.. If the fuel pump has 12v and ground and is not coming on then you have a bad pump..

If pump is running then check for pressure at the rail.. And if it has 48 lbs at the rail then you likely have no spark.. Can you comfirm of you do or don't have spark?

Customer: replied 1 year ago.
Going to check everything you asked...hope its not pump we just put a new one in...seem to work, went yo store snd back yesterday...but wont start today..their sure it has spark & their is NO SEPARATE wires our truck has a plug to connect....no separate wires... Do you think brand new pump is bad already??? What would be our next step??? ALSO HOW LATE CAN WE TALK??? What time do you get off work??? If all is good, do you think new battery cables & Sea Foam should be done....will have to drop gas tank and get back to you...thank you...please let me know how many questions i am allowed to ask & when you get off work???
Customer: replied 1 year ago.
Did you get my last question Mr. Brad ???
Expert:  -Brad- replied 1 year ago.

Sorry for the delay!!

If it has spark then it's most likely a fuel issue.. But diagnosing it isn't hard, you just need to try and start it and if the pump has 12v and ground then it's bad. You can try to beat the bottom of the tank to see if the pump comes on but to fix it right you will need a new pump. I recommend a OEM pump from the dealership because the aftermarket ones tend to not last as long..

Glad I could help,

Brad

Customer: replied 1 year ago.
Brad, the pump is not recieving power from the harness. My son confirmed the pump is working by jumping it with 12v directpy off the battery. The dash is displaying NO BUS, but its it still sending 5v to all sensors (my son used a multimeter and verified that the TPS, MAP, and Crank sensor are all recieving the 5v), but the truck will not send power to the pump assembly, and the fuel gauge rads empty despite the vehicle having about 1/4 of fuel.
Expert:  -Brad- replied 1 year ago.

Since the fuel pump doesn't have 12v then you need to remove the fuel pump relay and flip it upside down and locate pins 85 and 86 and see if pin 86 has 12v and see if 85 has a ground from the PCM. This will tell us which way to go to repair it.. Also you can jump pins 30 and 87 and the pump should run...

Keep me posted,

Brad

Customer: replied 1 year ago.
Ill try that, thank you. What does that have to do with the NO BUS on the odometer? any ideas?
Expert:  -Brad- replied 1 year ago.

The No Bus means your BUS communications is down which could be the root issue.. There are several bulletins on the issue and I see that you have 5v reference on all the sensors so that means the PCM isn't locked down which is a good thing but it just means it's something else.. Now in order to take out the BUS communication system you have to have a module that is shorted. If your vehicle were in my dealership the first thing I would do is perform a Module scan to see how many are responding and which ones aren't. Disconnect the dead modules and check for 12v and ground to the dead module and if good then replace that module..

Since you likely don't have a DRBIII which is the tool I would use then you will need to try and repair it yourself by following some of the bulletins below:

Case Number999925386

Vehicle IssueNO BUS flashes in odometer => Check ABS module connector for water intrusion...;What is the problem with the instrument panel/cluster? >> odometer In what area is the electrical problem? >> Cluster Have you checked for 5 volt circuit short to ground and loose PCM ground circuits? >> YES What is the problem with the odometer? >> "No Bus" in odometer

System or ComponentCustomer Concern (No DTCs);Instrument Panel / Cluster,Odometer

RecommendationCheck ABS module connector for water intrusion... If there is water in the module and connector, dry with shop air, clean with electrical contact cleaner, seal with dielectric grease. If water has intruded into the module itself replacement is recommended. Note: Additional symptoms may include: all warning lamps and headlamps stay on. multiple fault codes present in pcm, tcm, abs, acm and fcm. "Messages not received", ."no cluster", and "abs mismatched vin" will be among the messages

Case Number999923365

Vehicle IssueNO BUS flashes in odometer => Replace the Mechanical instrument cluster;What is the problem with the instrument panel/cluster? >> odometer In what area is the electrical problem? >> Cluster What is the problem with the odometer? >> "No Bus" in odometer

System or ComponentCustomer Concern (No DTCs);Instrument Panel / Cluster,Odometer

RecommendationReplace the Mechanical instrument cluster

And I know you have checked for 5v for the engine sensors but here is the buletin:

Case Number999925508

Vehicle IssueNO BUS flashes in odometer => Check for 5 volt circuit short to ground or loose ground at pcm...;What is the problem with the instrument panel/cluster? >> odometer In what area is the electrical problem? >> Cluster Have you checked for 5 volt circuit short to ground and loose PCM ground circuits? >> NO What is the problem with the odometer? >> "No Bus" in odometer

System or ComponentCustomer Concern (No DTCs);Instrument Panel / Cluster,Odometer

RecommendationCheck for 5 volt circuit short to ground or loose ground at pcm... The root cause is usually one of the two 5 volt supplies shorted to ground. If so, this will lock up the PCM and you will experience a die out, NO BUS, and a NO RESPONSE problem. The PCM will put out 5 volts on pin a17 (k7) and pin b31 (k6) when the PCM is powered up. See page 8w-80-59 of the 2000 XJ Service Manual, check pins 2 & 22 (power) and pins 31 &32 (ground). if ok then back probe pin 17 (5v) and pin 31 (c2-5v also). If there is no voltage coming out of these drivers, remove the wire and then probe the pin, if the voltage is 4.5 - 5.0 volts then the circuit is grounded, usually it ends of being a shorted crank sensor. As far as the SCI, see page 8w-80-61, the sci transmit will have 12 or 5 volts sent from the DRB3 when accessing the PCM, the SCI receive will have 5 or 12 volts on it just when the key is turned on. the pcm supplies the voltage on the SCI receive, the drb3 supplies the voltage on the SCI Transmit. Its unlikely, but there have been cases where the sci was shorted to VOLTAGE causing the PCM to lock up.

I hope this helps,

Brad

Customer: replied 1 year ago.
Okay, manually jumped the pump and had fuel pressure at the rail. Im guessing the NO BUS issue also cut the injectors or spark.
Expert:  -Brad- replied 1 year ago.

You are correct..

Let me know what you find,

Brad

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