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Mike S.
Mike S., Chevy Mechanic
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Experience:  ASE Certified Master Technician
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Chevy: tall deck but no one seems to know how to determine the two

Customer Question

How do i determine a chevy 502 short deck and tall deck i need a chevy 502 tall deck but no one seems to know how to determine the two apart please help???????????????????
Submitted: 4 years ago.
Category: Chevy
Expert:  Mike S. replied 4 years ago.

You could look at the casting numbers.

 

 

 

 

Expert:  Mike S. replied 4 years ago.

http://www.gmpartsdirect.com/results.cfm?perfPackages=1&pkgid=67

GM PART # 10237292

DESCRIPTION: Bare Block
This Gen VI cast iron block is a strong foundation for a big-block engine project. The "short-deck" block was designed to meet the needs of a powerful and dependable 500cid engine for street or boat usage. The block's cylinder walls are "siamesed" and are bored to 4.47". The deck surfaces are reinforced to improve the head gasket sealing. Four-bolt main bearing caps are installed to reinforce cylinder barrels and add strength to the bottom end. Technical Notes: The distance from the crankshaft centerline to the deck surfaces is 9.80". It is used on 502 engines assembly, and partial engine. and can use roller tappet or stndard tappet. Casting P/N 10237300. Maximum over bore is 4.500".

 

 

Customer: replied 4 years ago.

besides the casting numbers is there any other way to know you have a tall deck the whole thing with a tall deck is that my friends with eagle cranks told me i need a 502 tall deck to make a 572 or 573 stroker for a customer is this true or can i use any 502 block

Expert:  Mike S. replied 4 years ago.

http://www.gmpartsdirect.com/performance_parts/GMPP_2009_Catalog.pdf

Our big-torque HT502 crate engine has more pull than a tugboat with a

stroker motor (See page 230 for details.)

 

The easiest way to put a forged stroker crankshaft in your LS engine is using

GM Performance Parts' new LSX crankshafts, which are available in four stroke

sizes up to 4.125 inches. They feature the standard-length snout and can be

used without modification on most engines. LS7 and LS9 crankshafts can be

used, but require special components and/or modifications to their snouts to

accommodate standard, wet-sump oiling systems.

 

 

 

Customer: replied 4 years ago.
that didnt answer my question, can you use any 502 to make a 572 striker or only the tall deck?
Expert:  Mike S. replied 4 years ago.

Let me get this straight, you want to know if you can put a crankshaft with a longer stroke in a 502 block? What is the stroke of the crankshaft you want to put in? That chart showed the max stroke along with the casting number and deck height.

 

Expert:  Mike S. replied 4 years ago.
It said the easiest way to put a forged stroker crankshaft in your LS engine is using

GM Performance Parts' new LSX crankshafts, which are available in four stroke

sizes up to 4.125 inches. All of those blocks will except a stroke that long.

Customer: replied 4 years ago.
i get that but can i use a 9.800 deck 502 and stroke it to a 572 573 will it work i dont care about lsx gm performance i would just like to know since ur the chevy tech if i can stroke it to that size if the deck height is a 9.800 i know the 10.200 works will the 9.800 work??????? as the stroker "i want to build"???????????????????????
Expert:  Mike S. replied 4 years ago.
I would have to know the stroke of the crankshaft not just the cu.in that it will create. You could always go with shorter pistons. The 9.8 deck will only handle a stroke of 4.25 or 4.50 depending on the casting number.
Customer: replied 4 years ago.

okay my customer wants a 502 stroked to 572 with a 871 blower i cant tell you about the block because i have not purchased it yet due to the fact i have machine shop guys and a freind that wrks for eagle saying you can only get a 572 stroker if its a 502 tall deck witch makes the deck height 10.200 but if i buy a standard 502 (bare block) and a stroker assymbly to make a 572 will it work can i bore the small deck to specifications and will it wrk????

Expert:  Mike S. replied 4 years ago.

As an example: 8 cylinders times (4.600x3.14pie) bore times a 4.500 stroke=519.984 cu. in.

Bored 0.030 over =523.28 cu .in.

Bored 0.060 over =526 cu. in.

Bored 0.090 over=530 cu .in.

 

572 cu.in. Divided by 8 divided by (4.600x3.14) =4.95 stroke

572 cu.in. divided by 8 divided by (4.690x3.14)=4.85 stroke

 

Then I would say no, you cant do it, you need a stroke that block will not handle, like I said only up to 4.500 stroke. You will need a bigger bore block.

 

4.700 bore

You would need this.

DESCRIPTION: Bare Block - GMPP/DRCE
This GM performance parts/DRCE 2 Bare Block is a redesigned Old's DRCE. This block was designed for competition in 500ci Pro Stock Drag Racing or similar type usage. Use with cylinder heads P/N 24502585 or P/N 12480010 only. The main differences between the Old's DRCE and these semi-finished GMPP "2" blocks are the camshaft has raised to 5.750", the deck height is a 9.300" and can be reduced to approximately 9.000", the distributor hole is moved rearward on the block, and the overall weight has been reduced approximately 11 pounds. The cylinder bore centerline spacing has been increased from 4.840" to 4.900", the maximum legal bore spacing for NHRA Pro Stock competition. With the new bore spacing of 4.900" it will allow the use of big bore with short stroke piston and crank shaft combinations to enhance performance. The increase in cylinder bore spacing reduces valve shrouding and permits the use of larger valves to improve air flow. The semi finished cylinder is bored to 4.500" dia. maximum recommended bore dia is 4.700. New elliptical siamese cylinder barrels maximuze wall thickness on the major and minor thrust axes. This allows lighter weight piston and rod combinations and improve carburetor, manifold port alignment with pro stock type induction systems. This block's cam tunnel will accommodate a 2.166" cam bearing. Other improvements are No. 2 and No. 4 main bearing bulkheads are relocated .060" to distribute crankshaft loads easily. The lifter bosses has been replaced with solid bar, and the lifter holes are not drilled to allow engine builders to position them for there own valve train geometry. The head bolt holes are not drilled, so the engine builder can accomodate Pontiac S/D, Oldsmobile DRCE, or Chevrolet bolt patterns. The rear flange has a hybrid patter that accommodates Oldsmobile, Pontiac, or Chevrolet bellhousing. They use new four-bolt 8620 steel main bearing caps with splayed outer bolts to improve main bearing bulkhead durability and resist bearing bore distortion under high load. The oil pan rails have been spread .400 per side to provide room for longer stroke crankshafts. The starter motor can be mounted on either side of the GMPP/DRCE Block. Technical Notes: This high-strength iron block has brinell hardness of 210 to 230 and requires a camshaft with distributor gear behind the rear bearing. The balance of parts to complete this engine are Chevrolet Big Block (water pumps, crank, cam, balancers, flywheel, and manifolds). This block is cast with the GM Performance Parts logo on it

http://www.gmpartsdirect.com/results.cfm?perfPackages=1&pkgid=67

or this

8x(4.700x3.14)x4.60 stroke=543 cu.in.

9.25-9.00"deck height, without fuel pump boss, siamese wall cylinder, 4.590-4.700" bore range, 4 bolt main, 22 degree main bolt degree, 4140 steel cap, 2.50" crankshaft journal diameter, dry oiling, 2 piece rear main seal, 4.60" max stroke, 255 lbs 1400+ max horsepower pro useage.

http://www.gmpartsdirect.com/results.cfm?perfPackages=1&curpage=3&startrow=11&pkgid=67

I dont see a way to do it without shorter rods or pistons.

Customer: replied 4 years ago.

so tall deck is 10.200 deck height correct or is 9.800 and above considered tall.... here is a website with a list of bore and stroke for all big blocks the 502 section has my attention http://www.roadsters.com/bbc/#bore is this a bore chart for all 502s my interpertaion of this chart says i can get a 502 with the right stroke and bore and i can get 573 without goin to thin on the walls.........

Expert:  Mike S. replied 4 years ago.

Sorry about last night, it was late I fell alseep.

Ok, this morning lets get started with this...

 

First of all, I think their calculations for determining cu.in. are off. They said, to calculate the displacement of an eight-cylinder engine: bore x bore x stroke x 6.2832. Now, for example take the 520 Engine with a 4.500" bore and a 4.00" stroke, they say it is a 509 cu.in. They came up with that with their formula 4.5x4.5x4x6.2832=508.9392,which according to their calculations is correct. My calculations are (4.5 bore x3.14)x4strokex8 cylinders=452.16 cu.in. A big difference, a 452 versus 509.

 

 

Ok, the way I see it the bore on most of those blocks are 4.6 and only allow the maximum stroke of 4.500, so that would be (4.6x3.14)x4.5x8=519.984 So, in order to get a 572 cu.in., you would need a stroke of, 572\8 cylinders x (4.6 x 3.14 bore)=4.95 but they only allow the max stroke of 4.5 so that is 4.95-4.5=0.45" too long of a stroke. So a connecting rod that much shorter or 0.45" shorter would prevent the piston from hitting a valve or extending past the top of the cylinder.

 

If you are unsure of the deck height, measure it. The distance from the crankshaft centerline to the deck surfaces. The distance from the crankshaft centerline to the deck surfaces is 9.80". It is used on 502 engines assembly. The "short-deck" block was designed to meet the needs of a powerful and dependable 500cid engine for street or boat usage. So they are saying the 9.80" deck is the "short-deck".

Expert:  Mike S. replied 4 years ago.

I read yet another formula, bore2 x stroke x 0.7854 x cylinders=displacement

 

The area formula has always been pie x radius x squared= area of a circle, so I was wrong. So it's a 4.6 bore and a max stroke of 4.5 and 8 cylinders. So, the area of the bore is (4.6 x 0.5)= radius 2.3 , radius squared = 5.29. 5.29 times pie (3.14) =16.61, 16.61 x stroke 4.5 x 8 cylinder=597.98

 

So, to get a 572 displacement with a bore of 4.6 (area=16.61) x 8 cylinders you would only need a stroke of 572\(16.61x8)=4.30 stroke, plenty under the limit of 4.500
Customer: replied 4 years ago.
so can i use the short deck(9.80) 502 block with ur second formula if the block is unmolested i can use it to make my 572 or does it have to be a the tall deck block.....
Expert:  Mike S. replied 4 years ago.
It can be a short deck (9.80) 502.
Customer: replied 4 years ago.
so if i buy an old 502 block never been bored ashort or tall i can be able to acheive my 572 stroker? yes means im happy and can go pick up the motor tomorrow lol
Expert:  Mike S. replied 4 years ago.

I say it can be done with a 9.800 deck

 

 

Bore 4.600"[1] x stroke 4.375"2 x 8 cylinders

(4.6\2=2.3) radius 2.3, radius squared= 2.3 x2.3 = 5.29, 5.29 x 3.14=area 16.6106"

Area 16.6106" x stroke 4.375 x 8 cylinders = 581.371 cu.in.

 

19212196 1

Standard Deck Bowtie Race Block

(not shown)

  • CNC-machined cast-iron 4-bolt block
  • 4.240" finished bore
  • 4.600" max bore (.250" min wall thickness)
  • Standard deck height (9.800")
  • Tested to 1200 horsepower!

 

4.3752 Stroke This crank will fit all 2pcs rear seal BBC GM engines.

454 502 BB Chevy Crank 4.375 EXTERNAL BBC Crankshaft

BBC 4340

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/454-502-BB-Chevy-Crank-4.375-EXTERNAL-BBC-Crankshaft-_W0QQitemZ170401580441QQcmdZViewItem?rvr_id=&itemid=170401580441

 

 

Cast-iron Bowtie Race BlockS

If you're looking to build a drag racing engine capable of producing

1200 horses or more, a GM Performance Parts' cast-iron Bowtie

Race Block is your starting point. It is designed for engine builders

who want to custom-machine their blocks for specific racing

applications. Toward that end, these premium castings have thick

deck surfaces, improved oiling, improved coolant flow and splayed

4-bolt steel bearing caps. Everything is secured with premium

fasteners. The combination of a GM Performance Parts cast-iron

Bowtie Race Block and your unique engine building skills will put

you down the track ahead of the competition.

See chart on page 231 for complete specifications.

Cast-iron Bowtie Race Block Technical Notes:

  • Precision CNC-machining means +/- 0.001" tolerances
  • Blocks are available in short deck (9.800") or tall deck (10.200")
  • A sonic bore check data sheet is provided with each block
  • Siamese cylinder bores
  • Improved cooling around number one cylinder
  • Accepts Mark IV or Gen V-VI cylinder heads
  • Use Gen V head gaskets with Mark IV and Gen V cylinder heads
  • Use Gen VI head gaskets with Gen VI cylinder heads
  • Requires Mark IV design two-piece rear main seal oil pans
  • Requires Mark IV design crankshafts
  • Can use Mark IV and Gen V-VI camshafts, timing sets, lifters and

timing cover (aftermarket belt drive timing covers may require

clearancing)

  • Blind-tapped head bolt holes; extra inner head bolt bosses

provided

  • 4-bolt SAE 8620 main caps splayed 16° on the three

center mains

  • Priority main oiling wet-sump system
  • Provisions for dry-sump oil line provided
  • Honed camshaft and crankshaft bores
  • 0.842" lifter bores (maximum 1.06") may be relocated
  • Distributor gear clearance at bottom of number 8 cylinder bore

should be checked

  • Machined mechanical fuel pump pad

A. 19212197

Tall Deck Bowtie Race Block

  • CNC-machined cast-iron 4-bolt block
  • 4.240" finished bore
  • 4.600" max bore (.250 min wall thickness)
  • Tall deck height (10.200")
  • Tested to 1200 horsepower!

 

88890534 HT502-Truck Replacement Engine 502 cu in 4.00 stroke 4.47 forged aluminum pistons557 338 512 100

12568782 ZZ502/502 Partial Engine 502 cu in 402 N/A N/A 101,103,105,107

12568778 502 HO-with Iron Heads and Roller Cam 502 cu in 602 450 550 102

19201332 ZZ502 Deluxe-(Deluxe/Assembled) with Aluminum Heads 502 cu in 611 502 567 104

12371171 ZZ502 Deluxe Kit, with Aluminum Heads 502 cu in 602 502 567 105

12496963 ZZ502 Base Engine, with Aluminum Heads 502 cu in 504 502 567 106

12371204 ZZ502 Base Kit, with Aluminum Heads 502 cu in 532 502 567 107

12499121 Ram Jet 502-PFI with Aluminum Heads 502 cu in 608 502 565 108

19201333 ZZ572/620 Deluxe 572 cu in 580 620 650 110

12498792 ZZ572/620 Base 572 cu in 514 620 650 111

19201334 ZZ572/720R Deluxe 572 cu in 720 685 112

12498826 ZZ572/720R Base 572 cu in 720 685 113

 


Customer: replied 4 years ago.
herer is the block casting number(10237300) to a 502 i might buy today if it will work to make my 572 stroker. will this block be the one that i can use?
Expert:  Mike S. replied 4 years ago.

http://www.gmpartsdirect.com/performance_parts/store/catalog/Category.jhtmlCATID=343.html

10237292 Bare Block "502"
This Gen VI cast iron block is a strong foundation for a big-block engine project. The "short-deck" block was designed to meet the needs of a powerful and dependable 500cid engine for street or boat usage. The block's cylinder walls are "siamesed" and are bored to 4.47". The deck surfaces are reinforced to improve the head gasket sealing. Four-bolt main bearing caps are installed to reinforce cylinder barrels and add strength to the bottom end. Small Image
Technical Notes: The distance from the crankshaft centerline to the deck surfaces is 9.80". It is used on 502 engines assembly, and partial engine. and can use roller tappet or stndard tappet. Casting P/N 10237300. Maximum over bore is 4.500".

 

4.5 bore= 15.896 area x 4.375 stroke x 8 cyl= 556.36875 cu.in.

Nope!

Mike S., Chevy Mechanic
Category: Chevy
Satisfied Customers: 4994
Experience: ASE Certified Master Technician
Mike S. and 2 other Chevy Specialists are ready to help you
Expert:  Mike S. replied 4 years ago.

http://www.gmpartsdirect.com/performance_parts/store/catalog/Category.jhtmlCATID=343.html

Chevrolet Big Block Quick Reference "Block Chart"
Chevrolet Gen VI Production Short Deck Big Block Chevrolet Production 502 Block Chevrolet Gen V Bow Tie Short Deck Big Block Chevrolet Gen V Bow Tie Tall Deck Big Block DRCE Block Chevrolet Mark IV Aluminum SLI
Part Number 12550307 10237292 24502500 24502502 24502572 12370850
Block Material Cast Iron Iron Cast Iron Cast Iron Cast Iron Aluminum
Cylinder Wall Type Non-Siamese Siamesed Siamesed Siamesed Siamesed Siamesed
Cylinder Deck Height 9.800" 9.800" 9.800" 10.200" 9.300"-9.500" 9.800"
Cylinder Bore Range 4.250-4.310" 4.47-4.500" 4.250-
4.600"
4.250"-4.600" 4.500"-4.600" 4.118"-4.300"
No. Bearing Cap Bolts 4 4 4 4 4 4
Cap Bolt Orientation Straight Straight Straight Splayed 16° Splayed Splayed
Bearing Cap Type Cast Iron Cast Iron 8620 Steel 8620 Steel 8620 Steel 8620 Steel
Crankshaft Journal Dia. 2.75" 2.75" 2.75" 2.75" 2.75" 2.75"
Oil Sump type wet wet wet wet dry wet or dry
Crankshaft Seal Type 1 piece 1 piece 2 piece 2 piece 2 piece 2 piece
Design Max. Stroke 4.250" 4.600" 4.600" 4.600" 4.600" 4.375"
Weight (lbs.-bare) N/A 269 270 273 255 110
Intended Usage Street Street-
Modified
Profess'l Comp. Profess'l Comp. Profess'l Comp. Street-Modified
Fuel Pump Boss Has Fuel Pump Boss No Fuel Pump Boss No Fuel Pump Boss No Fuel Pump Boss Has Fuel Pump Boss
Non-Standard Parts Required Special Features Production Style with Fuel Pump Boss & Has 1 Piece Rear Main Seal This block is good for 700 H.P. - Fully Race prepared Machining
- Valley Head Bolt Bosses
- enlarged Main Oil Gallery
- Fully Race prepared Machining
- Valley Head Bolt Bosses
- enlarged Main Oil Gallery
- No Head Bolt Holes
- No Lifter Holes
- Can be machined to 9.000 deck height.
This is an Improved ZLI Block. Good for 650 H.P.

10237292 makes 584.982 cu.in. 24502500 makes 611.24cu.in.
Customer: replied 4 years ago.
Is there a tall deck and short deck blocks in the v1 generation blocks from 02 an down
Expert:  Mike S. replied 4 years ago.

http://www.crateenginedepot.com/store/product1.aspx?Product_ID=230

This Gen VI cast iron block is a strong foundation for a big-block engine project. The "short-deck" block was designed to meet the needs of a powerful and dependable 500cid engine for street or boat usage. The block's cylinder walls are "siamesed" and are bored to 4.47". The deck surfaces are reinforced to improve the head gasket sealing. Four-bolt main bearing caps are installed to reinforce cylinder barrels and add strength to the bottom end. Technical Notes: The distance from the crankshaft centerline to the deck surfaces is 9.80". It is used on 502 engines assembly, and partial engine. and can use roller tappet or stndard tappet. Casting P/N 10237300. Maximum over bore is 4.500".

 

Expert:  Mike S. replied 4 years ago.

http://www.strokerengine.com/GMBBC.html

 

BB Chevrolet 502 Bare Block, Gen VI

BBC_B_10237292.jpg

Part # 10237292
Bore as Shipped: 4.470"
Max. Bore: 4.500"
Max. Stroke: 4.250"
Main Bore: 2.750"
Rear Seal: 1-piece
Cam Bearings: CH-12
Main Caps: Straight 4-bolt

 

 

This Gen VI block is a strong foundation for a big block project. The short deck block was designed to meet the needs of a powerful and dependable 500ci engine. It is good for 700 hp, perfect for street use and sportsman type racing. The cylinder walls are siamesed and are bored to 4.470". The decks are reinforced to improve head gasket sealing. 4-bolt main caps are installed to reinforce the cylinder barrels and add strength to the bottom end. It does not have a fuel pump boss for mechanical pump.
Customer: replied 4 years ago.
can you please just answer me if this block(10237300) the one i have!!! will work if so wats the bore i need to get done from my machine shop. i can get everything i need already from my friends at eagle i just need to know if the block i have in front of me will work if it can then i can start building it asap i have 4 days no more answers on this and that blocks please will my block wrk it was made in 95 8cl 4bm this i know but can i use it if so wat can i potentially make with it.....Ex:496 523 540 556 572 573 631 ect.... wat can i make with ******my block*******?????????????????????????? Please help me
Expert:  Mike S. replied 4 years ago.

The 10237300 has a maximum bore of 4.500"

Area is 15.89625 x 4.125 x 8 =524

Expert:  Mike S. replied 4 years ago.
You gotta try to find something with a max bore of 4.6, like 10237292 makes 584.982 cu.in. 24502500 makes 611.24cu.in
Customer: replied 4 years ago.

okay so wat can i make with the block i have can you tell me that?10237300 or wats the biggest i can go with "my block" need to know asap 496 525 540 560.....ect........

Expert:  Mike S. replied 4 years ago.
If you get a crank with a 4.125" stroke you can get 524 cu.in.
Customer: replied 4 years ago.
thats it thats as big as i can or can i go bigger the block has standered bore of .240 i think so how big can i go ?
Expert:  Mike S. replied 4 years ago.
What? Its a max bore of 4.500"
Customer: replied 4 years ago.
im not sure wat the max bore is i just know finish bore .240 and lets say the max safee bore is .500 wat can it potenialy come out to...
Expert:  Mike S. replied 4 years ago.

Heres a crank with a 4.250 stroke.

http://www.spiderautomotive.com/445442526385.html

 

Customer: replied 4 years ago.

wat will that stroke give me ......or can it give me.... i dont know how to calculate all that stuff thats why i ask you? when i say 496 520 540 572 573 .......

Expert:  Mike S. replied 4 years ago.

Ok, a max bore of 4.500', stroke 4.250 would be area 540 cu.in.

Here you go, 454 502 572 BB Chevy Crank BBC STROKER Crankshaft RP$
4340 FORGED CRANK YOU CHOOSE YOUR STROKE

http://www.hydroponicsonline.com/store/454-502-572-BB-Chevy-Crank-BBC-STROKER-Crankshaft-RP_250297585135.html

 

Expert:  Mike S. replied 4 years ago.

4.000, 4.25, 4.375, 4.500" Stroker Crank for 2pc rear seal cranks

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=250297585135&viewitem=

 

Expert:  Mike S. replied 4 years ago.
That 4.500" stroke and a bore of 4.500" makes an exact 572 cu.in.
Customer: replied 4 years ago.

So wat ur telling is my block with that bore and that stroke crank in it i will have a 572 exactly.....Smile

Expert:  Mike S. replied 4 years ago.
Yes sir with that 4.500" stroke.
Customer: replied 4 years ago.

now that we know my block will work and that bore and stroke will work .....im gonna run a 871 blower on it due to high compression with those pistons wat heads(oval rect.) and pistons should i use to lower my compression between 7.5 8.7 max this was the second part of my headache. thank you

Expert:  Mike S. replied 4 years ago.
Open chamber heads. Make sure they aren't pop up pistons.
Customer: replied 4 years ago.

can you recomend any paticular head or pistons......that will give us our 7.5 8.7 max comratio. for my motor.

Expert:  Mike S. replied 4 years ago.

There are so many different manufacturers and shapes and sizes, that would take me hours. Do some google seaches for speed shops or performance parts and join them and get their catalogs. I am sure there are going to be several to your liking.

 

Expert:  Mike S. replied 4 years ago.

http://www.flatlanderracing.com/

Click on the left where it says pistons.

 

Expert:  Mike S. replied 4 years ago.
BoreStrokeRod
Length
Pin
Dia.
Comp.
Height
Dome
Volume
Weight
Grams
C/R
112cc
C/R
118cc
C/R
124cc
Part #Price/Set
4.5004.5006.5350.9901.395-28cc5808.88.58.2BBC395500I28
Home >> Pistons >> Mahle >> PowerPak >> Chevy >> BB Inverted
Customer: replied 4 years ago.
hey how do i find out the driver size of my subwoofer i have a mtx thunder 9500 superwoofer a 12'' i look up the specs i see mag. weight,voice coil size, but how do i know wat the driver size is?
Expert:  Mike S. replied 4 years ago.
I dont know much about speakers, you might want to relist that under car electronics questions.

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