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RSRBOB
RSRBOB, Technician
Category: Boat
Satisfied Customers: 919
Experience:  Former Yamaha Factory Service Rep, Dlr Line Tech, Serv Mgr, G/M
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I have an older 95 Yamaha Wave Raider 1100 PWC, with a new ...

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I have an older 95 Yamaha Wave Raider 1100 PWC, with a new engine by the way. Recently the motor would instantly cut off going down the lake. It would restart immediately and be on the way, when it would stop again. The stoppage was intermintent, and never knew when it would stop. I put it on the lift a week ago, with motor running ok. Yesterday, I tried to start it, but would not start. Checked the spark, but found no spark going to any plug. To start with the instrument panel would light up. After trying to troubleshoot, noted the intrument panel would not even light up. Engine is still turning over, but will not fire. I have no idea what is causing the problem, only knowing that it is an ignition or electrical problem. What is your thinking. Each plug has its own coil, and since I get no spark to any plug, can assume its not the coil. It has what they call a CID unit, magneto etc. Please give me your thoughts on how I can trouble shoot the problem and get it working.
Submitted: 6 years ago.
Category: Boat
Expert:  RSRBOB replied 6 years ago.
Hi Donald,
I do suspect you have a CDI issue, based on exactly what you said. It is common to all three cylinders so it can't be one ignition coil or one pick up coil. It has to be something common to all three.

Before we jump into that, you might want to wiggle the lanyard switch on the handle bar around a little bit before you get too far along. Another thing you can do is unplug the connector that has a black and a white wire in it. That is the engine stop switch on the handle bar and unplugging it bypasses it for the sake of testing. You would not want to ride your wave raider with that unplugged because you would have no way of stopping the engine in an emergency. For the sake of testing spark without the intent of running the engine, it is a valid test that is ok to perform.

Those 1100 engines Yamaha produced were susceptible to electrical failure because of the way they mounted the electrical box on the engine. They absorbed a lot of vibration and created a lot more electrical system failures compared to the remote mounted electrical boxes.

Just in case, here are the resistance specs on the rest of the ignition system.
Ignition coil primary side - Blk/Wht-Blk - 0.48~0.72 Ohms
Secondary B/W to High Tension lead - 2.7k~4.1K Ohms
Pulser coils are all Black to W/Rd, W/Blk, W/Grn - 248~372 Ohms (3 tests, one for each pick up coil, per cylinder)
Peak volts, closed while cranking, 2.4 min.
Charge coil Brn/Blk-Rd 172-258 Ohms


If you have found this information answers your question, please click on the green accept button and leave positive feedback. If you have more quesitons, please feel free to ask.

Thanks,
RSRBOB
RSRBOB, Technician
Category: Boat
Satisfied Customers: 919
Experience: Former Yamaha Factory Service Rep, Dlr Line Tech, Serv Mgr, G/M
RSRBOB and other Boat Specialists are ready to help you
Customer: replied 6 years ago.
Thank you for your reply. I want to check out some things before finalizing your report. If I understand you, you basically feel the problem lies in the CDI unit, unless one of the switches are bad. You basically feel it could be the CDI rather than pulser coil not given any spark, or magneto is that correct?   As we have a manual for the 1100, my son worked on the problem but could not resolve it. I am sdding his comments so we can maybe diagnose it better. His Comments: how can you determine if the CDI is BAD. Why would the display quit working? We thought maybe the “thermo switch” maybe was bad or going bad (If the thermo switch thinks the engine is hot will it prevent the engine from cranking?) and so we disconnected the Pink wire coming from the thermo switch in the electrical box and tried cranking the engine. The display was working and after one or two cranks with the Pink wire disconnected, the display quit working -- Why? Could the battery be too weak to power the display (I don’t think this would be the case since the battery was still turning the engine over good)? Your comments were certainly helpful and with your expertise would appreciate some additional comments concerning the above comments.
XXXXX XXXXX
Expert:  RSRBOB replied 6 years ago.

Hey Don,

Thanks for the additional information.

The overheat sensor only limits peak RPM. It is what they call a "return to port" feature where it will continue to run and not leave you stranded at sea. Unlike a motorcycle where you can get off and walk, such is not the case with a watercraft so they have to include a return to port feature. So even if the overheat sensor has completely failed, the engine will start and run, but not exceed 3500 RPM's.

The meter is turned on by the stator producing an AC signal on one wire to the display. At this point, I don't suspect the meter is causing the no spark issue and tend to lean towards getting the engine running and see if the meter operates normally once the engine actually starts.

If you want to get some idea of the battery condition, do a voltage drop test on the battery. Connect your DC volt meter to the battery and hit the starter button. Read the volts it gets pulled down to. It should not drop below 10 DCV.

I was agreeing with your assessment that more than likely it is the CDI because you have no spark on any plugs. If it were no spark on one out of three, then we would look for something unique to that one cylinder. Considering it is all 3, we start thinking about what is common to all three that could cause the problem. Although it is improbable that all 3 pickups or ignition coils failed, it is possible. Check the charge coil too. It looks like that is common as well.

I have seen engine stop switches create issues as well. As previously stated, unplugging that is the best way to test it. If you get spark with the black & white wires disconnected (under hood), the start stop switch is bad. You can take it apart and inspect it and decide if it is salvagable or not.

To directly address the issue on the CDI, it is almost a process of elimination, If you have everything else on both sides of the CDI checking out OK, it doesn't leave many options. You can put a test light in the leads out of the CDI going to the coils, which would be Orange, Wht/Blk, and Yel/Blk (one at a time) and spin the engine over. If the light flashes, you probably have enough CDI output to fire the coils. Yamaha does give a peak voltage spec of 95.5 closed if you have a peak reading volt meter. The test light is pretty darn reliable as an alternative.

You can check the CDI output going to the primary sides of the coils, but beyond that, it becomes academic. It is not user servicable so if it isn't sparking, it needs to be replaced. There used to be after market CDI boxes available for it. I don't know if they are still available or not. Usually after market is less expensive than OEM.

One other thing I remembered too is if you end up replacing the CDI, make sure you get the updated bracket that has a stay that links the Electrical box to the cylinder/head assy. to help prevent some of the vibration related issues. They used to have a kit to update the early 1100's that came without them, and the later 1100's came from the factory with the stay equipped bracket. The bracket I am talking about is the chrome bracket that the high tension spark plug leads pass through. Just take a look at it and see if it has a leg that T's off of it and bolts to the cyl/head assy. If it does, you are ok! If not, it is worth updating it out of your pocket so you don't eat another CDI, or eat the first one if that is not is what the current problem is.

Another one last thing, Cool, I also remember a tech bulletin Yamaha put out on the 1100 CDI boxes. They had a small zip tie around a bunch of wires right where they exited the CDI box. The bulletin said this put too much tension on those wires and could cause a failure (broken wire internally) so if you replaced the CDI box, DO NOT replace the zip tie. Also, if you do have to replace the CDI box, I strongly suggest taking some digital pictures of the wiring as you find it. It comes apart in about 3 steps and I would take pictures of the wires at each step so you layer them back in the way they came out. If you haven't seen them yet, you are going to be astonished and impressed at how many wires the factory could get into a very small area.

Thanks,

RSRBOB

RSRBOB, Technician
Category: Boat
Satisfied Customers: 919
Experience: Former Yamaha Factory Service Rep, Dlr Line Tech, Serv Mgr, G/M
RSRBOB and other Boat Specialists are ready to help you
Customer: replied 6 years ago.
Thanks Bob, Good Job!
I apprciate your help

XXXXX XXXXX
Expert:  RSRBOB replied 6 years ago.
Don,
You are welcome, it has been my pleasure.
Thanks,
Bob
Customer: replied 6 years ago.
NEED MORE HELP:
After performing some diagnostics with my son we have found that the plugs are firing and that the fuel pump is not pumping fuel (no fuel coming out of fuel pump while attempting to crank engine (fuel is getting to the input of the pump). Upon inspecting the pump, the diaphragms and check-valves appear to be good (no fuel passing out of the vacuum port and vacuum holds -- does not leak down and fuel does not flow out of the fuel input port).

Question: What is the cause of the Fuel Pump not pumping?
The vacuum/pulser seems weak coming from the crankcase. Does the nipple coming off of the crankcase have a check-valve or is it suppose to be a clear tube (i.e. wondering if it could be clogged up)? Or can the Diaphragm in the fuel become stretched to the point that the vacuum/pulser can't move it enough to make it pump? Other important notes/questions: 1) We have found a spring and some rubber components that look like they might be part of an oil seal that has come apart (perhaps from the rear of the crankcase). A new engine short block was put in last year when the oil injection pump failed without indication damaging the original engine. Could this cause the Vacuum/Pulser to not pressurize if the seal is damaged/missing? 2) Vent Check-Valve on Fuel Tank appears not to be working (tank becoming pressurized and under vacuum if Fuel Cap is sealed. Can this condition damage the Fuel Pump and stretch its diaphragm to the point the crankcase vacuum/pulser can't pump the fuel? I have had the Fuel Filler Cap off when trying to crank the engine during these tests.
Expert:  RSRBOB replied 6 years ago.
Hi Don,
I would take a real close look at your rear main seal. It is right in front of the aluminum coupler coming out the back of the engine. It it looks like the smaller diameter around the shaft is polished, reach down and see if the outer seal isnt hanging on the coupler.
Not having rear main seals would definitely drop the crankcase pressure and vacuum potential.

The fuel tank holding pressure is normal. It is not designed to bleed off excess pressure, just let atmospheric pressure into the tank. You will notice on that valve in the tank vent line there is an arrow pointing in the direction it flows air.
Let me know!
Thanks
RSRBOB
Customer: replied 6 years ago.
Thanks for your prompt reply.
After writing you the first note, we did indeed find the back oil seal loose, and the seal metal mangled around the shaft. What could cause this? Is this a part of the block with Improper installation with bad alignment into the block at the factory or would this be done by the mechanic when putting in the new motor etc. Now the big question. To replace the seals, does the motor have to be pulled? As it is a relative new motor, this shouldn't be happening and I guess I am trying to determine who and what caused the problem. Your comments to these questions would be appreciated.
XXXXX XXXXX
Expert:  RSRBOB replied 6 years ago.
The rear main seals are forced out by hydrolocking. Somone at some time had the engine either full of water or full of gas and when the piston came down, the liquid had no where to go and pushed the seals out the back.
Yes, the engine has to come out and the cases have to be split to install the main seals. They have lips on them that engage the cases and hold them in place. While you have it out, you should take a very close look at the crank to see if it needs to be replaced as well. You don't want to do that job twice if you can avoid it.
Thanks,
RSRBOB
Customer: replied 6 years ago.
Thanks Bob for your help. Now to get it fixed. I keep pouring money into an old boat, and I wondering if its worth it! Good Job.

Don
Expert:  RSRBOB replied 6 years ago.
Don,
That is something you are going to have to decide. A lot of that depends on how much of the work you can do yourself. Water craft engines, well, yours, are not that difficult to work with being a 2 stroke. If it were one of the new 4 cyl 4 strokes, it would be a different story. I personally like the Raider hull, although it is quirky, it is fast. The engines made pretty good power too. I will leave the decision up to you.
It has been nice working with you.
Thanks again,
BOB
Customer: replied 6 years ago.
Hello RSRBOB,
I Am wriiting a question concerning the problems with My 95 Yamaha Wave Raider 1100 as mentioned above. To make things short, I had a technician take out the motor and replace the 2 back seals by disassemblying the two halves of the engine. When the engine was disassembled no water or fuel was found in the crankshaft area that could have caused the seals to blow. He reasssembled the engine, and cranked it up and ran well for 5 minutes or so, until it cut off itself. To the experienced technician's astonishment he discovers that the seals are blown again!! After conferring with SBT (Short Block Manufacturer), and telling them that there was certainly no water or fuel in the crankshaft area after reassembling, SBT informed him that the only other possible cause was an undetectable Backfire caused by uncorrect timing, from the CDI unit (SBT saying CDI faulty). Is it possible for a CDI to produce incorrect timing? If so, is there a way to test for this to determine if CDI is a fault? I understand that CDI is an expensive part, and if you could tell me where I could possible secure a refurbished one or a used one. Do you believe my problem could be The CDI unit, as I had never heard that Before, and SBT seemed adamant that was the problem and they would blow again if the CDI was not replaced. Need your professional input.
Thanks XXXXX
Expert:  RSRBOB replied 6 years ago.
Don,
SBT gave you bad information. If you think about the process of combustion in a 2 stroke, you can understand why what they told you is impossible.
First of all, any ignition occurs above the piston, once the ports are closed, therefore the bottom end is sealed off from the combustion and the pressure it creates. Also, the piston has to be close to Top Dead Center in the stroke to create enough compression to fire the fuel mixture. If the spark occurs so early or late that the piston is not around TDC, it does not have enough compression to ignite the mixture so it would not even fire.
I also would not expect you to find water in the bottom end when you went to replace the seals after having been blown the first time. You had the engine running yourself and whoever ingested the water had to get it out so it would start and run at all. They will not run with water in the bottom end. It gets transferred up through the ports into the combustion chamber and prevents combustion.
I suspect whoever replaced the seals for you short cut the job and put them in without splitting the cases. Normally, due to the lip around the outside of the seal that fits into a machined groove inside the cases, you can not put them in from the outside, like some seals. They wont fit. Effectively the OD of the seal is bigger than the bore for it because of this lip that is designed to hold it. Unfortunately, the only thing I can imagine is they were improperly installed. Either the outer lip was ground off the seals to install them without splitting the cases or they were installed incorrectly. The cases have to be split and the crank lifted to replace the seals. Take a flash light and look at the seal that is blown out now on the crank. Look to see if the lip is there or not.
I have never seen or heard of an immediate repeat failure like you experienced. The design is just too solid to fail like that. The seals won't survive that hydraulic pressure of water but they will more than withstand any pressures generated by the engine under normal operation. Water does not compress, the fuel air mixture does compress, therefore not generating the pressure that solid water does.
Thanks
RSRBOB
Customer: replied 6 years ago.
Hello Bob, Thanks for your reply. I am still at a loss as what to do with the Yamaha. The tech told me beforehand that the motor would have to come out. He, indeed, lifted it out and split the case and installed the new seals. He was absolutely suprised, and he now does not know how to fix the problem, and I do not know what to do, either. He has done many PWC, and he says that he has never had a problem like this. SBT tells him, that they will blow again if the CDI is not replaced. If he installs them again (with additional charge over and above what I already owe him), then perhaps the same thing will happen. He swears that they were installed correctly with the ridges in the correct slot etc. pointed outward toward the back. Also, the new SBT Motor had come with new seals already installed, and they blew out as I mentioned. I am at a complete loss as what to do. I would like to have my boat fixed, but do not know what it takes to get that done. Your explanation about the impossibility of CDI causing the problem makes sense. On the other hand, I have read where timing could cause a backfire and cause the seals to come out. And the CDI is the only thing that controls the timing.
Expert:  RSRBOB replied 6 years ago.
Donald,
I empathize with your situation. I know how frustrating that position can be. Conflicting opinions from supposed experts.
I will have to leave that decision making process up to you. I can absolutely say that for the 8 years I was a Yamaha service rep, which was while the Raiders were current, I never saw a CDI cause the rear main seals to blow out. I am in Florida, which had the largest Yamaha Water Vehicle dealer in the world at the time, and I was their tech rep. Not that that directly means anything about me, just that I had a lot more exposure to problems and failures than any other tech rep in the country due solely to the volume of units that came in and out of their service department. I just do not remember ever having a defective CDI being given as the cause for rear main seal failure.

As far as SBT, they are a company that rebuilds water craft engines. They take broken parts and replace them with their parts and ship them back out. Their area of expertise is not diagnosis and repair of water vehicles. Although I am sure they mean well, personally I don't consider them a great source of information when it comes to engine repairs and root cause analysis. It just isn't what they do. Suffice to say people do not routinely bring water craft to them for diagnosis and repair. As far as I know, they do not even have any service facilities. I do know they pressure test their engines before shipping but that is about it. And that only prevents air leaks and failures that they would be responsible for. Its a way for them to minimze their comebacks on their warranty.
There are a few other factors that could affect timing, and actually, on a Raider being an analog ignition, utilizes individual pick up coils for the ignition which makes it even harder to believe the CDI theory. If it had a digital ignition, it would be a different story. The CDI advances the timing, which again does not coincide with backfiring and blowing crank seals.
Did the tech say it back fired and blew them out? Backfiring is much more often caused by carb issues than CDI issues. I am trying to make sense of SBT's explanation but for the life of me I can not imagine any scenario that would support their theory. I will stop short of saying it is virtually impossible, but I would have to see it to believe it.
I wish you well. If I come up with any more info, I will pass it along to you!
RSRBOB
Customer: replied 6 years ago.
Hello Bob, Thanks for your quick response. Have talked to the Technician a while ago, and he is still in amazement why the seals blew. He said there was absolutely no water or anything in the crank area, when he cranked the motor. It IDLED for about 30-40 seconds, with no increase in RPMs and then died after this short period of time, and finding the seals blowed. Doesn't this blow your mind!!! I have discussed with him about the fallacy of SBT's theory that the problem was with the CDI, and the impossibilities that are entailed in their explanation. The tech says that there was nothing else that could cause the problem, as there was absolutely no water, and the seals were installed correctly. Of course, I was not there during installation, and have to take his word. Evidently there is something that I do not know that has happened to cause this. Either the Engine was defective, or something happened during installation (either knowingly or unknowlingly) that caused it. Would appreciate some further comments in this regard, if you have any further info.
Thanks,
Don
Expert:  RSRBOB replied 6 years ago.
Donald.
RIght now you can see the seals, if he has not done anything since they blew the second time. Take a look at them and see if the raised lip is on the engine side of the seal or the pump side.
I am not trying to slam the tech, I don't know him and believe you when you say he has a history of doing good work. However, this is exactly the kind of problem I dealt with when I was with Yamaha. A dealer couldn't fix a problem, and could make no sense of the failure, and I would go in and assist on the repair.
My response to the engine being defective would be, how many hours are on the unit now? If there were a defect in the engine, it would not take from 1995 to 2008 for that defect to show up. Unless it had not been started prior to 2008, then there is a REMOTE possibility that could be the case.
Now I wonder if the tech greased the seals or used silicone sealer or some other product on the outer edges of the seals with the intent to "help" it seal better.
If you talk to him again, ask him this question in this way "Did you put anything on the outer edges of the seals when you installed them?" I don't want to give him any direction on what might be the correct answer so ask it as an open ended question. The correct answer should be, NO, I did not put anything on the outer edges of the seals. It is ok to put grease on the inner edges of the seals where the crank will be spinning, but not on the outer.
Let me know!
I am going to look around my spare parts and see if I have a CDI box for an 1100. If I do, I will ship it to you to try...... fair enough? I am only 50/50 on whether I still have one or not, so don't get your hopes up too high!
Thanks
RSRBOB
Customer: replied 6 years ago.
Hello Bob,
Appreciate your comments. Hope you do have a CDI box available for a 1100 in your spare parts. That would be great. Just a clarification on my comment concerning a defective engine. My original engine lasted from 95 to 2006, when the oil pump went bad, and caused one piston to go bad. I had a new Engine from SPT installed in 2006. As it was late summer of 2006, the new engine was run very little, and very little in 2007 due to various levels, but was also a break in period. This year, 2008, we had some problems with the New Engine cutting off abruptly, but would start back up. We only had about 15 hours on the new engine when we discovered the seals were out. Now, this engine blows out the seals again. So that leads me to believe that we might have had a defective engine---I wasn't talking about the original engine, as the seals never came out on that engine. In talking with the tech, he did not use any sealer on the outside of the seals. In reading some comments on SBT web forum, SBT technical Support states that it is a good idea to reseal the seals with "yamabond, threebond 1211, or permatex "the right stuff". I am copying the following from the forum dated 5/01/06:
#1    09-01-2005, 07:17 PM
sotoflex
Breaking it in   Joined: Aug 2004
From: New Jersey
Posts: 5

Blew out rear crank seal on SBT motor

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

SBT motor, less than a year old and the seals are both out.
Do i send the motor back or try and do it myself...
Has anybody done rear seals and if so, what is involved.
According to the manual, you have to remove engine, pull the bottom crank case apart. What kind of bond is used to put the crank case back together?


sotoflex
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#2    09-01-2005, 08:38 PM
Technical Support
Administrator   Joined: Mar 2003
From: SBT
Posts: 18,445

Re: Blew out rear crank seal on SBT motor

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Unfortunately the Yamaha 1200non-pv and 1100 motors are somewhat susceptible to blowing out those rear seals under certain circumstanses. This is usually any sort of liquid in the rear of the case, like water or fuel. It only takes a little bit, to hydrolock and blow them out. A backfire can also very easily so it.


As far as repair yes you have to pull the engine, split the cases and reseal everything with yamabond, threebond 1211, or permatex "The Right Stuff". If you are still under warranty we would be happy to give you another block, just call in. Doing it yourself might be a little faster, but I doubt you will be pressure testing the block, and you will then have no further waranty.
__________________

Hope the above can give you a better insight of my problem. Would appreciate some comments if you have a "brainstorm" of how to fix my Yamaha. It would be great if you find you have a spare CDI. Looking forward to hearing from you.
Thanks,
Don
Expert:  RSRBOB replied 6 years ago.
Donald,
Thank you for the additional information.
In reading what SBT said, it looks like they are saying the Yamabond is for sealing the cases, which is 100% accurate.
I have no idea where they are getting the opinion that 1100 and 120 Non power valve motors have a history or blowing crank seals.
The other totally erroneous statement they make is it only takes a little water or fuel to hydrolock and blow the seals.
That is total and complete malarky, and of course I am going to tell you why!
Each individual cylinder displaces about 366 cc's, give or take a few, but close enough for the sake of this discussion.
The crankcase volume has to exceed that cylinder volume because you have the volume of the cases that house the flywheels for the crank plus the volume of the cylinder below the piston as it travels upwards. You would need sufficient volume of a liquid, which in this case is considered a solid and not compressable, to fill the crank case below the piston completely, then have the piston come down to increase the hydraulic pressure to the point of generating enough force to blow the seals out the back. I have never actually measured how much fluid it would take to achieve that failure , but am willing to guess, based on taking engines apart that were full of water, it would be at least 12 oz, if not more. In reading their post, it sounded like they were insinuating mere drops of water or un-atomized fuel was enough to blow the seals. It just isnt so.
I did not consider the possibility that the engine was an SBT rebuilt unit. That certainly enters a huge question mark into the equation. The last dealer I was at quit using SBT because we had a 75% failure rate on their engines. They would warranty them, but the customers would have to pay us again to remove the old blown engine and re-install the new replacement warranty engine, at about 8 hrs labor. Although they didn't like it, SBT warrantied the engine, not the labor and the failure was not a result of workmanship installing the engine so we had no responsibility to do the engine exchange for free. Our tech deserved to get paid since he did nothing wrong, as did the shop for the same reason. As they also said, if you open the engine for any reason, you have voided your warranty, so we never knew why they failed, we just knew they did.
I will look Sunday or monday for that CDI for you, and we can take it from there.
Did you get a chance to look at the seals to see if they were installed properly?
Thanks
RSRBOB
Customer: replied 6 years ago.
Hello Bob,
Thanks for your comments. In answer to your questio. No, I have not looked at the seals that came out after the 30 second run. The Tech is in Winston Salem, NC, about 30 miles away, so I haven't seen them since he called. At the present time, everything is on hold, and I told him to hold pat until I determine what to do. He maintains that he installed the seals with the ridge towards the rear, and knows nothing that he did wrong in the installation. He said if we decide to fix the Yamaha, that we will have to two new seals, that he would not use the old ones. He can't tell a whole lot about them as the motor is still installed. Will wait for you comments later when checking on the CDI.
Thanks,
Don
Expert:  RSRBOB replied 6 years ago.
So am I to understand he just tried to re-install the old seals that had alredy blown out? Please tell me he didn't do that..........................
If he did, its no wonder they blew out again. The retaining lip would be damaged from coming out the first time and would definitely not hold after that.
RSRBOB
Customer: replied 6 years ago.
Oh no, I did not mean to confuse you. The seals that blew out after 30 second run were new seals. In trying to determine what would be the costs etc if he pulled the engine aagain, after they blew in 30 Seconds, I asked probably a stlupid question, if we needed new seals if I asked him to pull the motor again and put seals back in.    That is when he told me yes we would have to have two more new seals, to replace the two new seals that lasted 30 seconds. I thought perhaps there was an engine defect that did not have proper groove for the seals to fit in. and since the 30 second run was the 2nd set to blow out of the SBT engine. He said everything looked ok with the grooves etc, and the flanges on the seals were ok.
Thanks
Don
Expert:  RSRBOB replied 6 years ago.
OK, being its SBT, anything is possible.
Customer: replied 6 years ago.
Hello Bob,
I have been awaiting to reply to see if you found a CDI unit that you said you would check on Sumday or Monday if you had one. Did you find one in your Spare parts?
Don


Expert:  RSRBOB replied 6 years ago.

HI Don,

Still looking. Give me till Saturday!

Thanks

Bob

Customer: replied 6 years ago.
Hello Bob,
Haven't heard from you lately. I am still trying to decide what I Need to do to fix my yamaha. I have talked to a lot of people, and they agree with you, that there is basically no way the CDI unit could cause the Seals to come out. Some of them agrees that bad timing could cause the problem. I have a Yamaha 1100 Service Manual, and there is absolutely nothing that I can find that tells me about timing. So, how do you set the timing on the Yamaha?? The CDI unit may not be the problem, but would like to know if you are still looking for one in your spare parts, and what I need to do to check the timing. The technician has now taken the SBT engine back out of my Yamaha, put in new seals, and reinstalled the engine. He tells me now that it is ready to go, but he will not even try to crank the engine, because SBT has told him that the seals would come out again unless The CDI unit was changed. So, what do I do now??
I am just about convinced that the CDI unit is NOT the problem, as Riva Motorsports says the CDI Unit works, or not works. They did say that timing could be the problem--but I can find nothing about how to check or set the timing. Would appreciate your comments in regards XXXXX XXXXX above questions, and give your professional opinion etc.
Thanks,
XXXXX XXXXX
Expert:  RSRBOB replied 6 years ago.

Donald,

I did not have a CDI box, must have given them all away.

The timing is set with the pulser coils on the flywheel. I seriously doubt there is enough leeway in them to create an issue of backfiring.

Good to know these people agree with me!

I think at this point, we can check the timing dynamically with the spark plugs removed. Just make a mark on the coupler at TDC and use a mark on the cases as a reference. Take the plugs out and lay them on the head in the spark plug leads. Crank the engine over and see if it is firing anywhere in the vicinity of TDC. If it is, I think SBT is full of sht. :) Just a little humor there....... no offense intended. If it is off more than 10 degrees one way or the other from TDC, then we need to take a closer look. Being a gambling man, I am willing to place a strong wager that you are going to find the timing is A OK!

Let me know!

Thanks

RSRBOB

RSRBOB, Technician
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