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Phillips Esq.
Phillips Esq., Attorney-at-Law
Category: Bankruptcy Law
Satisfied Customers: 12809
Experience:  B.A.; M.B.A.; J.D.
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if i had a bill from a treatment center and i got a insurance

Customer Question

if i had a bill from a treatment center and i got a insurance check in my name, and cashed it. and kept the money rather then paying the bill and filed bankrupcty chapter 7 would this be illegal.
Submitted: 1 year ago.
Category: Bankruptcy Law
Expert:  cfortunato replied 1 year ago.

cfortunato :

Hi - my name is XXXXX XXX I'm a Bankruptcy and Consumer Protection attorney here to assist you.

cfortunato :

Was the check from the insurance company made payable to you alone or was it made payable to you and to the treatment center?

Customer :

it had my name and a claim number on it thats it. nothing on there of there name

Customer :

i have the money and can give to them, but would rather not. if its legal for me to keep it

Customer :

the treatment center is in michigan and i live in minnesota i dont know if that makes a difference

cfortunato :

Thank you for your response.

cfortunato :

If the insurance company check was made payable to you alone, it would not be illegal for you to cash the check and to keep the money.

cfortunato :

Under those circumstances, you are not legally obligated to pay the money you receive from your insurance company to the treatment center.

cfortunato :

This is the reason that most medical and treatment centers process insurance claims themselves instead of letting their patients process them.

Customer :

so this would not be considered insurance fraud, at all, and they cannot sue me?

Customer :

understandable as to why patients are left "out" of the billing process.

Customer :

i received this check because the treatment center was out of my insurance providers network, so they gave the check to me. but i had already filed chapter 7, with the full amount of the bill under my creditors.

cfortunato :

Keeping the insurance money would not be insurance fraud, which is basically something that can happen only when an insurance company is defrauded - not a medical or treatment center.

cfortunato :

If the treatment center was included in your Bankruptcy, it would be illegal for the treatment center to try to collect the money from you - regardless of the fact that you received money that was supposed to be sent to them - as this would be a violation of the automatic stay (if your Bankruptcy case is still in progress), and it would be contempt of court if your Bankruptcy case has already been discharged and/or closed.

Customer :

k so since im in bankruptcy and i have had my meeting of creditors and nobody showed up for it can this person still harrass me or mess up my bankruptcy

cfortunato :

Since that creditor did not try to contest the discharge of their debt, there is nothing further that the creditor can do.

Customer :

k so there harrassment is ilegal and i can tell them to leave me alone and respect my rights?

Customer :

my bankruptcy is now fully closed till august 17

Customer :

not*

cfortunato :

Whether or not you have already received your discharge, it is illegal for this person to try to collect this money from you.

Customer :

k thankyou very much

Customer :

k i told the guy to leave me alone and he chewed me out told me i was dumb and said he was going to sue me

cfortunato : You're welcome!
cfortunato : It really sounds as if this person is just angry they did not get paid and there is nothing they can do about it.
Customer :

are you a 110% certain that im not doing anything illegal?

Customer :

do you have a degree in lawyering, sorry im just trying to cover all the bases cause i dont want to be introuble

cfortunato :

I am 100% certain that you are not doing anything illegal by not paying the treatment center.

cfortunato :

Yes - I have a JD (Juris Doctor) degree, which is the official name for a lawyer's degree. Having a JD degree is a requirement to provide answers on this website.

cfortunato :

In other words, all of the attorneys on this website have JD degrees.

Customer :

so after getting this money after filing bankruptcy. and i have not told the bankruptcy trustee about it, and i filed on my own is that illegal. do i have to report different income to them after filing?

cfortunato :

I will have to opt out of this question so that someone else can help you further.

Expert:  Phillips Esq. replied 1 year ago.
Thank you for giving me the opportunity to assist you. Kindly use CONTINUE or REPLY button to ask for clarification or follow-up questions.


A different Professional here. Before I can address you final question, I need to know the following:

When did you file for bankruptcy protection?

 

When did you receive the payment from the insurance company?

Customer: replied 1 year ago.

i filed bankruptcy in may sometime, the creditors meeting was june 17, it will be final august 17. and i got my insurance check in mail sometime in june

Expert:  Phillips Esq. replied 1 year ago.

Thank you for the information. Your questions:



so after getting this money after filing bankruptcy. and i have not told the bankruptcy trustee about it, and i filed on my own is that illegal.

Response 1: It is not illegal if you did not know that you were going to be getting the check before you filed for bankruptcy protection. Thus, the check would not be considered property of the bankruptcy estate and there is no duty to report it to the Trustee. See 11 U.S. C. Section 541 especially subsections (a)(5) and (a)(7)


http://doney.net/bkcode/11usc0541.htm

do i have to report different income to them after filing?

Response 2: No.

Customer: replied 1 year ago.

k not to be the pain in the ass but im just worried trying to get the right answer. another attorney told me if i dont report new inheritance or money to trustee that would be bankruptcy fraud. i filed in mn and did it mn excemptions. are you a 100% positive?

Expert:  Phillips Esq. replied 1 year ago.

You only report inheritance that you had interest in and received within 180 days of the bankruptcy filing. You report all interest received after the filing of the bankruptcy petition. If you received inheritance after 180 days of filing, you are under no duty to report it. As for your claim check, the check technically is not yours because it was for your treatment. Based on the information that you have provided here, the claim check is not property of the bankruptcy estate. The claim check belonged to your health care provider. For more information, you need to review 11 U.S. C. Section 541 especially subsections (a)(5) and (a)(7)


http://doney.net/bkcode/11usc0541.htm

Customer: replied 1 year ago.

so basically i have to give that money to him


 

Expert:  Phillips Esq. replied 1 year ago.
Who is "him?"
Customer: replied 1 year ago.

the treatment center, it was out of network from my insurance company. so my insurance company gave me a check with only my name on it and a claim number

Expert:  Phillips Esq. replied 1 year ago.
Yes, you really do to steer out of trouble with the bankruptcy Trustee.
Customer: replied 1 year ago.

so if i kept it i would have to report it to the trustee

Expert:  Phillips Esq. replied 1 year ago.
Yes, you do. See 11 U.S.C. Section 541(a)(7):

http://doney.net/bkcode/11usc0541.htm
Customer: replied 1 year ago.

so if i called the treatment center and tryed to make a deal with him on paying part of the money back and canceling the rest of the debt would this some how mess up my bankruptcy


 

Expert:  Phillips Esq. replied 1 year ago.

so if i called the treatment center and tryed to make a deal with him on paying part of the money back and canceling the rest of the debt would this some how mess up my bankruptcy

 


Response: Yes, it would in a nutshell. You should not be negotiating with any creditor listed on your bankruptcy schedule to "cancel" its debt because the creditor's debt would be wiped out upon your receipt of the Bankruptcy Discharge Order. There is nothing to negotiate. Again, the claim check is not your check and it is therefore not part of the bankruptcy estate.

 

 

This is my final response to your post.

Customer: replied 1 year ago.
Ended conversation without fully answering my questions and concerns, there was to experts with 2 different answers. I am more confused now then before I asked the question

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