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Roadside Jerry
Roadside Jerry, Auto Mechanic
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99 GMC SIERRA 5.3 Odometer/PRNDL dash indicator intermittent

Customer Question

99 GMC SIERRA 5.3 Odometer/PRNDL dash indicator intermittent then not visible. Instrument cluster seem to check out good. What else?
Submitted: 5 years ago.
Category: Car
Expert:  Roadside Jerry replied 5 years ago.

Hi, the common cause of this problem is the Park Neutral switch, also called the range switch, it is on the side ot the transmission. I will send some info on this from the factory bulletins,and a picture of the switch.

graphic

 

 

Subject:LCT1000 PRNDL Inoperative or Reads Incorrect, Possible DTCs After Installation of a New NSBU

Models:.

 


When servicing the vehicle with the VIN you entered, the following diagnosis might bhelpful if the vehicle exhibits the described symptoms.

Condition/Concern:

After the installation of an NSBU switch, the PRNDL may be inoperative, read incorrect for the selected gear range, difficult to adjust or the following DTCs may be set P0708, P0847, P0872, P0875, P1711, and P1713. You may notice that the new NSBU switch was difficult to install and could not be pushed onto the selector shaft by hand. The selector shaft is mushroomed on the threaded end. Once the NSBU switch is forced over the mushroomed selector shaft the switch boss is enlarged and will not fit the selector shaft properly.

Recommendation/Instructions:

The selector shaft should be filed with a flat file to remove the mushroomed surface and new NSBU switch should be installed on the transmission using only hand pressure.

Please follow this diagnosis process thoroughly and complete each step. If the condition exhibited is resolved without completing every step, the remaining steps do not need to be performed. If these steps do not resolve the condition, please contact GM TAC for further diagnostic assistance. This diagnostic approach was developed for the vehicle with the VIN you entered and should not be automatically be used for other vehicles with similar symptoms.

#02-07-30-011C: Slow or No Engagement of Automatic Transmission, No Start, Blank PRNDL Display, Flashing PRNDL, DTC P0708, P0872, P0847, P0875, P1711, P1713 or U1000 Set (Diagnose Condition, Repair) - (Jun 21, 2004)

Subject:Slow or No Engagement of Automatic Transmission, No Start, Blank PRNDL Display, Flashing PRNDL, DTC P0708, P0872, P0847, P0875, P1711, P1713 or U1000 Set (Diagnose Condition, Repair According to Procedure)

Models:2001-2004 Chevrolet Silverado
2001-2004 GMC Sierra
with Allison® LCT1000 Automatic Transmission (RPO M74) and
6.6L DuramaxTM Diesel Engine (RPO LB7) or 8.1L Gas Engine (RPO L18)


This bulletin is being revised to add model years and additional model information and add graphics. Please discard Corporate Bulletin Number 02-07-30-011B (Section 07 -- Transmission/Transaxle).


 

Condition

 

Some customers may comment on one or more of the following conditions.

The PRNDL display is flashing.
The engine will not start.
The "Service Engine Soon" Indicator lamp is illuminated.
The transmission does not shift properly.
The vehicle will not move, transmission will not engage.

Cause

 

Moisture contamination within the Park Neutral Position (PNP) Switch may cause this condition. This is sometimes referred to as the Neutral Start Back-up (NSBU) Switch. On a left turn, water spray from the left front tire is directed directly at this switch. Proper installation of the "Front Shield" and "Rear Shield" are essential for proper repairs.

Technician Diagnosis


Object
Click

 

This bulletin ONLY applies to vehicles equipped with a two connector PNP switch as shown above.

A complete and through diagnosis must be performed by a qualified electrical technician to determine the cause and avoid needless replacement of good components.

Important: The Transmission Control Module (TCM) and or the Pressure Switch Manifold (PSM) should NOT be replaced unless properly diagnosed. They are probably not the cause of the concern. It is often assumed the module is the cause of the concern when, in fact, it is another component or the wiring between the components that causes the concern.

Important: Remember, everything starts with a properly operating Neutral Start Back Up (NSBU) switch. The NSBU switch has been incorporated into what is now called the Park Neutral Position (PNP) switch. If the PNP switch does not provide the proper voltage signal to the module indicating the transmission is in either Park or Neutral, the module will not allow the starter operation. After the engine is started, and the shift lever is moved to either Reverse or one of the drive positions, the range selected portion of the PNP switch portion provides a voltage input to the module as to what range the driver has manually selected for transmission operation. The module then controls pressures, shift points and other transmission functions based on the voltage input received from the range portion of the PNP switch.

The technician may find one or more of the following conditions. The list of these conditions does not imply any type of frequency or order. They are random events and may occur in any order.

DTC P0708, Neutral start/backup (PNP or NSBU) switch
DTC P0847, Pressure Switch Manifold (PSM)
DTC P0872, Pressure Switch Manifold (PSM)
DTC P0875, Pressure Switch Manifold (PSM)
DTC P1711, Pressure Switch Manifold (PSM)
DTC P1713, Pressure Switch Manifold (PSM)
DTC U1000, Serial Data Communications
Blank PRNDL Display
Flashing PRNDL Display
Slow or No Engagement of Automatic Transmission

Blank PRNDL Display

A blank PRNDL display may indicate a condition with the PNP switch and/or one or more of the four signal circuits from the PNP to the TCM.

  1. Pin A, Circuit 771 (BLK/WHT)
  2. Pin B, Circuit 773 (GRA)
  3. Pin C, Circuit 776 (WHT)
  4. Pin D, Circuit 772 (YEL)

Or, a blank PRNDL display may also occur if an out of line condition exists with the Serial Data Circuit (CKT 2470, yellow wire) from the TCM to Splice Pack 205.

Diagnostic Tip

 

  1. Connect the Tech 2® to the vehicle.
  2. Power up the Tech 2®.
  3. Does the Tech 2® communicate with the TCM? If not, inspect the serial data circuit, CKT 2470 (Yellow wire), between the TCM and Splice Pack 205. Specifically inspect connector C106, a five terminal connector located below the left side underhood bussed electrical center, directly beneath the red battery cable terminal connection. Perform a mating terminal pull test on all of the terminals in this connector. Repair as required.
  4. Observe the Gear Selected screen on the scan tool. The following values should be shown on the Tech 2® display and the vehicle's instrument panel cluster (if equipped with the I/P display).
    "8" (shifter should be in the Park position)
    "7" (shifter should be in the Reverse position)
    "5" (shifter should be in the Drive position)
    "3" (shifter should be in the Third gear position)
    "2" (shifter should be in the Second gear position)
    "1" (shifter should be in the First gear position)
    "0" (shifter should be in the Neutral Position)

If the Gear Selected display does not match the shifter position in the vehicle, diagnose using one of the following methods.

Obtain a new PNP switch kit, P/N 29540479, from the Parts Department.
1. Disconnect the wiring connector from the original transmission mounted PNP switch.
2. Connect the new switch to the wiring connector.
3. Return to Step #4 above and observe the display as you rotate the switch. If all positions indicate properly, refer to the Correction section below.
Use the DTC P0708 diagnostic chart in Service Information (SI) under Transmission/Transaxle/Automatic Transmission - Allison. Reference SI Document ID #769549 for the wiring schematic for this symptom.

The PNP switch, as referenced in SI, is known as the NSBU switch in the Parts information. It is now serviced with a Park Neutral Position Switch Kit, P/N 29540479.

Flashing PRNDL Display

A flashing PRNDL display may be the result of incorrect sensor inputs or transmission abuse protection modes being received by the TCM. The following are some of these conditions:

The transfer case is/was in Neutral.
The transfer case is/was shifted into Neutral when the vehicle is moving.
A decrease of the input turbine speed was not detected when the gear selector was moved into any gear.
A low transmission fluid level.
A misadjusted PNP/NSBU switch.
Turbine input speed or output speed sensor failure.
Failures of the shift solenoids to route the transmission oil to the proper clutch assemblies within the transmission.
Failures of the transmission clutch packs (C1 or C5 for first gear, C3 or C5 for Reverse).
Failure to detect proper line pressures when a gear range is selected, which may be the result of normal maintenance such as a transmission fluid change having been completed, or the transmission pan was removed for a filter replacement or other type service.

Transmission abuse protection modes are encountered when a customer performs one of the following types of maneuvers:

Shifting from Neutral to Drive/Reverse when the engine RPM is greater than 1400 RPM.
Shifting from Drive to Reverse when the throttle position (TPS) is greater than 25%, such as rocking the vehicle when stuck in an attempt to free the vehicle.
When the transmission output speed is greater than 300 RPM from attempted changes in direction such as Reverse to Drive, Drive to Reverse or Neutral to Reverse shifts.

When the TCM encounters any one of the above conditions, the TCM will flash the PRNDL and default the transmission to Neutral. A flashing PRNDL indicates something is/was incorrect. The transmission may need the attention of a qualified service technician.

Correction

 

  1. Disconnect the wiring harness from the PNP switch.
  2. Disconnect the shift linkage/cable from the shift lever at the transmission.
  3. With a wrench keeping the shift lever from rotating, remove the nut from the end of the selector shaft.
  4. Use a file to remove any burrs or raised metal where the selector lever was seated against the shoulder of the selector shaft.

    Important: If the old PNP switch will not slide from the selector shaft without the effort, the selector shaft may need to be filed to remove flaring on the end of the selector shaft. This is important, installing the new switch onto a selector shaft that has damage will cause damage to the new PNP switch.

  5. Remove the two bolts that attach the PNP switch and remove the switch by sliding it outward over the selector shaft.
  6. Make sure the selector shaft is in the N (neutral) position (using a wrench on the selector shaft flats, rotate the shaft to its furthest clockwise position and then rotate counterclockwise two detents).
    Object
    Click

    Important: If the new PNP switch will not slide onto the selector shaft easily, the selector shaft may need to be filed to remove flaring on the end of the selector shaft. This is important, installing the new switch onto a selector shaft that has damage will cause damage to the new PNP switch.

  7. Slide the new PNP switch over the selector shaft with the neutral assurance bracket 920 facing outward and maintaining the correct PNP switch orientation to the selector shaft. Install and hand tighten the two PNP switch attaching bolts so that the PNP switch and bracket may be rotated within the adjusting slots with some effort.
  8. While holding the neutral assurance bracket in engagement with the PNP switch, tighten the two bolts that attach the PNP switch to the transmission case.

    Tighten
    Tighten the bolts to 27 N·m (20 lb ft).

  9. Remove and discard the neutral assurance bracket.
    Object
    Click

    Important: Installation of the front shield and rear shields are important. Without proper installation of the shield, a return repair is probable. Follow all directions as listed on the installation instructions sheet included in the Switch kit, P/N 29540479.

  10. Fit the new shield onto the PNP switch so that it fits securely against the switch. Make sure this is done before reinstalling the shift lever.
    Object
    Click
  11. Reinstall the shift lever. With a wrench keeping the shift lever from rotating, install the nut on the end of the selector shaft.

    Tighten.
    Tighten the nut to 24 N·m (18 lb ft).

  12. Connect the wiring harness connectors to the PNP switch.
  13. Attach the selector cable to the lever. Check and adjust if needed.
  14. Go back to step 4 of the Diagnostics and insure the Tech 2 readings match the shift lever positions.

    Important: Clear all DTCs before returning the vehicle to the customer.

  15. Return the vehicle to the customer.

Parts Information

Part Number

Description

29540479

Switch kit, Park Neutral Position

Parts are currently available from GMSPO.



Customer: replied 5 years ago.
I'm sorry but these suggestiions were in the service bulletin. I've replaced the PNP and done the other diagnostics. Unless you guys can think of something else, I'll have to pass. Thanks for trying.
Expert:  Roadside Jerry replied 5 years ago.

Hi, here is another bulletin concerning indicator problems,it points to an ignition switch problem. These switches have been troublesome on these vehicles. I would check that out,if that doesn't solve the problem,the cluster must be your problem. You can get an exhange unit at a good price at http://www.wrwhizzard.com/.

#01-07-30-002E: MIL On, Transmission Stuck in Second or Third Gear, IPC Inoperative, DTCs P0740,P0753,P0758,P0785,P0787,P0973,P0976,P1860,P2761,P2764 and/or P2769 Set (Verify and Repair Source of Voltage Loss - (Sep 23, 2005)

Subject:Malfunction Indicator Lamp (MIL) On, Transmission Stuck in Second or Third Gear, Instrument Cluster Inoperative (Verify and Repair Source of Voltage Loss In Transmission Solenoid Power Supply Circuit )

Models:2006 and Prior GM Passenger Cars and Light Duty Trucks
2005-2006 HUMMER H2
2006 HUMMER H3
2005-2006 Saab 9-7X
with 4L60-E, 4L65-E, 4L80-E or 4L85-E Automatic Transmission (RPOs M30, M32, M33, MT1, MN8)

 


This bulletin is being revised to update model years, add additional models and add additional diagnostic information. Please discard Corporate Bulletin Number 01-07-30-002D (Section 07 -- Transmission/Transaxle).


Condition

Some customers may comment on one or more of the following conditions:

The Malfunction Indicator Lamp (MIL) is ON.
The transmission is defaulted to second gear (4L80/85-E).
The transmission is defaulted to third gear (4L60/65-E).
The instrument cluster is inoperative.

Upon investigation, one or all of the diagnostic trouble codes (DTCs) P0740, P0753, P0758, P0785, P0787, P0973, P0976, P1860, P2761, P2764 and P2769 may be set depending on the vehicle.

Cause

The most likely cause of this condition may be a loss of voltage to the transmission solenoid power supply circuit.

This condition may also be the result of an incorrect installation of an aftermarket electronic device such as a remote starter or alarm system.

Correction

Important: If the vehicle is equipped with an aftermarket electronic device and the DTCs are being set when the device is being used, verify that the appropriate fuse is being supplied battery voltage during operation. If voltage is not present at this fuse, these DTCs will be set due to lack of voltage at the solenoids. This condition is most likely to occur with an incorrectly installed remote starting system. If this is the case, refer the customer to the installer of the system for corrections. ANY REPAIRS DUE TO AFTERMARKET INSTALLATION OF ACCESSORIES IS A NON-WARRANTABLE ITEM.

  1. With the ignition switch in the RUN position, test for battery voltage at the circuit fuse in the transmission solenoid power supply circuit. Refer to the appropriate SI Document for the transmission solenoid power supply circuit information.
  2. If battery voltage is present at the fuse, inspect the ignition voltage circuit between the fuse and the transmission for possible opens.
  3. If battery voltage is not present at the fuse, test for continuity between the fuse and the ignition switch. If NO continuity is between the fuse and the ignition switch, repair the open in that circuit.
  4. If you have continuity between the fuse and the ignition switch, the most likely cause is the ignition switch. Replace the ignition switch using the appropriate Ignition Switch Replacement procedure in SI. Refer to group number 2.188 of the parts catalog for part description and usage of the ignition switch.

Warranty Information (excluding Saab U.S. Models)



Expert:  Roadside Jerry replied 5 years ago.

Hi , another problem may the ignition switch, I would check it out . These switches have a high failure rate and can cause you this problem. If you find this not to be the case,then I would believe the cluster is at fault. You can get a replacement at www.mrwhizard.com

a fair price with good service. I hope this will help you with your problem.Jerry.

 

Expert:  Roadside Jerry replied 5 years ago.

The links I sent may not have worked,here it is should be good,

www.mrwhizard.com

 

here are instructions for removing the cluster,if you need them.

graphic

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