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sprinkles08
sprinkles08, ASE Certified Technician
Category: Chrysler
Satisfied Customers: 16917
Experience:  ASE Master & Advanced level certified, Chrysler Master Certified, Trans and Hybrid Specialist
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2005 PT Cruiser: turbo..wont start..fill tank..drove home..dtc

Resolved Question:

2005 PT Cruiser (no turbo) won't start--- left overnight, started & ran 20 seconds- let sit (while recharging battery 2 hrs) ran for 5 seconds---- wife did fill tank and drove home 2 miles-- seems like fuel issue-- no dtc codes
Submitted: 4 years ago.
Category: Chrysler
Expert:  sprinkles08 replied 4 years ago.

Hello and welcome to JustAnswer!

 

Since this happened right after filling with fuel it's very possibly a fuel related issue. The first thing I would do is check fuel pressure and take a sample to see what is in the tank.

 

Closely look at the fuel. Make sure it isn't cloudy, that would indicate water. Make sure it will evaporate fully in about a minute or so. If it leaves behind an oil residue on your hand that is a sign of diesel fuel. Make sure the fuel isn't brownish. If you got a hold of some E-85 accidentally it could cause this too.

Customer: replied 4 years ago.
Tore into today--- pulled all necessary stuff off to get to fuel rail--- don't have & couldn't find anyone with proper adapter for fuel pressure--- I don't think it's fuel related now-- it will shoot fuel out probably 6 feet plus-- ran some into clear jar--- absolutely clear-- a friend said are you sure you have spark and I'm not sure I do--- coil primary & secondary ohm out within specs-- auto parts store said Chryslers eat cam position sensors--- couldn't find any way to test, so I replaced----- still won't start- I'm running out of ideas
Expert:  sprinkles08 replied 4 years ago.

How did you check for fault codes? Did you use a code reader or scan tool?

 

Does the engine turn over at a normal speed or does it seem to be cranking faster and more freely now?

 

Customer: replied 4 years ago.
I used a scan tool--- engine seems to turn over normal speed- just doesn't grab
Expert:  sprinkles08 replied 4 years ago.

Make sure there is no fuel in the area that could ignite, and then let's check for spark. Let me know what you find and we'll go from there.

 

Customer: replied 4 years ago.

No spark!!!!! #1 is easy to reach no spark with inline tester ( checked tester on lawn mower plug and it worked)...... I have also changed both the cam and crankshaft position sensors, as I was told these are real common failures... disconnected negative terminal @ battery and replaced 1 at a time and checked to see if it would run.... I thought yesterday that it was fuel related ( run once in morning 20-30 seconds) now it makes sense to me that something heats up and cuts out.....

 

 

No spark!!

Expert:  sprinkles08 replied 4 years ago.

Plug the crank sensor back in and leave the cam unplugged, crank the engine and see if it starts. It will have a long crank time if it does start, and it will have a low rev limiter of 2,500 RPM.

 

Customer: replied 4 years ago.
Does not start--- with or without cam sensor plug in
Expert:  sprinkles08 replied 4 years ago.

Have you checked fuses? If you haven't checked them yet go ahead and have a look to make sure none are blown. If fuses are ok we're going to have to do some electrical testing with a voltmeter.

 

Customer: replied 4 years ago.
Anything that said ignition start -ignition run- ASD have been checked at least twice (those are under hood in power distribution box) 1 in cabin box said something about ignition, and I checked it also
Expert:  sprinkles08 replied 4 years ago.

Ok great.

 

Do you have a voltmeter to do some testing?

 

Customer: replied 4 years ago.
yes
Expert:  sprinkles08 replied 4 years ago.

Unplug both the cam and crank sensor, turn the key on. Set the meter to 20v DC and ground the black lead. use the red lead to probe each terminal in the cam sensor connector and record the voltages. Let me know what you see.

 

Customer: replied 4 years ago.

 

crank and cam sensors unplugged--- key to run position----blk probe to battery grnd

test with red probe

 

3 wires tan (or brown) w/ yellow trace 5.0vdc

blk wire (center) 8.3vdc

orange 4.97vdc

 

Expert:  sprinkles08 replied 4 years ago.

8.3v on the black/light blue wire would be quite significant, enough to put the engine controller to sleep. Did your voltmeter auto-range there, and possibly went into the millivolt range? You shouldn't see more than a couple hundredths of a volt there.

 

Customer: replied 4 years ago.

 

Yes (sorry) 8.3 mv changed range .008vdc

Expert:  sprinkles08 replied 4 years ago.

Excellent! I was worried.

 

We've got to get to either one of the fuel injectors or the coil connector. Whatever is easiest for you. Unplug one of your choice and find the dark green/orange wire. This will have power for 1-2 seconds when you first turn the key on, and then again while cranking. With the cam and crank sensors plugged back in check to see if it powers up while cranking, and if not then see if it powers up momentarily at key-in.

 

Customer: replied 4 years ago.

Sensors plugged back in---- pulled coil primary wire harness---- grn/ orange trace

 

 

hard to see quick on-- somewhere 3vdc ( I saw the 3 briefly)--- cranking was up to 3 vdc-- but seemed to drop down as low as 2.6-2.8 vdc

Expert:  sprinkles08 replied 4 years ago.

We should have seen battery voltage there - the meter didn't do something odd to us again did it?

 

Customer: replied 4 years ago.
yes--- manually set range to volts got 11.85vdc at first--- during cranking it went as low as 6vdc then back up to approx. 10vdc but I never got close to 12vdc again.
Expert:  sprinkles08 replied 4 years ago.

It sounds like the battery is probably dropping pretty low on us at this point then.

 

Do you have a test light? Attach the alligator clip to battery positive and use the probe end to probe each of the other two wires in the coil connector. Crank the engine and watch for the test light to flash as it cranks.

 

Customer: replied 4 years ago.
my regular test light didn't work---- I grabbed one of those power probe testers and all 3 terminals were lighting up rapidly while cranking
Expert:  sprinkles08 replied 4 years ago.

Does your regular test light work ok if you connect it to the battery posts?

 

Customer: replied 4 years ago.
No
Expert:  sprinkles08 replied 4 years ago.
Make sure you are checking to make sure these other two wires are being pulsed ground (I don't know how your particular power probe works). This is why we wanted the alligator clip of the test light on battery positive, so it would light up when the probe was touched to ground. Since you saw flashing there on the other wires at the coil connector with the engine cranking it does sound like you had the coil drivers working with the engine cranking - the power probe flashing because it was being momentarily grounding. If you for sure have flashing there with the wires being pulsed ground but you have no spark, then you've got a bad coil pack.
Customer: replied 4 years ago.
Well, found a good test light and both sides pulsed ( not as bright as straight battery voltage) so I went to Carquest this morning and bought the ignition coil--- installed and it ran for almost a minute--- rechecking after it died--- I have NO spark.--- still have same problem- something cuts out no dtc codes
Expert:  sprinkles08 replied 4 years ago.

Recheck the coil drivers with the test light again and see if they flash while cranking, see if there is battery voltage on the dark green/orange wire at the coil also.

 

Customer: replied 4 years ago.

just checked it all------- have 11.85 vdc at center terminal when initial key to run---- drops to 6-8 vdc while cranking

 

 

still have weak but definate pulse from both right & left sides of connector while cranking ( good test light -alligator clip to positive of battery)

Expert:  sprinkles08 replied 4 years ago.
If you have battery voltage on the dark green/orange wire and the other two are pulsing ground but you have no spark then you have a bad coil. Return that coil and get a quality one from your dealer.
sprinkles08, ASE Certified Technician
Category: Chrysler
Satisfied Customers: 16917
Experience: ASE Master & Advanced level certified, Chrysler Master Certified, Trans and Hybrid Specialist
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